Yordan Alvarez

[BBases31]

Originally Posted by Archangel1775

Someone brought up 2001. The old saying "The cream rises to the top.". The most sought after 2001 cards for Pujols and Ichiro outside their two main autos are their Topps Chrome Refractor and SP Authentic cards. They go for thousands today. I'm sure back then they weren't overly expensive.

Pujol's base TC rookie goes for $170. Yordan's is $3 and his refractor is $7. And you don't need me to tell you how many multiples more of Yordan's stuff was printed. Why you keep comparing two guys who are hobby giants with 2001 level print runs to a hobby afterthought that was in every set in the super printed year of 2020, I don't know

I also don't understand why you guys just can't accept Yordan's hobby drawbacks that are weighing him down. Accept that you collect the best hitter in baseball and be happy about it, no need to delude yourself about his "investment" potential

[ScooterD]

Originally Posted by BBases31

Pujol's base TC rookie goes for $170. Yordan's is $3 and his refractor is $7. And you don't need me to tell you how many multiples more of Yordan's stuff was printed. Why you keep comparing two guys who are hobby giants with 2001 level print runs to a hobby afterthought that was in every set in the super printed year of 2020, I don't know

Just trying to understand - no horse in this race.

If the Pujols and Yordan TC rookie base and refractors are different print runs, then your comparison of value is apples to oranges. What is the Pujols PR for his traded retrofractor, and what is a congruent PR (parallel) for a TC Yordan RC? How do those compare?

This also doesn’t include that Pujols doesn’t have prospect cards like Yordan does. That should be taken into account too… but not sure what the discussion looks like

[rngrdanny22]

Originally Posted by ScooterD

Just trying to understand - no horse in this race.

If the Pujols and Yordan TC rookie base and refractors are different print runs, then your comparison of value is apples to oranges. What is the Pujols PR for his traded retrofractor, and what is a congruent PR (parallel) for a TC Yordan RC? How do those compare?

This also doesn’t include that Pujols doesn’t have prospect cards like Yordan does. That should be taken into account too… but not sure what the discussion looks like

There's estimates out there that the 2001 TC Retrofractor has a print run of 500. Saw that on multiple sites, but definitely can't confirm.

As for comparison's sake, there aren't any 2020 TC Yordan's with that print run. Either stuff way over that, or way under that.

The other factor to consider about the 2001's (regardless of print run) is the actual availability on the market. Many of these are locked up, never to be seen again. So, honestly, we're probably looking at a ~100 that would ever be made available again (assuming the 500 PR is accurate).

I'd say a TC blue refractor is a decent comp.

[ScooterD]

^^^^ All good points!

[ironfireman]

Originally Posted by BBases31

Pujol's base TC rookie goes for $170. Yordan's is $3 and his refractor is $7. And you don't need me to tell you how many multiples more of Yordan's stuff was printed. Why you keep comparing two guys who are hobby giants with 2001 level print runs to a hobby afterthought that was in every set in the super printed year of 2020, I don't know

I also don't understand why you guys just can't accept Yordan's hobby drawbacks that are weighing him down. Accept that you collect the best hitter in baseball and be happy about it, no need to delude yourself about his "investment" potential

Yordan is obviosly a great bat, but to even mention him on the same page as Puljols is... Pujols had 45.7 WAR at 26 Yordan has 18.6. Pujols was also top 4 in MVP every year since he his debut going 4th, 2cnd, 2cnd 3rd, 1st & 2cnd + a Gold glove - Yordan has appeared in the MVP voting once getting 3rd in '22 - probably won't be top 10 this year.

[regularp]

Back on the board, boys.

[wiper]

lol eovaldi

[Onepocketj]

Better

[Archangel1775]

Originally Posted by BBases31

Pujol's base TC rookie goes for $170. Yordan's is $3 and his refractor is $7. And you don't need me to tell you how many multiples more of Yordan's stuff was printed. Why you keep comparing two guys who are hobby giants with 2001 level print runs to a hobby afterthought that was in every set in the super printed year of 2020, I don't know

Why in the world do you believe I'm comparing the two directly? Topps Chrome v Topps Chrome? If I was, why would I use SP Authentic as an example? You seem to be bunching together LOW NUMBERD YORDAN cards with the MASS-PRODUCED cards. Your quote:

"He's just a terrible investment any way you look at it."

The point is, there are cards in 2020 that will set themselves apart from the rest as time moves forward. Registry sets will have a big impact on that. What those cards or sets are, I have no idea.

"The cream will rise to the top"

That's my general point and it applies to any player's cards from 2020.

[Archangel1775]

Originally Posted by ironfireman

Yordan is obviosly a great bat, but to even mention him on the same page as Puljols is... Pujols had 45.7 WAR at 26 Yordan has 18.6. Pujols was also top 4 in MVP every year since he his debut going 4th, 2cnd, 2cnd 3rd, 1st & 2cnd + a Gold glove - Yordan has appeared in the MVP voting once getting 3rd in '22 - probably won't be top 10 this year.

Nobody is directly comparing Yordan to Pujols. Nobody is directly comparing Yordan's Topps Chrome to Pujols Topps Chrome. Double B just misunderstood or is literally making things up as he goes. The relationship has to do with high print run years with multiple rookie card brands and the potential for certain issues to "stand-out" from the rest. To avoid confusion, one example used was 2001 SP Authentic. Though there was high initial demand, the price was never out of line. I dont have 2001 prices as of yet but the 2005 Standard Catalog of Baseball Cards has the Ichiro Future Watch at $80 and the Pujols Future Watch at $160. Each has a print run of /1250. Fast forward to today and they are 4 figure cards. Which is my general point "The cream will rise to the top" for 2020 cards. Doesn't matter what player or set.

[JRX]

Originally Posted by ironfireman

Yordan is obviosly a great bat, but to even mention him on the same page as Puljols is... Pujols had 45.7 WAR at 26 Yordan has 18.6. Pujols was also top 4 in MVP every year since he his debut going 4th, 2cnd, 2cnd 3rd, 1st & 2cnd + a Gold glove - Yordan has appeared in the MVP voting once getting 3rd in '22 - probably won't be top 10 this year.

Yordan is also well north of 200lbs and has knee problems. He's probably going to be good until around 30 and then unless they invent a new kind of ped, his body will fall apart.

[Archangel1775]

Originally Posted by JRX

Yordan is also well north of 200lbs and has knee problems. He's probably going to be good until around 30 and then unless they invent a new kind of ped, his body will fall apart.

This applies to any player but as health, fitness and technology grow, you have to hope the athlete take care of themselves. If he starts to look like Pablo Sandoval, then yeah, it wouldn't look good for the future. There are many players like Eric Davis, David Wright and Felix Hernandez that didn't age well either. Just gotta hope he ages similar to David Ortiz.

[JRX]

Originally Posted by Archangel1775

This applies to any player but as health, fitness and technology grow, you have to hope the athlete take care of themselves. If he starts to look like Pablo Sandoval, then yeah, it wouldn't look good for the future. There are many players like Eric Davis, David Wright and Felix Hernandez that didn't age well either. Just gotta hope he ages similar to David Ortiz.

Not every player is that heavy and already had surgeries on both knees. Anything can happen to players see Mattingly or Wright, but when you're already dealing with these kinds of issues at we're assuming 26 it doesn't look good for your longevity.

[Archangel1775]

Originally Posted by JRX

Not every player is that heavy and already had surgeries on both knees. Anything can happen to players see Mattingly or Wright, but when you're already dealing with these kinds of issues at we're assuming 26 it doesn't look good for your longevity.

You make it sounds like the man had knee replacement surgery. It was a slight patellar tendon tear that seemed to happen in the minors sliding into base years prior and minor arthroscopic on the other. It happens in athletes. Heck, 300 pound plus offensive and defensive linemen in the NFL come back from complete ACL tears all the time. The only thing left to say is that we'll see what happens.

[regularp]

Wheels = 70

[Archangel1775]

Originally Posted by regularp

Wheels = 70

The irony

[Archangel1775]

Yordan according to JRX and BB:



Reality:

[BGeezy]

Originally Posted by Archangel1775

You make it sounds like the man had knee replacement surgery. It was a slight patellar tendon tear that seemed to happen in the minors sliding into base years prior and minor arthroscopic on the other. It happens in athletes. Heck, 300 pound plus offensive and defensive linemen in the NFL come back from complete ACL tears all the time. The only thing left to say is that we'll see what happens.

The other knee surgery was minor "routine cleanup" they did since he was already going under the knife. Nothing major.

It's almost like some people just read headlines and don't know wtf they're talking about.

[JRX]

You want to buy up his cards over the next 4-5yrs go for it. If you're thinking he's going to still be going strong when his stated age is 36, I think you're taking on a lot of risk.

[pewe]

Too bad he’s sick tonight (even illness doesn’t dent him!!!)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[JRX]

Originally Posted by BGeezy

The other knee surgery was minor "routine cleanup" they did since he was already going under the knife. Nothing major.

It's almost like some people just read headlines and don't know wtf they're talking about.

He's effectively a DH only that's played 144, 135, and 114 games the last three years. The amount of people that rip Trout for not playing full seasons and you think this guy is going to be going strong for 10+ when he can't even play full seasons in his early 20s.

[Archangel1775]

Originally Posted by JRX

He's effectively a DH only that's played 144, 135, and 114 games the last three years. The amount of people that rip Trout for not playing full seasons and you think this guy is going to be going strong for 10+ when he can't even play full seasons in his early 20s.

Well there you go, a full-time DH at 36. I'll take that. I think there will be a team that'll take the chance with the level of hitter he is. But let's not get ahead of ourselves. I'll stick with the 5-year plan and spend the $250 here and there for his low numbered cards that I like. You do you, I'm sure there are other threads you can save people in.

[green4407]

Originally Posted by Archangel1775

This applies to any player but as health, fitness and technology grow, you have to hope the athlete take care of themselves. If he starts to look like Pablo Sandoval, then yeah, it wouldn't look good for the future. There are many players like Eric Davis, David Wright and Felix Hernandez that didn't age well either. Just gotta hope he ages similar to David Ortiz.

Whoa hold on here Archangel!. Eric's problem years were age 27-33 due to constant injuries to the point he took a whole year off.

Ages 34-38 he was great, even after beating cancer mid-season 1997.

Age 36 in 1998:

28 hr, 89 rbi, .327, .388, .582

[Archangel1775]

Wait, you mean he recovered? Impossible! Player's just don't recover to play well after Age 30!

[hammertime]

The man can mash the ball.