Observations on the current state of the hobby from a show this weekend - Page 124

TXRunner · 10-17-2023, 04:28 PM

A few weeks ago I went to my first card show in many many years. It was kind of a sensory overload. I don't know how anyone finds anything unless they have a game plan and are looking for something specific. After walking the floor several times and just seeing hundreds of slabs all blending together, decided I was going to just go for raw cards. I pull up to one of the vendors who had a large number of raw boxes separated by sport and teams. Prices were clearly listed on the boxes and ended up grabbing about 10 cards from them. Then later on I went to a booth, dad and son, and they had a box of raw cards of some of the rookie stars. No price on the box. So when I asked how much, they whipped out their phone and started scrolling ebay for comps. That kind of sucked. I ended up getting some decent price on the cards, but whipping out the phone for pricing kind of threw me off at first and almost walked away from the deal but decided to stick it out because the son was talking to me about college and high school baseball.

Posted this over in the grading forum, but one thing that stood out to me at the show was the young kids fiending for PSA slabs. I was at one vendor when a kid walked over and was asking about a certain player and if he had any slabs. The vendor showed him some SGC slabs he had. The kid responded "naw, I only mess with PSA". The kid was 10, maybe 11. Just shook my head and moved on.

MoreToppsPlease · 10-17-2023, 06:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TXRunner

Posted this over in the grading forum, but one thing that stood out to me at the show was the young kids fiending for PSA slabs. I was at one vendor when a kid walked over and was asking about a certain player and if he had any slabs. The vendor showed him some SGC slabs he had. The kid responded "naw, I only mess with PSA". The kid was 10, maybe 11. Just shook my head and moved on.

Socialized by his dad who undoubtedly does the same to the world on social media. Dad probably works for PSA and/or makes a living selling slabs.

hammerva · 10-18-2023, 08:25 AM

My biggest thing with the flippers is I just wish some of these people would show their homework. All of these people who say they took a $50 card, bought it for $30, and then sold it for $60 never really do that. Either influencer premiums are a thing and that is why people are willing to spend more for the exact same card or your math isn't holding up. And the lucky thing for them is that you really can't do your homework because the same way you sold the card (bought 3 or 4 in bulk) is the same way you got the card in the first place.

Raleigh504 · 10-18-2023, 08:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hammerva

My biggest thing with the flippers is I just wish some of these people would show their homework. All of these people who say they took a $50 card, bought it for $30, and then sold it for $60 never really do that. Either influencer premiums are a thing and that is why people are willing to spend more for the exact same card or your math isn't holding up. And the lucky thing for them is that you really can't do your homework because the same way you sold the card (bought 3 or 4 in bulk) is the same way you got the card in the first place.

I see that on WhatNot, people buying cards for more than they could on eBay.

Also for the premium part, I can see them saying they sold it for more when in reality they added other cards in the deal but decide to not include it in their promotions.

livealoha · 10-18-2023, 08:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MoreToppsPlease

Socialized by his dad who undoubtedly does the same to the world on social media. Dad probably works for PSA and/or makes a living selling slabs.

Do a ton of people “truly” make a living by selling slabs? (Or do most just sell as a hobby?)

whattheblood · 10-18-2023, 10:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TXRunner

A few weeks ago I went to my first card show in many many years. It was kind of a sensory overload. I don't know how anyone finds anything unless they have a game plan and are looking for something specific. After walking the floor several times and just seeing hundreds of slabs all blending together, decided I was going to just go for raw cards. I pull up to one of the vendors who had a large number of raw boxes separated by sport and teams. Prices were clearly listed on the boxes and ended up grabbing about 10 cards from them. Then later on I went to a booth, dad and son, and they had a box of raw cards of some of the rookie stars. No price on the box. So when I asked how much, they whipped out their phone and started scrolling ebay for comps. That kind of sucked. I ended up getting some decent price on the cards, but whipping out the phone for pricing kind of threw me off at first and almost walked away from the deal but decided to stick it out because the son was talking to me about college and high school baseball.

Posted this over in the grading forum, but one thing that stood out to me at the show was the young kids fiending for PSA slabs. I was at one vendor when a kid walked over and was asking about a certain player and if he had any slabs. The vendor showed him some SGC slabs he had. The kid responded "naw, I only mess with PSA". The kid was 10, maybe 11. Just shook my head and moved on.

I dont deal with the phone people. I keep it moving if they start googling cards.

hammerva · 10-18-2023, 10:31 AM

There is a serious calculation that you have to go through at bigger shows for collectors. Is the cost of over paying shipping fees on Ebay or other places worth being able to find a particular card is less than 10 minutes instead of going through 500 random disorganized boxes hoping that the card is actually there.

See 2023 Bowman Chrome University football at the Chantilly show this weekend

jkampis · 10-19-2023, 05:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raleigh504

I see that on WhatNot, people buying cards for more than they could on eBay.

More often than not, it’s the opposite. Whatnot is generally a buyer’s platform. Only in the bigger streams do you usually see people overpay.

hammerva · 10-19-2023, 07:57 AM

Maybe it is just me but it seems the overpay on Whatnot is relative to the speed that the stuff is set up. A lot of these bigger streams are these stupid (for us not the dealers) rapid fire listing and to me that is just straight up gambling hoping for a deal.

JohnnyAppleseed · 10-19-2023, 08:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hammerva

Maybe it is just me but it seems the overpay on Whatnot is relative to the speed that the stuff is set up. A lot of these bigger streams are these stupid (for us not the dealers) rapid fire listing and to me that is just straight up gambling hoping for a deal.

Yeah if you hop onto whatnot thinking you can sell cards at 50% over comps... that's not likely to happen. A lot of times when that occurs it's either a bidding war or the "sudden death" style listings that cause wild overpays.

Usually I net about 75-85% of ebay comps when I sell on whatnot. It depends on the day, the inventory itself, etc. But it is offset somewhat by being able to clear out inventory rather efficiently. Team/player collectors might buy a lot of 10 inserts for $2 that you'd probably never sell, even at 10 cents a piece at a show.

ironfireman · 10-19-2023, 08:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hammerva

There is a serious calculation that you have to go through at bigger shows for collectors. Is the cost of over paying shipping fees on Ebay or other places worth being able to find a particular card is less than 10 minutes instead of going through 500 random disorganized boxes hoping that the card is actually there.

See 2023 Bowman Chrome University football at the Chantilly show this weekend

Going to a show looking for specific cards can be a bit of a misfire. The best tact I've found is to just go and look for deals. Also, sometimes you don't know the level of deal based on sticker price. I've run across dealers who will drop price 50% immediately. (of course they usually start from "book" price lol) Other guys usually come down 20%-40% depending on how much many you buy. Some won't come down at all. It never hurts to pick out a card or 3 and ask for a price.

The 300 table Hickory, NC Show this past weekend was a fairly small crowd. Seems like some dealers mighta went to Nashville. Many dealers had been given extra tables. Most complained of it being slow. I did see one regular dealer working pretty hard and it took him 20 mins to get to me. So, if you have good stuff and are willing to deal seems like business as usual.

f2tornado · 10-19-2023, 08:41 AM

No slowdown in crowds at the ND and MN shows I've been at recently. Same observations others motioned like more and more kids wheeling and dealing for slabs and the occasional dealer looking up comps. Yes, it can also be hard to find specific cards if they're not relatively new or common. 1990s and 2000s stuff is severely lacking making it a breath of fresh air when I do come across a dealer with a decent assortment to pick through. It's otherwise the same late model Prizm and Mosaic at half the tables.

I mainly go to shows to plow through low rent boxes finding the occasional bargain or potential PSA 10 in the rough. I don't have much competition for that stuff which is nice. That said, I'm hoping to get the the National next year for the first time and use some time to simply enjoy the museum aspects of it.

theshowandme · 10-19-2023, 09:22 AM

If you ever see me buying/selling on WhatNot just suspect I’m being held hostage and being forced to

kyle1707 · 10-19-2023, 02:07 PM

Local shows both were very good

The 2 main stores in town said. Can’t get new wax. Which makes it very difficult to be profitable .. used to get 5 cases of everything. Now he can get a few boxes. But we watch all those goofs on YouTube opening 50 cases a week.

Also ultra modern singles 2017-2023 are in the tank price wise

So wax prices are still 2x-5x to high. But what comes out of the boxes prices are all down

thenightman · 10-19-2023, 06:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ironfireman

Going to a show looking for specific cards can be a bit of a misfire. The best tact I've found is to just go and look for deals. Also, sometimes you don't know the level of deal based on sticker price. I've run across dealers who will drop price 50% immediately. (of course they usually start from "book" price lol) Other guys usually come down 20%-40% depending on how much many you buy. Some won't come down at all. It never hurts to pick out a card or 3 and ask for a price.

The 300 table Hickory, NC Show this past weekend was a fairly small crowd. Seems like some dealers mighta went to Nashville. Many dealers had been given extra tables. Most complained of it being slow. I did see one regular dealer working pretty hard and it took him 20 mins to get to me. So, if you have good stuff and are willing to deal seems like business as usual.

I'm taking this tact the next time I hit a show. The last few times I hit the DCS, I came with a good idea of 5 to 10 players I wanted to target in the major 3 sports. I got some stuff, but I felt like I missed some deals on other things. When I'd go before, I'd just look for deals, and at the end of the day that resulted in a better return on my investment than what I've done recently.

theshowandme · 10-20-2023, 08:44 PM

Fun day at Chantilly today

Some dealers shoot themselves in the foot and it’s confusing to watch

No reason to purposely drive people away from your tables by putting out junk and/or not pricing your cards

ddearing · 10-20-2023, 09:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theshowandme

Fun day at Chantilly today

Some dealers shoot themselves in the foot and it’s confusing to watch

No reason to purposely drive people away from your tables by putting out junk and/or not pricing your cards

Good to see you today. Sorry I was a bit busy. Sold out of all my wax today, so will have more time to hang tomorrow.

theshowandme · 10-21-2023, 02:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ddearing

Good to see you today. Sorry I was a bit busy. Sold out of all my wax today, so will have more time to hang tomorrow.

Keep buying! Glad you got the upgraded spot.

The way was definitely priced to move.

hammerva · 10-21-2023, 06:06 AM

Good show yesterday at Chantilly. While I like that they added more spaces and it seemed like the dealers there were newer ones, it was a little clunky. I know it is nitpicking but I do enjoy the "up and down" viewing nature of the shows. But hey I got some new dealers to look at so can't complain. Didn't see a lot of the newer 2023 football out there but maybe it was just stuffed in the $5 - $10 boxes . That is my plans for this morning.

Like that they did a kids trade night at the venue. As far as I know there isn't a bigger one scheduled. There wasn't one last time if I remember

TarjetasBéisbol · 10-21-2023, 11:57 AM

Nice traffic at the show yesterday but didn't pick up anything. Like hammerva mentioned, looks like there are a few new dealers. I was very impressed with some of the tobacco cards that were at the show.

theshowandme · 10-21-2023, 06:24 PM

Chantilly was great. The conversations with dealers alone make it worth it. Glad to see many friends as well.

theshowandme · 10-23-2023, 09:20 AM

Saw a young man ask a dealer, "when was the last time you priced these?" after staring at his phone for 5-10 minutes.

Were people raised in a barn?

JoinerCP · 10-23-2023, 09:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theshowandme

Saw a young man ask a dealer, "when was the last time you priced these?" after staring at his phone for 5-10 minutes.

Were people raised in a barn?

For those of us too dense to understand this: what are we supposed to intuit from this? That buyers shouldn't question a sellers prices?

Serious question, I've not been to a show in 20 years.

hermanotarjeta · 10-23-2023, 09:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theshowandme

Saw a young man ask a dealer, "when was the last time you priced these?" after staring at his phone for 5-10 minutes.

Were people raised in a barn?

I think some dealers still go by Beckett monthly.

Crosby 87 · 10-23-2023, 09:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theshowandme

Saw a young man ask a dealer, "when was the last time you priced these?" after staring at his phone for 5-10 minutes.

Were people raised in a barn?

Damned if you do, damned if you don't I guess.

"No reason to purposely drive people away from your tables by putting out junk and/or not pricing your cards"

What you may consider dealers putting put "junk" other buyers may not consider it junk.

10-17-2023, 04:28 PM	#3076
TXRunner Member Join Date: Oct 2022 Posts: 1,023	A few weeks ago I went to my first card show in many many years. It was kind of a sensory overload. I don't know how anyone finds anything unless they have a game plan and are looking for something specific. After walking the floor several times and just seeing hundreds of slabs all blending together, decided I was going to just go for raw cards. I pull up to one of the vendors who had a large number of raw boxes separated by sport and teams. Prices were clearly listed on the boxes and ended up grabbing about 10 cards from them. Then later on I went to a booth, dad and son, and they had a box of raw cards of some of the rookie stars. No price on the box. So when I asked how much, they whipped out their phone and started scrolling ebay for comps. That kind of sucked. I ended up getting some decent price on the cards, but whipping out the phone for pricing kind of threw me off at first and almost walked away from the deal but decided to stick it out because the son was talking to me about college and high school baseball. Posted this over in the grading forum, but one thing that stood out to me at the show was the young kids fiending for PSA slabs. I was at one vendor when a kid walked over and was asking about a certain player and if he had any slabs. The vendor showed him some SGC slabs he had. The kid responded "naw, I only mess with PSA". The kid was 10, maybe 11. Just shook my head and moved on. Last edited by TXRunner; 10-17-2023 at 04:31 PM.

10-21-2023, 11:57 AM	#3095
TarjetasBéisbol Member Join Date: Feb 2013 Location: NOVA Posts: 10,896	Nice traffic at the show yesterday but didn't pick up anything. Like hammerva mentioned, looks like there are a few new dealers. I was very impressed with some of the tobacco cards that were at the show. __________________ De oppresso liber - RLTW "The Mexicans taught me that trick", "Let me be very clear, crystal clear"

10-18-2023, 08:25 AM	#3078
hammerva Member Join Date: Aug 2021 Posts: 598	My biggest thing with the flippers is I just wish some of these people would show their homework. All of these people who say they took a $50 card, bought it for $30, and then sold it for $60 never really do that. Either influencer premiums are a thing and that is why people are willing to spend more for the exact same card or your math isn't holding up. And the lucky thing for them is that you really can't do your homework because the same way you sold the card (bought 3 or 4 in bulk) is the same way you got the card in the first place.

10-18-2023, 10:31 AM	#3082
hammerva Member Join Date: Aug 2021 Posts: 598	There is a serious calculation that you have to go through at bigger shows for collectors. Is the cost of over paying shipping fees on Ebay or other places worth being able to find a particular card is less than 10 minutes instead of going through 500 random disorganized boxes hoping that the card is actually there. See 2023 Bowman Chrome University football at the Chantilly show this weekend

10-19-2023, 07:57 AM	#3084
hammerva Member Join Date: Aug 2021 Posts: 598	Maybe it is just me but it seems the overpay on Whatnot is relative to the speed that the stuff is set up. A lot of these bigger streams are these stupid (for us not the dealers) rapid fire listing and to me that is just straight up gambling hoping for a deal.

10-19-2023, 08:41 AM	#3087
f2tornado Member Join Date: Dec 2019 Location: Bismarck, ND Posts: 2,356 f2tornado f2tornado	No slowdown in crowds at the ND and MN shows I've been at recently. Same observations others motioned like more and more kids wheeling and dealing for slabs and the occasional dealer looking up comps. Yes, it can also be hard to find specific cards if they're not relatively new or common. 1990s and 2000s stuff is severely lacking making it a breath of fresh air when I do come across a dealer with a decent assortment to pick through. It's otherwise the same late model Prizm and Mosaic at half the tables. I mainly go to shows to plow through low rent boxes finding the occasional bargain or potential PSA 10 in the rough. I don't have much competition for that stuff which is nice. That said, I'm hoping to get the the National next year for the first time and use some time to simply enjoy the museum aspects of it.

10-19-2023, 09:22 AM	#3088
theshowandme Member Join Date: Nov 2020 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 5,082 theshowandme nova_cards	If you ever see me buying/selling on WhatNot just suspect I’m being held hostage and being forced to

10-19-2023, 02:07 PM	#3089
kyle1707 Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 20,524	Local shows both were very good The 2 main stores in town said. Can’t get new wax. Which makes it very difficult to be profitable .. used to get 5 cases of everything. Now he can get a few boxes. But we watch all those goofs on YouTube opening 50 cases a week. Also ultra modern singles 2017-2023 are in the tank price wise So wax prices are still 2x-5x to high. But what comes out of the boxes prices are all down

10-20-2023, 08:44 PM	#3091
theshowandme Member Join Date: Nov 2020 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 5,082 theshowandme nova_cards	Fun day at Chantilly today Some dealers shoot themselves in the foot and it’s confusing to watch No reason to purposely drive people away from your tables by putting out junk and/or not pricing your cards

10-21-2023, 06:06 AM	#3094
hammerva Member Join Date: Aug 2021 Posts: 598	Good show yesterday at Chantilly. While I like that they added more spaces and it seemed like the dealers there were newer ones, it was a little clunky. I know it is nitpicking but I do enjoy the "up and down" viewing nature of the shows. But hey I got some new dealers to look at so can't complain. Didn't see a lot of the newer 2023 football out there but maybe it was just stuffed in the $5 - $10 boxes . That is my plans for this morning. Like that they did a kids trade night at the venue. As far as I know there isn't a bigger one scheduled. There wasn't one last time if I remember

10-21-2023, 06:24 PM	#3096
theshowandme Member Join Date: Nov 2020 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 5,082 theshowandme nova_cards	Chantilly was great. The conversations with dealers alone make it worth it. Glad to see many friends as well.

10-23-2023, 09:20 AM	#3097
theshowandme Member Join Date: Nov 2020 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 5,082 theshowandme nova_cards	Saw a young man ask a dealer, "when was the last time you priced these?" after staring at his phone for 5-10 minutes. Were people raised in a barn?