Insane theft at the Dallas Card Show

[Raleigh504]

Even with the graded cards, they could easily crack them and resubmit them throughout the rest of the year and get a new cert on the cards to have it harder to trace. Granted I am not sure these guys are that smart.

[JRX]

Originally Posted by Raleigh504

Even with the graded cards, they could easily crack them and resubmit them throughout the rest of the year and get a new cert on the cards to have it harder to trace. Granted I am not sure these guys are that smart.

That's what I assume they would do. Still would be easy to trace the high end ones like the 52 mantles.

[MiamiMarlinsFan]

Originally Posted by JRX

That's what I assume they would do. Still would be easy to trace the high end ones like the 52 mantles.

Yup. Just like golden age comics, a some of those big vintage cards can be tracked by their imperfections.

[JRX]

Originally Posted by MiamiMarlinsFan

Yup. Just like golden age comics, a some of those big vintage cards can be tracked by their imperfections.

New copies just surfacing especially after a big heist is an obvious red flag as well.

[KhalDrogo]

Way too much scrutiny to crack and send anywhere to regrade. But like I said, these thieves weren’t very smart.

[Treadstone]

Police should check video from previous shows if available. They were probably casing the show and facility before setting this up…


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[Triple B]

To pull off a job like this with no secondary plan is foolish. Can't resell, can't regrade, can't snake away until later because the memory of these cards will be long. The only thing that would make sense of such an effort is if they already have a buyer who doesn't care about the heat.

[JRX]

Originally Posted by Triple B

To pull off a job like this with no secondary plan is foolish. Can't resell, can't regrade, can't snake away until later because the memory of these cards will be long. The only thing that would make sense of such an effort is if they already have a buyer who doesn't care about the heat.

Any chance its an inside job insurance scam? Let's say they already have a buyer, what's that person going to do just hold forever?

[Andr3000]

Originally Posted by Triple B

To pull off a job like this with no secondary plan is foolish. Can't resell, can't regrade, can't snake away until later because the memory of these cards will be long. The only thing that would make sense of such an effort is if they already have a buyer who doesn't care about the heat.

Maybe they are “collectors”.

All for the PC….

[kyle1707]

Hobby is filled with so much garbage.

So awful .. these d bags will get caught.

But WTF are you leaving those cards unattended

[njsportscardguy]

Originally Posted by mfw13

Honestly, I'm surprised that there isn't more theft at card shows.....many dealers are very careless about protecting their cards and get easily distracted.

I agree, a million percent! Far too many dealers have a "lackadaisical demeanor" at shows. I mean, it's not like they might have SIX TO SEVEN FIGURES of merchandise within a stones-throw, right...?!!? Oh...!?! Wait a minute...!??!

When my buddy & I used to do shows, regularly,....regardless of how big or small the show was, my wife-then girlfriend, was always (and I literally mean; ALWAYS!) at the shows, with us. She had...."one job" to do, throughout the entirety of the show; SIT THERE AND OBSERVE THE POTENTIAL CLIENTELE! She never caught anyone "red handed", stealing or trying to steal from us, however; I like to imagine that she likely deterred some folks who may have been contemplating the thought! While I'm virtually certain that we never escaped...."unscathed"....I'm fairly-confident that (if, any) the thievery which we incurred, was out of our $.25-$10 boxes, and nothing, from our display cases/shelves

Not trying to play the preachy police, here, and I'm sure that most people who set up at shows, already DO, but, nevertheless; you should certainly entertain the thought of bringing a loved one/trustworthy person with you, to do the exact same thing: SIT THERE, AND DO NOTHING ELSE BESIDES ATTENTIVELY-OBSERVE THE MERCH! Especially,...at high-traffic/high profile shows, where....unfortunately,....it's a guarantee that there will be more unscrupulous scoundrels in attendance!

[JRX]

Who leaves a 175k Mantle unattended?

[Enryon]

From the tape, it looks like a well executed attack. They took the time to evaluate and plan the heist. They knew which case was the target, as they only grabbed one and quite easily could have grabbed 2. They knew how many employees to distract and how to lure them away from the target. The security cams are not great and the thieves wore hats to help reduce camera visibility. The thief stacking chairs could be a weak point as he is leaving possible fingerprints, but he could be wearing clear vinyl gloves as the film is not real clear. Most people would not bat an eye at a custodian wearing gloves, even if he is stacking chairs.

As far as the case itself, I imagine it is in a trashcan or side of the road somewhere. It was probably trashed within a few minutes of the theft. The cards will be easy to track with their unique damage, but I imagine a buyer for some of the items is already lined up.

There are plenty of people out there that would care less if a card is stolen. They will put it in their collection and it will stay there till they die. If they show off the card to friends and family, nobody is going to check the PSA cert to see its status after seeing the card at a party or a family get together.

Note: My analysis only comes from what you see on the tape. I am extrapolating a worst case scenario from that tape and my own experience. Anybody claiming these thieves are stupid is making a mistake. This was clearly planned and executed well. The plan was simple and effective. It does not have to look like a movie heist to be effective. Up to this point, the thieves have been intelligent and calculated. What happens next may change that assessment.

Background. AML DD Analyst, Reg E investigator and IA investigator in the banking industry.

[mfw13]

Originally Posted by njsportscardguy

I agree, a million percent! Far too many dealers have a "lackadaisical demeanor" at shows. I mean, it's not like they might have SIX TO SEVEN FIGURES of merchandise within a stones-throw, right...?!!? Oh...!?! Wait a minute...!??!

When my buddy & I used to do shows, regularly,....regardless of how big or small the show was, my wife-then girlfriend, was always (and I literally mean; ALWAYS!) at the shows, with us. She had...."one job" to do, throughout the entirety of the show; SIT THERE AND OBSERVE THE POTENTIAL CLIENTELE! She never caught anyone "red handed", stealing or trying to steal from us, however; I like to imagine that she likely deterred some folks who may have been contemplating the thought! While I'm virtually certain that we never escaped...."unscathed"....I'm fairly-confident that (if, any) the thievery which we incurred, was out of our $.25-$10 boxes, and nothing, from our display cases/shelves

Not trying to play the preachy police, here, and I'm sure that most people who set up at shows, already DO, but, nevertheless; you should certainly entertain the thought of bringing a loved one/trustworthy person with you, to do the exact same thing: SIT THERE, AND DO NOTHING ELSE BESIDES ATTENTIVELY-OBSERVE THE MERCH! Especially,...at high-traffic/high profile shows, where....unfortunately,....it's a guarantee that there will be more unscrupulous scoundrels in attendance!

And the thing is, at a show like the National, many, if not most, dealers are going to have $1 million+ of merchandise at their booths.

[Cracktoast]

Really shocked someone has yet to organize some type of flash mob to hit bigger shows and hit several vendors at once. Overwhelm them with numbers and boom gone before they know what happened. You might catch 1 or 2 but the majority would likely get away. You don't have to know what to do after just hit the cases because anybody and everybody knows that's where the good stuff is.

[jjrpilot]

The last show I was at, dealers had littler HD cameras at their tables attached to stands pointing at the table and those who would come up to the table.

Smart move for sure.

[Stifle]

The acts I’m concerned about are those that are tied into groups. I had roughly 50 high end Brady rookies that I let go that were graded by a SW Company. The guy interested in my Brady cards was friends with the guys grading my Brady Rookies. I received the grades and they were what I thought I would receive since I didn’t do much grading. I didn’t sell to the individual wanting my Brady Rookies but I did keep the itinerary of what the cards were graded at and have shown a Blowout Member or 2 the sheet.

The same guy who was interested ended up not being able to do the next show in Chicago because he was given a huge amount of 9 1/2 graded. Not only was he not there multiple members within the Company were no longer there as well. I do know that the person that I sold to did regrade multiple cards for better grades probably gaining hundreds of thousands of dollars.

If those in the hobby believe those not in groups that receive better grades where those of us are not in these groups are then forced to receive lower grades due to the percentages that are graded. The only way a Company can be seen as legitimate is by having certain grades having certain percentages. Who takes the hit when a few people are receiving inflated grades on their cards, those of us not in those groups. How much is stolen in fraudulent grading, I would estimate MILLIONS, but it’s kept to a hush.

[hammerva]

If that group of people who are involved in the theft were not actually working for any of the tables at the show in some way, it definitely doesn't help the people who feel that they should be able to buy dealer passes for the National or being able to pre-VIP admittance

[Bcwcardz]

Originally Posted by JRX

Any chance its an inside job insurance scam? Let's say they already have a buyer, what's that person going to do just hold forever?

My thoughts exactly.


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[JRX]

Originally Posted by Cracktoast

Really shocked someone has yet to organize some type of flash mob to hit bigger shows and hit several vendors at once. Overwhelm them with numbers and boom gone before they know what happened. You might catch 1 or 2 but the majority would likely get away. You don't have to know what to do after just hit the cases because anybody and everybody knows that's where the good stuff is.

To be honest it would be a great target for one of those. Unless dealers can conceal carry at these events, there's no way to stop a flash mob.

[SmokeyJ]

Anyone ever thought to handcuff a case like that to your arm or leg? You know, like in the movies when someone hands over a "top secret" briefcase?

I mean, it's ridiculous to even think of such things, but I was trying to think of relatively easy ways to make a quick grab difficult.

[hammertime]

Originally Posted by SmokeyJ

Anyone ever thought to handcuff a case like that to your arm or leg? You know, like in the movies when someone hands over a "top secret" briefcase?

I mean, it's ridiculous to even think of such things, but I was trying to think of relatively easy ways to make a quick grab difficult.

[auctionjmm]

Originally Posted by Stifle

The acts I’m concerned about are those that are tied into groups. I had roughly 50 high end Brady rookies that I let go that were graded by a SW Company. The guy interested in my Brady cards was friends with the guys grading my Brady Rookies. I received the grades and they were what I thought I would receive since I didn’t do much grading. I didn’t sell to the individual wanting my Brady Rookies but I did keep the itinerary of what the cards were graded at and have shown a Blowout Member or 2 the sheet.

The same guy who was interested ended up not being able to do the next show in Chicago because he was given a huge amount of 9 1/2 graded. Not only was he not there multiple members within the Company were no longer there as well. I do know that the person that I sold to did regrade multiple cards for better grades probably gaining hundreds of thousands of dollars.

If those in the hobby believe those not in groups that receive better grades where those of us are not in these groups are then forced to receive lower grades due to the percentages that are graded. The only way a Company can be seen as legitimate is by having certain grades having certain percentages. Who takes the hit when a few people are receiving inflated grades on their cards, those of us not in those groups. How much is stolen in fraudulent grading, I would estimate MILLIONS, but it’s kept to a hush.

This post is maybe 5 years outdated. You are correct that at one point there were groups who knew the percentage of 10's they would get before even submitting. I am aware of one prominent dealer/owner of a large card business who didn't even look at his cards before sending them in. He already knew the percentage of 10's.

BUT, my understanding is that all came to a screeching halt once PSA was under the microscope. Now grading is as tough as it's ever been and there is no preferential treatment any longer. Obviously those cards previously graded will forever have asterisks, but I'm not aware of any guys who are currently getting those same deals unless it's through a smaller company. If anything, people have recently complained that PSA is TOO strict on their criteria.

[auctionjmm]

Originally Posted by hammerva

If that group of people who are involved in the theft were not actually working for any of the tables at the show in some way, it definitely doesn't help the people who feel that they should be able to buy dealer passes for the National or being able to pre-VIP admittance

I actually think it's the opposite. The lack of dealer badges, while possibly keeping out non-dealers, is also going to hurt the dealers who are used to having more hands and eyes working the booth. If you normally bring 8 employees and now you have 3, it's gonna be harder to keep eyes on everything. Especially considering that most will drive-in and drive out to setup. Now you have one guy in the vehicle and maybe two to keep an eye out. You'd like to think you can trust other dealers, but with 400+ dealers, do you really know that none of them are capable of committing theft? Something to think about.

[daverat]

Man that's unfortunate and disgusting all in one, I was at the show yesterday.

Why is the video so grainy? I mean it's 2024 my s24 takes better videos than this.

What are these idiots thinking, are they going to try to flip these at another show? crack them out and sell raw? crack and sub them?