20-24: A Nesmith Odyssey

[Nomad]

Originally Posted by bkcardcollector

breakin outta the arena case.

Speaking of which, I have associations of Arena case with these like virtual auction drops they do? I don't quite get how one could stay sane as a collector and participate in those.

Unlike The NY Times rankings really rare Nesmith obviously a loss tier (or sell back) in the hobby at this point. Which is a benefit to collectors.

Thanks Pack for spreading the hype and the easy pickups. Speaking of 20-21 class, Pack's Bane collection came public I think after AofF thread had been going on for a minute and probably features factor of 3 more 1-1s at this point. Not sure about jersey numbers... I think double A was so under the radar so long that I might have swooped a few.

But it is always interesting to see the pick ups, because I can relate and understand how momentous they are. The /5 was it NT RPA impressed me the most. It is not just about the money, as a few collectors would probably be vying for that of anyone decent.

[bkcardcollector]

gotta get the rainbow from that flawless. You got printing plate, /5 and /20, missing /10 /15 and /1?

[Nomad]

I'm not really a rainbow collector, cause I feel like parallels are kind of a manufactured concept. I would rather have like three really nice examples, knowing that the lessers could easily be picked up in a pinch. For example, the Flawless dual /20 has equal or better patches then any /10 I have seen.

While I know some high-end collectors go for the near napkins, with distinctive GU stitch or interesting stains, I think generally you want vivid contrasts of colors (hence the terms 3-color, 4-color). In this case one patch has two-color (good luck finding 3 with Celtics) with the distinctive "N" stitching from Nesmith. The 1/1 is what I really want in this lineup (even the green-to-blue PP quest has been fulfilled, no need for the other two). And even the 1/1 at some unnamed point in the future, when I can afford it.

What I am saying is, my player super collection is so broad there are other fill-in priorities. Although, from a GU rookie perspective, yeah, the flawless dual non-auto are the low hanging fruit. 11 total Nesmith GU cards on the web and those are not getting replenished as I snipe them one by one (until we get to the four $1,200+ BIN Flawless RPAs run by a single non-shill collector).

I don't think high end collectors (not named Spinotron) really appreciate my situation. For a dedicated Shai collector with an average salary, just the Flawless dual patch RC rainbow alone would be the quest of a lifetime. Lebron, maybe a 20th year version of same. But Nesmith is so undervalued that my collection has good examples of every issue, and bucket list items in every category as well.

[bkcardcollector]

i saw an Arena set up booth at the nationals in a video on youtube

[Nomad]

Interesting... could you give a link? When I hear Arena, I always think of the design team at Fleer/Skybox back in the 1990s.

But this seems more like a team of software engineers who realized that most people don't want to wait days to open their repacks and tied that to physical encapsulation, vaulting, and marketplace capacities. I guess in IT you can purchase all those features now off the rack. Pretty soon they will also provide offers at like 80 percent of the cards they just sold (oh wait, the buyback feature essentially accomplishes that), completing the circle.

It's also a great zeitgeist tracker, as you can tell exactly which cards keep getting sold back and put back in the mystery queue (this actually becomes a self-referential algorithm that excludes anything but a few lottery like top names). Anyway, watch for a million clones if the model is successful.

[bkcardcollector]

... it was either in Packman's or cardcollector2

[Nomad]

Sorry, been busy listening to the playoff mic'd ups, there are a lot of interesting segments, including a defensive move that Haliburton laid on Nesmith or Nembhard, "cross street," then "back street." I was actually just thinking of that old video game Frogger.

[Nomad]

Originally Posted by Nomad

04-14-2024, 04:27 PM

I am kind of wrapping up the Nesmith collecting quest. I think I have taken it as far as it will go, at least purchase-wise (assuming that his prices go steadily up, I won't be able to afford anything better than what I have).

Concurrent with the Pacers making it into the playoffs for the first time in a few years, matched up against the IST revenge-seeking Bucks, I thought I would spread out my collection on these pages. Just kind of using the Nesmithian lens to explore the various sets of 20-21 and 22-23 and their permutations, and explain finally what everyone has been wondering: why Spectra is left completely out of the collection.*

So I'll finish up the self-referencing posts before going back into my shell by noting that I really am wrapping up the Nesmith quest. It extended a little longer than expected, as I thought of all the interesting parallels, unexpected gems, and oddball cards that I'll probably never have a chance to purchase again. But that list is almost exhausted.

I am moving into focusing on a specific year's subset (to be revealed) and can tell I am detaching from Nesmith through the fact that I am now searching through the much shorter lineup of signed 8x10s. I found exactly two that met my rare/unique criteria.



Above is Nesmith in his Pacers uniform, but signing #26. At first I thought it was signed soon after his trade to Indy, but it looks like the confident starter of 23-24 (although the squiggle after the "N" does look mid-to-late 2022). Anyway, I think what happened he had signed some Celtics photos for a collector earlier with his old jersey number, and just continued on. So while there are probably many of these photos signed, I think the jn error could be rare.



This is Rick Carlisle, Nesmith, Jalen Smith (center), and Chris Duarte. I like this cause has coach's sign... there can't be that many co-signed together player/coach pieces. Also, it is kind of a changing of the guard moment of the Pacers, when they were in an uncertain rebuild mode. Chris Duarte was traded long ago. Jalen Smith was an integral part of team, but recently traded to Bulls (dust off those Suns "x-ray specs" rookies).

If I was to guess, the thin pen toward center indicates an earlier signing, probably early 2022, shortly after Jalen joined Indiana. The darker, thicker signings considerately placed on the left were probably mid-to-late 2022, after Aaron joined the team. I would actually like to get Haliburton in the upper right to round this out.


In terms of the card collection, the 8x10s would go between the transitional 22-23 Hoops Celtics/Pacers combo (not my card) and the 22-23 NT Biography in green. Is it allowed to merge cards and other memorabilia in a single collection?

[Nomad]

Originally Posted by bkcardcollector

gotta get the rainbow from that flawless. You got printing plate, /5 and /20, missing /10 /15 and /1?

So I have been thinking about this some more, while considering which Flawless dual to purchase (I am all about GU at the moment, because there are so few out there).

I thought, bk really set me a challenge. I am almost there with a couple sets (flux, have the 1/1 cracked ice, true gold, and two other gold parallels, sunrise, moonlight on up, but missing a few hyper and Asian parallels). But I have never completed a 'smit rainbow.

On reflection, there are three reasons: 1) I think rainbows are a little contrived and hate to support Panini's insane print-more-cards marketing and distribution scheme. 2) My budget is limited. 3) I want to avoid getting completist about any one set in the collection. That's when it stops being fun.

So I had three dual-patch Flawless choices on the bay, for close enough to the same price to make them basically equal. My question to you is, which one do you choose?


#DP-ANS Gold /10


#DP-ANS Silver /20


#DP-ANS Silver /20

[bkcardcollector]

gold all day baby, you already got the /20 ... obvious...

[Nomad]

Nope. I went for the bottom card for several reasons.

1) The whole reason a Flawless dual patch card is interesting is the GU patches. There are 51 total of these cards made (20+15+10+5+1) and for me, until you get to the most limited levels, what drives uniqueness is not the color of the foil around the patch, or the stamping, but the patch itself.

2) This patch is something to behold. I have gone over a lot of Celtics patches over course of the collecting odyssey and can point to maybe 5 where I felt that they were really well thought out.

Here you have (bottom) a dual-color stitch patch creating a nice outer border for the (top) inner middle triangle of the Nesmith "M", inverted and rotated 15 degrees so that it matches the bottom, even appearing to create an N.


#DP-ANS Silver 4/20

3) We have established that rainbows are not really my thing. What is my thing is pairing visually striking cards. Such as the dual-patch Flawless /20 with the stitching from the "N" where the two triangles converge (below). Along with the "M" triangle, a top 1 percent part of the jersey.



4) There are lots of patches taken from the "square" elements of the BOSTON and NESMITH nameplates (and number 26), as with the /10 gold. That is a well trod aesthetic. With the gold (below) the two panels have no real connection that I can see.


#DP-ANS Gold /10

To sum up, a top two percent (2/51) GU dual-patch is much rarer than a /10 gold. Having the key triangle stitching of the “N” and “M” is significant, and they work together well as a pair. In an ideal world, this “M” piece would have been in the gold and I could have worked toward a rainbow, but I would choose the lesser tier and better patch always. Just as many prefer a gold /10 to a red or green /5 for aesthetic reasons, or an NT /99 vert to an NT /49 vert for wonky reasons.


The cloth from which the patch is made (not my jersey).

[bkcardcollector]

classic case of overthinking it

[Nomad]

Nah, this is where player collectors start to have fun.

[Nomad]

Originally Posted by Hallco

It would be the jersey number he is wearing on the team he played for at the time of the card release. So if you had a 2/50 but it was a year he played for Utah...that would NOT be a jersey number(it would need to be 6/50 6/99)etc...

(moved from other thread)

once you have kind of exhausted the primary jn cards that you would ever want (the 23/23 22-23 Elite my remaining grail) a few backward- or forward-looking second tier jns are also nice to have. Like I just purchased this 26/199 Mosaic with the past jn, it seemed to match how he is also looking backward in the image.





As far as this Mosaic goes, it has always been one of my favorite Nesmith cards, it's actually got some originality to the pose and image selection. It is along with the "subway ticket" 22-23 flux, my favorite Pacers uniform card. And it really pops in the black disco version, probably my favorite card to flash unencased.

[ninjacookies]

Would like to see him throw his name in the hat for the '28 elections.

Can't possibly be any worse than Ye or Ben Carson. And if it'd mean all 1 of my bkb brethrens will prosper...I'm all for it.

[Nomad]

I mean, he would be a mean ticket with McConnell.

[ninjacookies]

Assuming life expectancy and mental cognition, that's a solid backcourt.

[Nomad]

That dude gave McConnells a poor reputation for decades. Just like Bronny might be about to do for James.

[Nomad]

So, put the final touches on the Nesmith collection, to move on to another chapter in collecting journey. Hopefully actually higher end, getting into some 90s inserts again.

I think I have enough grails that, if stock in said invested player goes up, I can measurably benefit, without breaking up the core collection. I think the core will be basically not 1-1s, but cards that are meaningful but not properly valued for their rarity. I'm talking serial numbers and GU patches, as well as cool groupings, such as maybe the Crusade nebula 1/1 surrounded by tigers. A lot of collectors don't want that cause it's collegiate, but if you want the heraldic design with the coolest image, that's the only option.


Not quite there, dept. Imagine a world where the 1/1 nebula is surrounded by SSP tiger stripes.

These are like what I would consider core:

• The bookends. Have a surprising number of 01s and 75/75/75th type stuff.

• The GU patches. So basically anything Flawless.

• Some on-card autos. He doesn't have a lot and none past rookie season.

* Golds that look cool and might just be from inserts that are future classics.

• Cards that interact well with printing plates.


I see you Recon Rookie.

• And of course the elusive jersey numbers. This is a far from comprehensive survey, but I have:

7 one of ones.

2 collegiate 24 jersey numbers, including a perfect 24/24 contenders auto.

9 Boston 26 jersey numbers, including a perfect 26/26 contenders auto.

2 Pacers 23 jersey numbers.

This makes jersey number cards, actually more scarce than 1/1s, considering that I would probably have 40 1/1s if they were all like $20-50 on the Bay. Or rather, collectors are less willing to part with/apt to notice/feel it's worthwhile to list jersey number cards. So they are not really readily available, despite there being more parallels (usually and depending on jersey number—take note Luka 77 collectors) than versions of 1/1.

Anyway, this short essay is a way setting the stage for my capstone purchases, will get there when mailday arrives.

Quiz: which of these are not core?

[bkcardcollector]

i dont know about the xmas card but still top right

[Nomad]

From a generalist perspective yeah.

But for me it's a bookend (15/15 and pairs well with the not-shown diamond Flawless in pro uniform). It's funny, watching briefcases opened I didn't realize that the /20 diamond card is the base.

And not worth it to sell, considering its rarity. So, like most collegiate, it stays. All the autos are on card but the photo on the non-GU National Treasures irks me and I assume if I ever sold that would be highly valued. Something needs to go and it doesn't meet core criterion. I could live without it.

I am probably alone, but horizontal doesn't bother me, I like how the two inverse color jerseys pair, and they will not attract much cash (what is it like 4:1 skewed to vertical?) So they stay. The 2/5 might go, I have a /25 that looks just as nice.

Anyway, this is all hypothetical, Nesmith not even in the discussion as an enforcer. Motormouth Bev back in NBA when playoff quests solidify I guarantee you.

[ninjacookies]

Can't front. That ruby flawless made my Kirkland slacks semi-rigid.

Salute.

[Nomad]

One of my favorite patches, sure. I can't say any card has ever had that effect on me, not even the obligatory Qwasian WWE Star Cortese, though there was of course the topless playing deck back in high school. Which is probably TMI.

Anyway.

I don't know what's up with the vert patches Panini decided to do with all the gold Flawless RPAs (the ones at the upper echelon of eBay Nesmithiana). I much prefer the classic stripe. Nature's symbolism with an accidental lucky clover motif. The patch window not really big enough for a letter or number detail.

Okay, so I got to share this. Just picked up the 1/10 Hoops Artist's Proof Gold. I guess by virtue of this being Nesmith's first ever pro set, that's his first printed card. Is it really a proof? I think if it was, there would be a few mistakes on some, as with the silver foil Kobe Bryant rookie that I posited was a proof and thus first printed issue, given that TSC was his first pro set.

But dang. Then another gold came up on the Bay, at a price I could not afford to miss. This really eases my mind, cause I now have substantial bling to sell at some prospective show. Set up a Nesmith table with some dice, while holding back the museum core.

Pack was just commenting how affordable Lamello has become. I think our economy has become weak and collectors are like following the tulip frenzy end of the hobby. But this too shall pass.



All in all, one of my favorite Nesmith cards. Captures the way he kind of act cool and noncommitted after efforts nice, but less than peak. Used to make players go after him.

[bkcardcollector]

nice pickup. those hoops parallels are tough, there is a million packs.

interesting take on the proofs. I collect stamps and ya that's what it means but I think with cards it is just a stupid word they use. There is like artist and photographer and executive proofs where they sign the card back in the day.

[duron]

Originally Posted by Nomad

So, put the final touches on the Nesmith collection, to move on to another chapter in collecting journey. Hopefully actually higher end, getting into some 90s inserts again.

This made my Kirklands as snug as the queen of hearts from your high school deck.

I don’t think my mind can handle this Nomad pivot without the aid of Roganian nootropics.