Observations on the current state of the hobby from a show this weekend

[premium1981]

Originally Posted by Big35Hurt

I think a lot of what is posted here by some (including myself) is tongue-in-cheek, but some people take it as serious derogatory comments. I am sure some if it is from miserable people, but personally I love a lot of the dialogue and banter that goes on here. It takes quite a bit to offend me, so maybe that's one of the reasons why I enjoy the posts here.

It isn't the differences of opinion or general derogatory comments that are what ruin things. That's a part of life and happens everywhere. The thing that is so bad here is that there are a handful of members that live on these boards morning, day, and night. And their sole purpose is to go into every single thread and take a dump. That isn't a difference of opinion, that's ruining threads that others are enjoying when you have no purpose there but to take said dump. That is the biggest problem.

Let's get specific. If you don't like 2025 Topps Chrome its fine to post in there and share that opinion. It may be something you previously enjoyed but now its so watered down that it isn't fun anymore. Good deal, no worries. But when you go into every single new product release and say the same thing over and over thats when it becomes a problem IMO. You don't have to tell everyone you hate something when we already know it. There is no purpose in that.

Furthermore, you can't enjoy talking about a young players performance or get excited about someone new on your team without people saying you are pumping or an idiot for thinking someone will be good. So there again, it takes the fun out of it. Once more, its fine to have a back and forth about a single prospect that everyone loves but you think isn't going to pan out. I love those conversations. But to go into every player thread and say this guy sucks is where it gets old.

This is all generally speaking, but its what annoys me most, and I know a lot of others too. I can say this though, there is one poster here who used to be at the top of the list who has really dialed it back recently. I have noticed, and actually appreciate the change. A few others will never get it. They think the boards revolve around them and if they didn't go into every thread and share their worthless opinions that add nothing the boards would collapse.

[auctionjmm]

Originally Posted by tyrith

TBH I think it's the opposite - the more expensive the market is, the more it favors renting. And working with a bunch of RRE owners professionally (as a tax CPA), the ones that can actually make money are usually owning in lower income markets.

For whatever reason, it's just how rental markets seem to develop. I'd posit it's because more of the rental homes in higher income areas are owned by former occupants that have enough equity that they can afford to cash flow the properties off lower rents. I know my landlord owns the house outright, so they're still making money, even though no one could buy a house like this one at market price and get it to cash flow now.

That is true specifically where I live, and I recognize that it makes me biased on this topic. Although, I rent from a corporate beast so that is even more surprising.

My home is 1,400 sq.ft. two bedroom, two bath, attached 2-car garage. Private backyard with a wooded view. I live in one of the hottest markets you will find. Zillow floats at between 15-20 listings at a time and they get snatched up immediately. If this house were for sale, my mortgage/tax/insurance would exceed my rent by over $1,000. I've run the numbers on similar properties in the area. I did in-fact look at buying in this area. Made no sense to me.

Now, I have a good friend (single mom) with 2 kids who wanted to own a home. She grew up on rents and just wanted to break the cycle and give her kids some stability. She moved to a lower income neighborhood where supply well-exceeded demand and was able to hand-pick her home and negotiate. She settled for a "flip" because all the work was done. I wouldn't personally choose to live in that neighborhood but it made sense to her. Coincidentally, if you want to rent in her neighborhood, the rate is about 1.5x her mortgage. It makes absolutely no sense to rent there when housing supply is so cheap and abundant.

In this area, the difference between renting in an upper income neighborhood vs. lower income is hundreds. Not thousands. The correlation is all out of wack.

[tyrith]

Originally Posted by auctionjmm

In this area, the difference between renting in an upper income neighborhood vs. lower income is hundreds. Not thousands. The correlation is all out of wack.

In my neighborhood there's a home for rent for $2900/mo that's down the street from a house that's 200 sq ft smaller and listed for sale at $730K. Similar level of upgrades.

With 20% down on a 6.5% 30 year mortgage, the monthly mortgage payment would be $4,756, and the property taxes will probably be just over $1K/mo on top of that. With homeowner's insurance added in, we're already talking 2x the monthly rent, without including anything for repairs and maintenance.

[corockies]

Originally Posted by premium1981

It isn't the differences of opinion or general derogatory comments that are what ruin things. That's a part of life and happens everywhere. The thing that is so bad here is that there are a handful of members that live on these boards morning, day, and night. And their sole purpose is to go into every single thread and take a dump. That isn't a difference of opinion, that's ruining threads that others are enjoying when you have no purpose there but to take said dump. That is the biggest problem.

Let's get specific. If you don't like 2025 Topps Chrome its fine to post in there and share that opinion. It may be something you previously enjoyed but now its so watered down that it isn't fun anymore. Good deal, no worries. But when you go into every single new product release and say the same thing over and over thats when it becomes a problem IMO. You don't have to tell everyone you hate something when we already know it. There is no purpose in that.

Furthermore, you can't enjoy talking about a young players performance or get excited about someone new on your team without people saying you are pumping or an idiot for thinking someone will be good. So there again, it takes the fun out of it. Once more, its fine to have a back and forth about a single prospect that everyone loves but you think isn't going to pan out. I love those conversations. But to go into every player thread and say this guy sucks is where it gets old.

This is all generally speaking, but its what annoys me most, and I know a lot of others too. I can say this though, there is one poster here who used to be at the top of the list who has really dialed it back recently. I have noticed, and actually appreciate the change. A few others will never get it. They think the boards revolve around them and if they didn't go into every thread and share their worthless opinions that add nothing the boards would collapse.

Luckily some of those who committed these offenses are gone, like whitmm. Good riddance.

[corockies]

Originally Posted by tyrith

In my neighborhood there's a home for rent for $2900/mo that's down the street from a house that's 200 sq ft smaller and listed for sale at $730K. Similar level of upgrades.

With 20% down on a 6.5% 30 year mortgage, the monthly mortgage payment would be $4,756, and the property taxes will probably be just over $1K/mo on top of that. With homeowner's insurance added in, we're already talking 2x the monthly rent, without including anything for repairs and maintenance.

Having been a homeowner for over 25 years and currently about to sell, I can honestly say it's not the great investment it's cracked up to be. I'm getting a large influx of $$$ from the sale (really the only good thing to come from it), but it's been literally a death by 1000 cuts scenario over the years. Replacing flooring / carpeting, replacing windows, replacing blinds / shutters, replacing heater / A/C / water heater, replacing roof, interior / exterior painting, kitchen upgrades, plumbing issues, sprinkler issues, garage door issues, tree trimming, land settling issues, yard maintenance, etc... Had a corporate truck hit and destroy one of my trees in the front yard a couple of years ago (split it straight down the trunk), had to hire a removal company and pay the entire expense because said company wouldn't agree to anything short of a lawsuit.

Property taxes, monthly electric, monthly cell phone, monthly internet / TV, bi-monthly trash / recycling removal, bi-monthly water bill, HOA - it's gonna be nice having a lot of these expenses gone.

[OhioLawyerF5]

Originally Posted by tyrith

TBH I think it's the opposite - the more expensive the market is, the more it favors renting. And working with a bunch of RRE owners professionally (as a tax CPA), the ones that can actually make money are usually owning in lower income markets.



For whatever reason, it's just how rental markets seem to develop. I'd posit it's because more of the rental homes in higher income areas are owned by former occupants that have enough equity that they can afford to cash flow the properties off lower rents. I know my landlord owns the house outright, so they're still making money, even though no one could buy a house like this one at market price and get it to cash flow now.

Oh, you misunderstood me. I agree with this. When I said "terrible markets (aka cities)" I was referring to more expensive markets. I meant terrible as in overpriced. I live in a rural community because it makes way better economic sense.

[PuddleMonkey]

I know some of you probably watched this so give me the cliff notes, I don't do anything for 45 minutes.

[corockies]

Originally Posted by PuddleMonkey

I know some of you probably watched this so give me the cliff notes, I don't do anything for 45 minutes.

They cover numerous topics (autograph forgery scandal with the guy who offed himself), National next week, and the topic you linked. Some instagram guy said that many people are quitting collecting for various reasons and they all disagreed with him to a certain extent. They all seem to believe the hobby is going as strong as ever and that many of us true collectors get stuck in our small little sections of the hobby. That makes seeing the larger picture much tougher.

[Twalk1975]

Originally Posted by PuddleMonkey

I know some of you probably watched this so give me the cliff notes, I don't do anything for 45 minutes.

Several of them are members of this forum, they might be familiar with your work.

[PuddleMonkey]

Originally Posted by Twalk1975

Several of them are members of this forum, they might be familiar with your work.

Good, I need to speak with them about the length of these videos.

[OhioLawyerF5]

Originally Posted by PuddleMonkey

I don't do anything for 45 minutes.

That's what your wife/girlfriend/sheep said (I'm unsure of your relationship status).

[PuddleMonkey]

Originally Posted by OhioLawyerF5

wife/girlfriend/sheep

[DaryanLenz]

Originally Posted by premium1981

It isn't the differences of opinion or general derogatory comments that are what ruin things. That's a part of life and happens everywhere. The thing that is so bad here is that there are a handful of members that live on these boards morning, day, and night. And their sole purpose is to go into every single thread and take a dump. That isn't a difference of opinion, that's ruining threads that others are enjoying when you have no purpose there but to take said dump. That is the biggest problem.

Let's get specific. If you don't like 2025 Topps Chrome its fine to post in there and share that opinion. It may be something you previously enjoyed but now its so watered down that it isn't fun anymore. Good deal, no worries. But when you go into every single new product release and say the same thing over and over thats when it becomes a problem IMO. You don't have to tell everyone you hate something when we already know it. There is no purpose in that.

Furthermore, you can't enjoy talking about a young players performance or get excited about someone new on your team without people saying you are pumping or an idiot for thinking someone will be good. So there again, it takes the fun out of it. Once more, its fine to have a back and forth about a single prospect that everyone loves but you think isn't going to pan out. I love those conversations. But to go into every player thread and say this guy sucks is where it gets old.

This is all generally speaking, but its what annoys me most, and I know a lot of others too. I can say this though, there is one poster here who used to be at the top of the list who has really dialed it back recently. I have noticed, and actually appreciate the change. A few others will never get it. They think the boards revolve around them and if they didn't go into every thread and share their worthless opinions that add nothing the boards would collapse.

AMEN; post of the year.

[auctionjmm]

Originally Posted by DaryanLenz

AMEN; post of the year.

Seconded. The "Wembum" stuff really irritated me. There were literally people rooting against him because they wanted card buyers to lose money. All while complaining that the NBA product sucks now because they haven't had a generational star in recent years. I'm so glad he shut some people up, and hopefully the DVT is a blip on the radar. Sounds like he's healthy and good to go for this season. But that's where things have come to. People actually want to see garbage play so they can S*** on "investors"/Fanatics/Panini and laugh about it. It takes a certain degree of misery to say "I want professional sports to suck so that everyone loses money and wax becomes affordable again". I can tolerate many things but if you are content to see sports die because you hate the modern hobby, then just leave.

[fabiani12333]

Originally Posted by premium1981

Message boards are becoming a thing of the past with social media taking over a lot of that content and interaction. But the consensus from outsiders looking in is that our boards are toxic. I've seen/heard that over and over. And you can't really say otherwise when you read through the threads.

Social media platforms like X, TikTok, Instagram and Bluesky are toxic. People who post on the internet are toxic.

If you want a safe space, you've got to stay off the internet.

It doesnt matter, anyway -- AI-driven bots will eventually take over social media platforms, anyway.

[theshowandme]

48 hours until the National Pokemon Collectors Convention (NPCC)

[Above the Rim]

Went to a Portland, OR show. Used to be 75% sports 25% Pokemon.

Was jaw on floor - now minimum 80% Pokemon and sports darn pathetic.

Majority of tables were simply "Joe Avg. collector" who got a table, not what I would call true Dealers.

But hey, my teenage son had a great time, made 3 Pokemon trades and 1 Pokemon buy - all low value collector stuff. I actually checked out/held 1 single sports card, passed due to condition. That was it.

[ThoseBackPages]

its National Week!

[Big35Hurt]

Originally Posted by ThoseBackPages

its National Week!

Pants down! (just not inside the convention center please)

[fulltritty]

Originally Posted by ThoseBackPages

its National Week!

It is going to feel so weird not packing tonight and driving to Rosemont tomorrow.

[mfw13]

Originally Posted by Above the Rim

Majority of tables were simply "Joe Avg. collector" who got a table, not what I would call true Dealers.

This is the biggest difference nowadays....anybody can be a "dealer".

And many of these so-called dealers are disorganized and clueless....they have no idea what is in their inventory, nor about any aspect of the hobby more than ten years old.

[premium1981]

Originally Posted by Above the Rim

Majority of tables were simply "Joe Avg. collector" who got a table, not what I would call true Dealers.

Most of the big dogs have been preparing for the National.

[OhioLawyerF5]

Wow! If this National is any indication, the hobby is strong and growing.

Obviously, there is more floor space than Cleveland last year, but I was shocked at how many more dealers there were than 2 years ago. There was a ton of open floor space in Hall F last time. This time it feels like a whole other show on that side. Then 70 booths upstairs. It was the biggest it's ever been. The line of general admission people outside was shocking even the officers outside directing traffic. I overheard one of them say they hadn't seen anything like it. We went across the skyway from the parking garage across the street and walked right into the show with zero wait.

Inside, the show, the selection of cards was great. More 90s than most years, which was my main hunt. The mix of vintage and modern was pretty even, and relatively little pokemon. The 8% pokemon estimate based on number of non-sport dealers seems accurate. Lots of people buying and selling. It had a very healthy market vibe to it. It has definitely gotten big enough that you need all week to see it all.

[ThoseBackPages]

The National may have outgrown Rosemont, even with the new space added.

Thursday was about as packed people wise as i can remember

[Big35Hurt]

Originally Posted by ThoseBackPages

The National may have outgrown Rosemont, even with the new space added.

Thursday was about as packed people wise as i can remember

That's what I am seeing as well. The lines are long for everything, and upstairs is brutal. Still enjoying my time there so far, but it's hard to get to tables at times.