Blowout's AL/NL Challenge

[Chris Lyle]

I'm looking to buy in both leagues. Have some decent values in the AL would even talk a huge deal for Judge if it made sense, but would take a lot

NL
Roupp 18th Rd
Abbott 13th Rd
Luzardo 5th Rd
Brice Turang 14th Rd

[Hollywood42]

Trade deadlines in these leagues is 7/21

And of course the MLB trade deadline on 7/31, so keep an eye on this thread and the sheet to track the cross-league action that will be coming

[Chris Lyle]

So random question, why does the draft result on ESPN not match the spread sheet?

[jstasyk1121]

Cuz the keepers mess that up...cuz they all end up getting added manually post draft here i believe

[Chris Lyle]

Originally Posted by jstasyk1121

Cuz the keepers mess that up...cuz they all end up getting added manually post draft here i believe

Makes sense. Hadn't really been burnt by it, just messed up my value on a player today.

[Chris Lyle]

Still looking to make some deals to use guys with values for upgrades

AL looking a bat and/or an upper tier pitcher.

NL mainly looking for upgrades in the pitching department

[Eckstein197]

Hitting for the cycle should be worth more than 5 points

If a no hitter is worth 20, a cycle should be worth 10-20, not 5

349 total cycles in MLB history, 326 no hitters

[crossdog]

2nd for a next year scoring rule change

Originally Posted by Eckstein197

Hitting for the cycle should be worth more than 5 points

If a no hitter is worth 20, a cycle should be worth 10-20, not 5

349 total cycles in MLB history, 326 no hitters

[jstasyk1121]

My rule change would be that relief wins are worth a couple points...it sucks when ur closer comes in to tie game and gets W and it's worth nothing...or ifnhe blows save to then get win and it doesn't help offset .


Also..I would prob vote to not increase the cycle stuff...a no-hitter might be as rare..but one in my opinion is pretty lucky while the other is wayyyy more difficult to actually do

[Eckstein197]

Originally Posted by jstasyk1121

My rule change would be that relief wins are worth a couple points...it sucks when ur closer comes in to tie game and gets W and it's worth nothing...or ifnhe blows save to then get win and it doesn't help offset .


Also..I would prob vote to not increase the cycle stuff...a no-hitter might be as rare..but one in my opinion is pretty lucky while the other is wayyyy more difficult to actually do

How is a cycle lucky?

[crossdog]

I thought about it and a cycle seems rarer than a no hitter. Figuring there is 9 player chance per game compared to 2 player chances per game for a no hitter.

Rouch numbers:

96 cycles out of 49,140 since 2000
58 no hitters out of vs 5,460 since 2000


***In Major League Baseball, hitting for the cycle (single, double, triple, and home run in the same game) is considered slightly more common than pitching a no-hitter. While both are rare feats, the probability of a player hitting for the cycle is estimated to be around 0.0059% in a single game, whereas the odds of a pitcher throwing a no-hitter are closer to 0.025% per game.

[jstasyk1121]

its not all luck...but I believe there is more luck involved...such as hitting a triple...that isnt like some skill...diff parks, diff fielders...bounce this way or that way...

No Hitter to me is way harder to accomplish...cuz you also have to be in good pitch count range for the coach to even let you try sometimes...in these days how often do we see guys pulled after 7 with no no going...

we see it differently and that is fine...I just think it would be bonkers to have hitting for a cycle be worth like 35+ points overall if not more....you are already getting likely 15-20 just based on the actual stats of your game...plus 5 for the current bonus...thats a Massive game on offense....i would say getting 40-50 or whatever(based on strikeouts/walks) for a NH is pretty equivalent on the pitching side

And the hitter has 5-6 more games that week to score more...while the SP is probably done unless he does it on a Monday

Buxton had nearly the least productive cycle stat-wise and got 21pts...he had 3r and 2rbi...but because he randomly had a 1b 2b 3b hr he should get a 35pt game or something? IDK..just doesnt add up for me personally

Sure its Rare...i get it...just because something is rare doesnt mean it should be some overpowering performance

[Chris Lyle]

Originally Posted by jstasyk1121

its not all luck...but I believe there is more luck involved...such as hitting a triple...that isnt like some skill...diff parks, diff fielders...bounce this way or that way...

No Hitter to me is way harder to accomplish...cuz you also have to be in good pitch count range for the coach to even let you try sometimes...in these days how often do we see guys pulled after 7 with no no going...

we see it differently and that is fine...I just think it would be bonkers to have hitting for a cycle be worth like 35+ points overall if not more....you are already getting likely 15-20 just based on the actual stats of your game...plus 5 for the current bonus...thats a Massive game on offense....i would say getting 40-50 or whatever(based on strikeouts/walks) for a NH is pretty equivalent on the pitching side

And the hitter has 5-6 more games that week to score more...while the SP is probably done unless he does it on a Monday

Buxton had nearly the least productive cycle stat-wise and got 21pts...he had 3r and 2rbi...but because he randomly had a 1b 2b 3b hr he should get a 35pt game or something? IDK..just doesnt add up for me personally

Sure its Rare...i get it...just because something is rare doesnt mean it should be some overpowering performance

So if a personal accomplishment shouldn't skew things points wise for the hitter then I guess I would play devils advocate here: why should the pitcher get it also? He gets his points for SO's, QS, etc. Then gets 20 more for the NH part of it? To me the one time a week thing has no merit in the discussion. Batters play every day, which honestly can make it harder for the cycle to happen you still have to get 4 hits in the game regardless of how lucky one may think it is. I think the point of why does one get it and the other doesn't is the basis of the discussion.

[Eckstein197]

Originally Posted by jstasyk1121

its not all luck...but I believe there is more luck involved...such as hitting a triple...that isnt like some skill...diff parks, diff fielders...bounce this way or that way...

No Hitter to me is way harder to accomplish...cuz you also have to be in good pitch count range for the coach to even let you try sometimes...in these days how often do we see guys pulled after 7 with no no going...

we see it differently and that is fine...I just think it would be bonkers to have hitting for a cycle be worth like 35+ points overall if not more....you are already getting likely 15-20 just based on the actual stats of your game...plus 5 for the current bonus...thats a Massive game on offense....i would say getting 40-50 or whatever(based on strikeouts/walks) for a NH is pretty equivalent on the pitching side

And the hitter has 5-6 more games that week to score more...while the SP is probably done unless he does it on a Monday

Buxton had nearly the least productive cycle stat-wise and got 21pts...he had 3r and 2rbi...but because he randomly had a 1b 2b 3b hr he should get a 35pt game or something? IDK..just doesnt add up for me personally

Sure its Rare...i get it...just because something is rare doesnt mean it should be some overpowering performance

A triple absolutely does have a high level of skill. Sure sometimes a bounce helps but the only guys hitting triples are usually speedsters.

And I’m not asking for a cycle to be worth 40 points individually, but it should be closer to the no hitter.

Heck even a shutout has the same value as a cycle. A shutout happens way more frequently than a cycle, the fact he has the same scoring doesn’t make much sense

Also I would argue yes, if something incredibly rare happens, it should be pretty powerful

[jstasyk1121]

Originally Posted by Chris Lyle

So if a personal accomplishment shouldn't skew things points wise for the hitter then I guess I would play devils advocate here: why should the pitcher get it also? He gets his points for SO's, QS, etc. Then gets 20 more for the NH part of it? To me the one time a week thing has no merit in the discussion. Batters play every day, which honestly can make it harder for the cycle to happen you still have to get 4 hits in the game regardless of how lucky one may think it is. I think the point of why does one get it and the other doesn't is the basis of the discussion.

but they both do get the bonus...you just disagree with the amount of the bonus

[jstasyk1121]

Originally Posted by Eckstein197

A triple absolutely does have a high level of skill. Sure sometimes a bounce helps but the only guys hitting triples are usually speedsters.

And I’m not asking for a cycle to be worth 40 points individually, but it should be closer to the no hitter.

Heck even a shutout has the same value as a cycle. A shutout happens way more frequently than a cycle, the fact he has the same scoring doesn’t make much sense

Also I would argue yes, if something incredibly rare happens, it should be pretty powerful

then what are you asking it to be worth?

current day the absolute minimum a cycle can return is 17pts

10 total bases and 1rbi and 1run...lets just assume they didnt strike out for this example...

12pts plus the current 5pt bonus...17pts...

"i dont want it to be worth 40"...ok so upping the bonus to 15 or 20 would make it worth at minimum 27-32pts...and that is the minimum...many times we see a cycle it feels like the line is like 4hits 4rbi 3runs or something like that...you are up to 37pts with that line

for one game of their season out of 162...

pitcher gets 50 for example...for one game of their 32game season

i just think that would be skewing it too much the other direction is all

[Chris Lyle]

Originally Posted by jstasyk1121

but they both do get the bonus...you just disagree with the amount of the bonus

What I'm arguing is based on your argument we could just make both 5 pts like a current cycle and be done with it.

[Chris Lyle]

Originally Posted by jstasyk1121

then what are you asking it to be worth?

current day the absolute minimum a cycle can return is 17pts

10 total bases and 1rbi and 1run...lets just assume they didnt strike out for this example...

12pts plus the current 5pt bonus...17pts...

"i dont want it to be worth 40"...ok so upping the bonus to 15 or 20 would make it worth at minimum 27-32pts...and that is the minimum...many times we see a cycle it feels like the line is like 4hits 4rbi 3runs or something like that...you are up to 37pts with that line

for one game of their season out of 162...


pitcher gets 50 for example...for one game of their 32game season

i just think that would be skewing it too much the other direction is all

This is where you lose me. You keep saying a cycle is more frequent, or many times we see the line....

It's happened 1 time this entire year... It's not frequent, it's not many times we see the line... It's rare.

So IMO you either make it the same as the No Hitter, or you take the no hitter down.

[jstasyk1121]

Originally Posted by Chris Lyle

This is where you lose me. You keep saying a cycle is more frequent, or many times we see the line....

It's happened 1 time this entire year... It's not frequent, it's not many times we see the line... It's rare.

So IMO you either make it the same as the No Hitter, or you take the no hitter down.

im talking about when you do see a cycle...

when a cycle happens, often times it seems like its more than just the solo hr being only run/rbi....

im not saying they happen all the time...im saying WHEN they do, chances are you have multiple runs/rbis that game

[jstasyk1121]

Originally Posted by Chris Lyle

What I'm arguing is based on your argument we could just make both 5 pts like a current cycle and be done with it.

i was replying to the initial comment saying they should be worth 10-20 and not 5

[Chris Lyle]

Originally Posted by jstasyk1121

im talking about when you do see a cycle...

when a cycle happens, often times it seems like its more than just the solo hr being only run/rbi....

im not saying they happen all the time...im saying WHEN they do, chances are you have multiple runs/rbis that game

The same can be said for a no hitter, multiple strikeouts racking up pts, not many walks, and pitches....

So... should they both just be like 10 pts or should the "lucky" cycle be as much as the current no hitter?

Officially done debating this. Vote hopefully to come in the off season.

[Eckstein197]

Originally Posted by jstasyk1121

then what are you asking it to be worth?

current day the absolute minimum a cycle can return is 17pts

10 total bases and 1rbi and 1run...lets just assume they didnt strike out for this example...

12pts plus the current 5pt bonus...17pts...

"i dont want it to be worth 40"...ok so upping the bonus to 15 or 20 would make it worth at minimum 27-32pts...and that is the minimum...many times we see a cycle it feels like the line is like 4hits 4rbi 3runs or something like that...you are up to 37pts with that line

for one game of their season out of 162...

pitcher gets 50 for example...for one game of their 32game season

i just think that would be skewing it too much the other direction is all

The minimum for a no hitter is 39 (27 outs, 4 QS, 5 shutout, 3 CG) BEFORE the additional 20 points for throwing a no hitter. And that’s just assuming the pitcher has equal amount of strikeouts and walks. Odds are if you’re throwing a no hitter you’re putting up a 60+ point effort.

Buxton had 21 points, 16 points before the cycle bonus. There’s no reason why a cycle should not be worth 10-15. Buxton in that case would have had 26-31 points, about half of what a no hitter would give you.