ALERT: 93 PROVEN TRIMMED Stephen Curry and James Harden RCs Sold Via PWCC

[ideal808]

Yes thank you for posting this up, it's sad that a lot of people trade/buy cards unknowingly that have been trimmed or altered. I for one have had an example of this with a card I currently still own (by choice)

The card I have in my PC right now is this:

PANINI NEXT DAY USING LEFT EDGE:
70. 2009 Panini Next Day Stephen Curry ROOKIE RC AUTO #SCU PSA 10 GEM MINT SER#: 25885113
https://www.worthpoint.com/worthoped...kie-1806341922
https://www.pwccmarketplace.com/items/1370107

If possible could someone point out to me how the card was discovered trimmed? When I look at the pictures on Worthpoint the original photos were taken at angles with a lot of reflection from the lighting. I can't see anything definitive in the pictures about the left edge or corners but I'm sure there is some reason why it was listed on this extensive list.

I just want to state my position. I originally bought this card on eBay from the seller that bought the card on PWCC. I've had it since and sometime last year someone from PWCC contacted me about this card in particular. Like others I was offered to have this card re-examined (by them?) and receive a refund. I was honestly shocked to be contacted out of the blue, apparently they contacted the original buyer and he forwarded them over to me.

I refused to return the card to PWCC primarily for the reason that I love this card

At this point I'm perfectly content to hold this card forever as a PC item, there have been a few people who asked me in the past but I have told them (both at time of knowing about the potential alteration/and after) that the card was basically not for sale.

It saddens me that something like this happened to such an important Steph card but knowing the print on this particular card is soooooo tiny trimmed or untrimmed this card is a very treasured part of my collection. Honestly another copy may never come to market again.

Would you have done the same?

[auburn35]

Originally Posted by ideal808

Yes thank you for posting this up, it's sad that a lot of people trade/buy cards unknowingly that have been trimmed or altered. I for one have had an example of this with a card I currently still own (by choice)

The card I have in my PC right now is this:

PANINI NEXT DAY USING LEFT EDGE:
70. 2009 Panini Next Day Stephen Curry ROOKIE RC AUTO #SCU PSA 10 GEM MINT SER#: 25885113
https://www.worthpoint.com/worthoped...kie-1806341922
https://www.pwccmarketplace.com/items/1370107

If possible could someone point out to me how the card was discovered trimmed? When I look at the pictures on Worthpoint the original photos were taken at angles with a lot of reflection from the lighting. I can't see anything definitive in the pictures about the left edge or corners but I'm sure there is some reason why it was listed on this extensive list.

I just want to state my position. I originally bought this card on eBay from the seller that bought the card on PWCC. I've had it since and sometime last year someone from PWCC contacted me about this card in particular. Like others I was offered to have this card re-examined (by them?) and receive a refund. I was honestly shocked to be contacted out of the blue, apparently they contacted the original buyer and he forwarded them over to me.

I refused to return the card to PWCC primarily for the reason that I love this card

At this point I'm perfectly content to hold this card forever as a PC item, there have been a few people who asked me in the past but I have told them (both at time of knowing about the potential alteration/and after) that the card was basically not for sale.

It saddens me that something like this happened to such an important Steph card but knowing the print on this particular card is soooooo tiny trimmed or untrimmed this card is a very treasured part of my collection. Honestly another copy may never come to market again.

Would you have done the same?

I'm sure lots of collectors will be in similar situations, as time goes on.

I'll let the experts that came up with that list of cards explain the noted alterations but with you favoring the actual card above the assigned graded condition, I personally would be reaching out to PSA; looking for compensation through their financial grade guarantee.

Unlike the PWCC refund, I believe this option would allow you to keep the card (identified as altered), while PSA would cover the $ difference (PSA10 - altered) for their failure to properly identify the altered card, assuming it is.

[regularp]

I think a lot of the Curry Contenders RC Autos are trimmed and went through PSA. I made a thread about it but it didn't get any traction: https://www.blowoutforums.com/showthread.php?t=1185068

It was two sellers in particular listing a lot of them: sportscards1977 and drsam_1979

There are currently 81 PSA 10s out of 109 graded and just 15 BGS 9.5s out of 139 with NO 10s. How often do you see the gem numbers flipped like that with PSA and BGS?

[3124508 on COMC]

Originally Posted by regularp

I think a lot of the Curry Contenders RC Autos are trimmed and went through PSA. I made a thread about it but it didn't get any traction: https://www.blowoutforums.com/showthread.php?t=1185068

It was two sellers in particular listing a lot of them: sportscards1977 and drsam_1979

There are currently 81 PSA 10s out of 109 graded and just 15 BGS 9.5s out of 139 with NO 10s. How often do you see the gem numbers flipped like that with PSA and BGS?

Most/all of the ones I saw from the sellers noted, or at the very least the former, were flipped, primarily from PWCC.

[ideal808]

Originally Posted by auburn35

I'm sure lots of collectors will be in similar situations, as time goes on.

I'll let the experts that came up with that list of cards explain the noted alterations but with you favoring the actual card above the assigned graded condition, I personally would be reaching out to PSA; looking for compensation through their financial grade guarantee.

Unlike the PWCC refund, I believe this option would allow you to keep the card (identified as altered), while PSA would cover the $ difference (PSA10 - altered) for their failure to properly identify the altered card, assuming it is.

Appreciate the feedback, I may choose to go that route need to find more info out from PSA exactly how that program works

Back to the main reason I posted this >

I'm still very curious and very much like to know what is wrong with the left edge that is denoted? If anyone can point out the hard evidence that this card is trimmed I would love to know since it's being put on this list.

[3124508 on COMC]

Originally Posted by ideal808

Appreciate the feedback, I may choose to go that route need to find more info out from PSA exactly how that program works

Back to the main reason I posted this >

I'm still very curious and very much like to know what is wrong with the left edge that is denoted? If anyone can point out the hard evidence that this card is trimmed I would love to know since it's being put on this list.

Less distance from elbow to edge.

[regularp]

Originally Posted by 3124508 on COMC

Most/all of the ones I saw from the sellers noted, or at the very least the former, were flipped, primarily from PWCC.

They all have to be trimmed. I put those Curry Contenders in the same class as Russell Wilson's Contenders autos.

[3124508 on COMC]

Originally Posted by regularp

They all have to be trimmed. I put those Curry Contenders in the same class as Russell Wilson's Contenders autos.

Correct. They’re trimmed, just from the usual suspects as opposed to those sellers noted. That card would go on my “Just don’t bother buying a PSA 10” list.

The interesting thing with the Wilson is that I suspect that there’s a strong correlation between fake and trimmed copies, so you’ve got multiple things to watch out for there and frankly I’m not intimately familiar with the ins and outs of the fake 2012 Contenders. But, the trimmers had them graded before they were ever sold raw and I don’t think it’s a coincidence that many of the originals came from the same people who ended up with the truckloads of unnumbered and unsigned memorabilia cards that Panini dumped (who are also trimmers).

[regularp]

Originally Posted by 3124508 on COMC

Correct. They’re trimmed, just from the usual suspects as opposed to those sellers noted. That card would go on my “Just don’t bother buying a PSA 10” list.

The interesting thing with the Wilson is that I suspect that there’s a strong correlation between fake and trimmed copies, so you’ve got multiple things to watch out for there and frankly I’m not intimately familiar with the ins and outs of the fake 2012 Contenders. But, the trimmers had them graded before they were ever sold raw and I don’t think it’s a coincidence that many of the originals came from the same people who ended up with the truckloads of unnumbered and unsigned memorabilia cards that Panini dumped (who are also trimmers).

Do you know how those sellers get so many of them or were they a conduit/front for the trimmers?

[3124508 on COMC]

Originally Posted by regularp

Do you know how those sellers get so many of them or were they a conduit/front for the trimmers?

Assuming you’re referring to the Currys, sportscards1977 is a high end investor/flipper and buys lots from PWCC and the like. He’s not related to any trimmers that I’m aware of. I don’t recall what I ever found on the other ID. It isn’t one that pops up at all really under any circumstances.

[fabiani12333]

I love that Curry Next Day card too -- it was on eBay for a long time. The width of the card is clearly too narrow relative to the inside border of the PSA case.

If I had knowledge of one of my cards being trimmed, I'm letting it go and trying to replace it. I cant stand the thought of having a trimmed card in my collection. It's basically garbage in my mind. I'm certain I have multiple trimmed cards in my collection, but I need proof of some kind before I can cast them out.

Fortunately I've so far avoided having one of my Curry cards outed as trimmed. I was very interested in buying one of the PSA 10 Contenders back in 2017 but I was turned off by the poor quality of the autographs. It appears I lucked out on that one.

[3124508 on COMC]

Probstein selling #5 on the list as "likely trimmed". Card is definitely trimmed and still in a BGS 9.5 slab. Buyer beware.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/362999182630

[regularp]

Any info on the Topps Gold Curry (340/2009) PWCC has up?

https://www.ebay.com/itm/2009-Topps-...AAAOSwT0lexwui

[deemsterz33]

Originally Posted by 3124508 on COMC

Probstein selling #5 on the list as "likely trimmed". Card is definitely trimmed and still in a BGS 9.5 slab. Buyer beware.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/362999182630

At least it's a step in the right direction?

[RogerGodahell]

Edward Scissorfingers and his gang just can't help themselves.

Like i said this won't stop until these people who are outed and caught are prosecuted to the same extent as people who forge money or forged art. They laugh at a slap on the wrist. Why stop when the money is so easy to be made? The reward far outweighs the risk...because there is no risk. Basically like printing free money.

[Deadshot]

Bumping this up - card #5 has 2 days left and is still going up in price.

[auburn35]

Giving this a bump, as one of the many cards from these pwcc sales that didn't have a before image was sold over the weekend, with a new psa label/case. Card comes from the same source/submission, being adjacent to the altered example #56 in the OP.

Years later, it's obvious pwcc and the grading companies haven't taken any accountability (bought back, released info,....) regarding these, so it's a good reminder of the hot potato's still in circulation. Maybe the bidders knew of the history, and didn't care?

https://www.psacard.com/cert/25682614


Altered example #56 from the OP, https://www.psacard.com/cert/25682613

[GOATcards]

re thread title
I'm just amazed that any Harden RCs sold