$7000+ eBay Scam, could hit all mailbox/vault services (COMC/SMC/PSA Fanatics Vault)

[BigAl83]

Originally Posted by auctionjmm

Didn't take me long to cross reference your listing and find this guy's name, address, DOB, and IG account. 100% positive feedback and seems to sell a lot of high-end cards and bullion.

I think at this point you would also have to consider if the theft happened in transit. A USPS employee or even someone at COMC could have put the sticker over the address and swiped it out. I suppose there is a first time for everything, but an 18-year eBay account with great feedback and a guy that is clearly not hiding from the internet and actively posting on IG using his real name would really have me wondering about those other possibilities.

I will say, it is odd he won't at least respond to your message, but if the card truly was stolen in transit, he may think you are the scammer and deciding to ignore you.

I'm really sorry this happened. If you decide to contact law enforcement, just consider this scam could have occurred in any one of these 3 locations. Wouldn't be the first time a USPS employee was stealing near a popular shipping destination for collectibles.

It has crossed my mind that that you sometimes hear stories about a package being opened by postal workers and contents being stolen.

But i have never heard that they would then go out of their way to cover up part of the adress (comc username). My question is, what do they have to gain by that? The only person benefiting from covering up this specific part of the adress is the seller.
A usps employee couldn't care less if i start a claim/return within 1 day or 10 days, he didn't sell the card and ultimately isn't financially responsible for it.

Within a few hours the seller declined the return, but only late last night (3 days later), i got a short reply on my question on how he will fix this matter of a wrong card being send.
The one sentence reply:

There is no way that I would make a mistake like that.

Sounds really remorseful and understanding. Even if you have no intention of fixing this and thinking it got stolen during transit, you could show some empathy. I know i would, i would feel responsible if i had shipped the wrong card, or the card being replaced by a postal worker.

With all the hundreds of packages probably being delivered at COMC every day, how could a usps worker know to single out my package holding this valuable card and take the contents, luck of the draw? (i don't buy that)

I was to excited and gullible after having to opportunity to own a card like this, that i didn't care to look any closer (that one definitely is on me, and hard lesson learned!). But now afterwards i see a few more red flags. The card picture is only of the front, and both the serial number and BGS number are tough to decipher, almost all of the other listings have way better pictures and most of them also include multiple fronts and backs.
I made an offer slightly below last comps, and it got accepted pretty quickly without making any counter offer (my first offer was accepted).

If it ends up being stolen by someone else i'm the first one to make a huge apology to this seller, but my gut feeling and all evidence to me says otherwise.

[BigAl83]

Originally Posted by wilsonsingles

time to get local and feds involved, as this is clearly mail fraud at a high level.

I would, but i just don't know where to start. I live in the Netherlands (Europe), which is one of the main reasons i use COMC.
It makes it much more difficult to get a case started with local police or feds.

Originally Posted by imbluestreak23

eBay should 100% be called out for that. That rep, their manager, their manager's director, all the way up to the CEO should split hell wide open for sucking at life.

I'd be pissed to no end

Yep, i'm definitely mad, but also realize there is nothing i can do with eBay. They just don't care and they made it perfectly clear they don't want to put in any effort, so i have no illusions that a rep or manager will get involved.
It really sucks they have a monopoly like this and can get away with stuff like this.

Originally Posted by mjohnatgt

EBay is correct that any location/vault service you send to voids the ability to return the card. Why did the card not go through Authenticity Guarantee program?

Honestly i haven't used it that much, and almost all of my cards i buy are in the $20 - $750 range. But that's another lesson learned, never going to buy anything over $1000 that doesn't go through this service.

Originally Posted by orion9578

Did you pay with a credit card? I read through most of it but might have missed that part. If you did, file a chargeback with your credit card company for fraud. They should side with you.

What a ridiculous response from eBay, start to finish. Obvious fraud.

Nope, have my bank account set up with my eBay account, could check with my bank, but not holding my breath on that one.

Originally Posted by boxbuster7

this is some high level stuff

so just to confirm the seller is the one pulling off this scam?

Yep, this one seems to be really thought through and exactly knowing how the rules work and making them work to your advantage.
With everything i have found out, to me it seems like the seller is pulling of this scam yes, i have seen (or heard from comc) nothing that proves otherwise. But i can't prove it with 100% certainty.

Originally Posted by mjohnatgt

It voids the Authenticity Guarantee, not the return. I was responding to multiple posts without quoting them, my bad.

Mailing to a non-home address voids the return, based on eBay policy, because the 3rd party could be the culprit. That has been their policy for decades.

But wouldn't this then also apply to their own eBay-PSA vault service? It also sends an item i bought to a 3rd party and thus voiding any return/claim policy.

Originally Posted by ninjacookies

Seems Ebay's really sticking to the 'outside the 3 day return window' clause on this one. Are we absolutely, 100% sure the outcome would have been the same if the buyer had opened his claim within the allotted timeframe? Feels like Ebay's basically unwilling to listen to the particulars of your case because you waited a tad bit too long.

I'd be interested to know if there were similar cases with the same outcome that were filed within the 72 hour deadline.

In any case, this really sucks. And that's why I never used 3rd parties to facilitate high end transactions, even though they should technically be safe. That extra layer of handling doesn't wear well on my nerves.

Yeah it seems like they are just fed up with me not letting this slide. But in all honesty i think i have been very polite, and trying to stick to actual facts and providing evidence to support my case. That is the most frustrating part, it almost makes it look like i'm the scammer here.

The post by aschade does seem to suggest, that if you submit within the 72 hour window they tend to automatically side with the buyer.
It makes you think that they don't even want to actually hear the story or complaint all together. Within 72 hours, automatically siding with the buyer, after 72 hours, automatically siding with the seller.

Which is my main reason i want to warn everyone else, because a simple cover up of your username for any of these mailbox services will be enough to put you outside the 3-day return window, and eBay will just don't care and side with the seller, even though all the signs of a deliberate act of fraud are right in front of them.

Originally Posted by blackvodka

Buying high-end has just become way too risky. I try and avoid cards over $750 simply because I got into this hobby to enjoy it, not be miserable.

That authenticity guarantee in my opinion was implemented so sellers could just send it there to try and limit this garbage from both sides.

Personally, I think it's wild to list a 7k card and then throw in a $40 card into the mail, but here we are.

Sent from my motorola razr 2024 using Tapatalk

Yep lessons learned on this one. No more high-end buying on eBay (unless the authenticity program is being used), i will stick to the lower value stuff or try and find stuff on more protected platforms.

[Sonnys88]

Sorry that this is happening to you.

Just based on the evidence provided this seems like a case of the seller committing fraud.

Your COMC username deliberately covered up on the label, only one blurry photo of the card provided on the eBay listing, seller not responding to your messages other than a simple denial of sending the wrong card, and COMC confirming what card was actually received.

There are too many variables there that all lead back to the seller. COMC handles thousands of mailbox submissions every week. They are not going to risk the reputation of their company for a 7k card. And most likely have cameras recording the opening of all packages.

And as you already stated, the odds of a USPS employee targeting your package are slim to none. USPS theft is actually extremely rare and item swapping is even more less likely with packages.

And eBay is extremely difficult to deal with these days when it comes to any issue - either as a buyer or seller. You will get different answers for the same questions depending on which rep you are communicating with. And different resolutions to the same issue depending on which rep you get.

For a high-dollar item like this I would suggest sharing the story and evidence on as many social media platforms as possible and tagging eBay. Maybe with enough pressure they might actually step in and try to help resolve the situation for you.

Best of luck!

[jcardstore]

Originally Posted by BigAl83

If it ends up being stolen by someone else i'm the first one to make a huge apology to this seller, but my gut feeling and all evidence to me says otherwise.

What evidence is there that the seller shipped you the wrong card intentionally?

I’m really surprised eBay isn’t allowing a return but I haven’t seen anything compelling that it’s fraud by the seller.

I agree with jmm and it seems pretty unlikely that someone with such a long standing account and no history of this would just decide to commit fraud on this one item.

Certainly possible tho

[TheHeel]

Name and shame

[jprk31]

The seller listing the card with only 1 pictureof the actual card is already a red flag. I mean it’s a 9k plus card and only one picture? That does not make sense even if it was a BGS graded card. I sell cards for as low as .99 cents and I still do 2 pictures front and back. Hopefully you get your money back.

[BigAl83]

Originally Posted by jcardstore

What evidence is there that the seller shipped you the wrong card intentionally?

I’m really surprised eBay isn’t allowing a return but I haven’t seen anything compelling that it’s fraud by the seller.

I agree with jmm and it seems pretty unlikely that someone with such a long standing account and no history of this would just decide to commit fraud on this one item.

Certainly possible tho

Like i said, i can't prove it with 100% certainty, but i think it's is also far less likely that some at COMC or a usps employee did this.

When accepting my offer it may not have been his original intention, and he may have originally just wanted to sell.
Sometimes though, when an opportunity presents itself, people tend to take that opportunity and run with it.

Either way, it still means that this eBay loophole of covering up part of the adress could hit a whole bunch of users of platforms like COMC.

[phdbeckett]

I don't think the seller was trying to subvert authenticity guarantee. As a collector of early 2000s basketball, any listing that lists the card correctly for example "ULTIMATE COLLECTION " OR Exquisite collection which is on the packaging and the grading label, does not have the authenticity guarantee logo paired with the listing. It's not just the seller it's any item that has the word collection in the title. Where eBay needs to get better is to check the category and when a listing is listed as a single card it would overlook/override that.

[Sonnys88]

Originally Posted by BigAl83

Like i said, i can't prove it with 100% certainty, but i think it's is also far less likely that some at COMC or a usps employee did this.

When accepting my offer it may not have been his original intention, and he may have originally just wanted to sell.
Sometimes though, when an opportunity presents itself, people tend to take that opportunity and run with it.

Either way, it still means that this eBay loophole of covering up part of the adress could hit a whole bunch of users of platforms like COMC.

Yep, the covering up of the username on the address label shows intent to delay opening or identifying whose package it is once it reached COMC. What reasons would there be to do that?

And to note - the USPS images almost every package label when it goes through the sorting machines. These images aren't accessible to the public unless you sign up for "Informed Delivery" notices, but the USPS can pull up the image of the label on the package in their internal system if you request it. That could confirm that the package was shipped with the label partially covered - and that it was not covered up after delivery.

Just because a seller has "good" feedback does not mean they are not capable of committing fraud when the opportunity presents itself. There are numerous examples of "good" sellers being caught scamming.

[cruiserdaddy7]

The covering up of the COMC username makes the intent very obvious. Opportunity presented itself and the seller took it.

[MavsRChamps]

I'd link this entire thread in your messages to Ebay honestly - Yes 75%+ of employees won't care at all to open it, but you just have to keep trying and hoping that someone with decency and common sense that works for Ebay will read this thread, realize what the seller did, realize the seller is in the wrong & escalate it to a higher up & get your $$$ back. I'd link this thread all over social media communication to Ebay also.

I'd be super pissed if I was you. You aren't being listened to and heard so when that's the case - essentially contacting everybody you can is warranted.

[BoSoxFan1999]

Originally Posted by cruiserdaddy7

The covering up of the COMC username makes the intent very obvious. Opportunity presented itself and the seller took it.

To risk your 18-year eBay seller account to try and pull a fast one for $7k...pretty foolish IMO.

[BoSoxFan1999]

Wow, eBay just going "Hey, thanks for being a loyal customer for 12 years, but yeah, screw off because we're done with this case as you shipped to a 3rd party, too bad so sad" is royally F'ed up.

[wilsonsingles]

I would make sure you have the correct serial numbering of both the BGS holder and the card itself. Did the seller list the BGS number in the auction itself?
If not, then that is another red flag against the seller, besides the single angled photo.

People here are pretty good at tracking down relisted items both on the web and at shows. If this card ever sees the light of day again, someone may spot it.

I would also check the USPS auction house as its possible it ends up there if a USPS worker gets scared by their theft and dumps it in the lost items bin.

[BigAl83]

Originally Posted by wilsonsingles

I would make sure you have the correct serial numbering of both the BGS holder and the card itself. Did the seller list the BGS number in the auction itself?
If not, then that is another red flag against the seller, besides the single angled photo.

People here are pretty good at tracking down relisted items both on the web and at shows. If this card ever sees the light of day again, someone may spot it.

I would also check the USPS auction house as its possible it ends up there if a USPS worker gets scared by their theft and dumps it in the lost items bin.

Good one, didn't think about that. I checked the listing and it does reference to Beckett grading and being graded a BGS 9, and even referencing to the 1996 allstar jersey, but the actual BGS serial number is nowhere to be found.

I had added the card to my Card ladder account after blowing up the picture just enough to decipher the BGS number, took a few tries with trying a few different numbers.

This is the actual BGS number for this particular card: 0010974688
The serial number of the card is a lot tougher for me, i'm not 100% sure, but for what i can make out of it, looks like it is number 02/25

But the BGS serial number i'm 100% sure is correct because it comes up within the beckett search as this exact BGS 9 copy.

[jcardstore]

Originally Posted by cruiserdaddy7

The covering up of the COMC username makes the intent very obvious. Opportunity presented itself and the seller took it.

This makes 0 sense considering the users account and other high value items that are being sold.

I get it, everyone loves a good conspiracy and it makes for a good story but not everything is a fraud

[auctionjmm]

Originally Posted by ninjacookies

Seems Ebay's really sticking to the 'outside the 3 day return window' clause on this one. Are we absolutely, 100% sure the outcome would have been the same if the buyer had opened his claim within the allotted timeframe? Feels like Ebay's basically unwilling to listen to the particulars of your case because you waited a tad bit too long.

I'd be interested to know if there were similar cases with the same outcome that were filed within the 72 hour deadline.

In any case, this really sucks. And that's why I never used 3rd parties to facilitate high end transactions, even though they should technically be safe. That extra layer of handling doesn't wear well on my nerves.

It's a double-edge sword. I was on the other side of a deal last week where someone bought two redemptions from me, scratched them, and then tried to initiate a claim 8 days later saying they were expired. It was a brand new product. They stuck to the 3 days. If the buyer had opened sooner, I'm guessing I'd be sitting here with two used redemptions and a couple hundred bucks gone.

[orion9578]

Originally Posted by jcardstore

This makes 0 sense considering the users account and other high value items that are being sold.

I get it, everyone loves a good conspiracy and it makes for a good story but not everything is a fraud

Just because someone has high value items listed doesn't make them immune from seizing an "opportunity".

Why would the seller respond like he has? Almost 0 communication...save a vague statement that he is above making a "mistake".

Why would he SEEMINGLY mark out the username to SEEMINGLY slow down the package?

If it was theft via USPS, why not just take the whole package? If it was theft via COMC, why not say it was an empty package?

Are you thinking the buyer is leaving part of the story out?

If I'm the seller of that card, I'm 100% all over trying to help out the buyer. Not being coy about what's going on...even if I think the buyer might be up to something.

Originally Posted by Ericc5Bears

Worth noting that on his most recent instagram post someone commented 177 weeks ago saying check dm please, then 136 weeks ago the same person commented "SCAMMER." Seems pretty clear they negotiated some kind of deal and then he scammed him in some way. So even though as others have pointed out he does have a good amount of positive feedback on higher end transactions he may look for specific opportunities to scam.

Then there's that.

[cruiserdaddy7]

Originally Posted by BoSoxFan1999

To risk your 18-year eBay seller account to try and pull a fast one for $7k...pretty foolish IMO.

What is the risk to the sellers account? Appears to be 0 risk.

[Bosoxfan5990]

Originally Posted by auctionjmm

It's a double-edge sword. I was on the other side of a deal last week where someone bought two redemptions from me, scratched them, and then tried to initiate a claim 8 days later saying they were expired. It was a brand new product. They stuck to the 3 days. If the buyer had opened sooner, I'm guessing I'd be sitting here with two used redemptions and a couple hundred bucks gone.

This sounds like a buyer who doesn't understand it takes some time for redemption codes to be entered into the system for brand new product.

[jcardstore]

Originally Posted by orion9578

Just because someone has high value items listed doesn't make them immune from seizing an "opportunity".

Why would the seller respond like he has? Almost 0 communication...save a vague statement that he is above making a "mistake".

Why would he SEEMINGLY mark out the username to SEEMINGLY slow down the package?

If it was theft via USPS, why not just take the whole package? If it was theft via COMC, why not say it was an empty package?

Are you thinking the buyer is leaving part of the story out?

If I'm the seller of that card, I'm 100% all over trying to help out the buyer. Not being coy about what's going on...even if I think the buyer might be up to something.



Then there's that.

Anything is possible.

but ask yourself, someone with a nearly 20 year old account, who has done hundreds of thousands in transactions maybe even millions on ebay why would they choose this one $7k card to start scamming? As if this "opportunity" as people have described has never come up before?

It's unfortunate that the OP is out his money and card but not everything in the hobby is fraud.

Blurry picture... Really? COMC name left off on a label that was printed and generated by ebay?

There's no real evidence of a scam here. Someone else said it but the lack of communication could definitely be the seller thinking that the buyer is trying to scam him

[Nomad]

Too lazy to digest. Is this serious or another mancaves are shaking thread?

[jcardstore]

This site is pretty much just becoming a mob with pitchforks screaming scam at everything.

If the seller would have come here and posted this exact same story everyone would be calling the buyer a scammer.

The reality is that there isn't enough information either way to make any sort of conclusion. Half the story is left out and most of what is being shared is assumption

[orion9578]

Originally Posted by jcardstore

Anything is possible.

but ask yourself, someone with a nearly 20 year old account, who has done hundreds of thousands in transactions maybe even millions on ebay why would they choose this one $7k card to start scamming? As if this "opportunity" as people have described has never come up before?

It's unfortunate that the OP is out his money and card but not everything in the hobby is fraud.

Blurry picture... Really? COMC name left off on a label that was printed and generated by ebay?

There's no real evidence of a scam here. Someone else said it but the lack of communication could definitely be the seller thinking that the buyer is trying to scam him

Did you just gloss over the fact that someone called him out on IG for being a scammer? Who knows what that story is, but I can say that I've been doing this for longer than he has(on eBay) and 0 people have called me a scammer.

His lack of communication, according to the OP, is the worst look...to me. "I don't make mistakes".

Originally Posted by jcardstore

This site is pretty much just becoming a mob with pitchforks screaming scam at everything.

If the seller would have come here and posted this exact same story everyone would be calling the buyer a scammer.

The reality is that there isn't enough information either way to make any sort of conclusion. Half the story is left out and most of what is being shared is assumption

It would be nice if the seller were able to respond, I will say that. Maybe there is more to the story. But to me, and I think most reading this, it doesn't look great for them.

What doesn't scream scam about this? I'm curious. You're acting like people are up in arms over something that doesn't SEEM like a scam. The guy lives in Europe and hasn't even put his hands on the card/package. So, are you thinking the USPS did this or COMC? If it isn't a scam, assuming the OP is to be believed about his story so far...then what exact is going on?

Seems like a scam to me

[mc1]

Originally Posted by jcardstore

This site is pretty much just becoming a mob with pitchforks screaming scam at everything.

If the seller would have come here and posted this exact same story everyone would be calling the buyer a scammer.

The reality is that there isn't enough information either way to make any sort of conclusion. Half the story is left out and most of what is being shared is assumption

The buyer did not open the package. A 3rd-party received and opened it. Are you insinuating the buyer is colluding with someone at COMC to pull of this scam?