2022 Marvel Fleer Ultra Avengers (Upper Deck, 2022)

[DynaEtch]

Agreed Im not seeing singles prices on the secondary market justify the price per box.

For one, we are in a down market for cards in general, which is a major factor, but there is something more regarding this particular set that Im trying to put my finger on.

-The number of inserts is jacked up, you get like 1 per pack, and many are cheap...they are all over the place and there isnt much of a cohesive identity with this set.

-As usual in modern UD marvel, several insert sets with a huge checklist. 30-50 card insert sets (remember when marvel cards would have a just a few 5-12 card chase sets). The problem with this is it kills the set for set collectors. How many people are putting together 30-card Ultra Power sets, etc? Therefore any character that is not collected by character-collectors in these sets probably wont hold value- who is the audience for that card?

-Too many relics among the comic cuts, clippings, marvel value stamps, coin relics etc. Some like the comic cuts, but Im not really a fan, especially when they are using bronze age to modern age, when the book itself could be had for a couple bucks.

-The insert sets dont really have top marvel-card names. Outside the top avengers Cap, Iron Man, Hulk, Scarlet Witch, Black Panther, Thor and Thanos (none of which are at the top of the hobby totem pole), there's a lot of mediocre avengers related names. Look at the list of 30 jambalayas..jamba of Ares, Ronan, Crossbones, Korvac, etc? Even if you hit a big insert like this you lose money in the box.

-We are hit with all these parallels....completely new ordering and color scheme of blues, amethysts, burgundy's etc, with no precedent. How does a collector relate to that, when streaming through the endless ebay listings? It's not like a Topps baseball set that has gold #'d out of that year or topps blacks put out every year that have a history...or even Masterpieces now with the epic purples and legendary oranges.

-Artist autos are cool and neat addition, but like even creator autos from comics, they just arent valued as, say sports autos are.

-While the base has fresh original art which I like, most of the inserts dont (unlike Masterpieces). So again the set has this mish-mash feel rather than single identity.

-It's hard to even tell what are the best cards to get (I guess emerald and black medallions? artist auto animation cel?). Which are nearly impossible to pull given the print run which is looking huge the more I look at it.

Maybe some or combination of the above. Not trying to be too negative on the set because I do like it, just not for $300-400 a box. The money isnt there.

[kyle1707]

Originally Posted by DynaEtch

Agreed Im not seeing singles prices on the secondary market justify the price per box.

For one, we are in a down market for cards in general, which is a major factor, but there is something more regarding this particular set that Im trying to put my finger on.

-The number of inserts is jacked up, you get like 1 per pack, and many are cheap...they are all over the place and there isnt much of a cohesive identity with this set.

-As usual in modern UD marvel, several insert sets with a huge checklist. 30-50 card insert sets (remember when marvel cards would have a just a few 5-12 card chase sets). The problem with this is it kills the set for set collectors. How many people are putting together 30-card Ultra Power sets, etc? Therefore any character that is not collected by character-collectors in these sets probably wont hold value- who is the audience for that card?

-Too many relics among the comic cuts, clippings, marvel value stamps, coin relics etc. Some like the comic cuts, but Im not really a fan, especially when they are using bronze age to modern age, when the book itself could be had for a couple bucks.

-The insert sets dont really have top marvel-card names. Outside the top avengers Cap, Iron Man, Hulk, Scarlet Witch, Black Panther, Thor and Thanos (none of which are at the top of the hobby totem pole), there's a lot of mediocre avengers related names. Look at the list of 30 jambalayas..jamba of Ares, Ronan, Crossbones, Korvac, etc? Even if you hit a big insert like this you lose money in the box.

-We are hit with all these parallels....completely new ordering and color scheme of blues, amethysts, burgundy's etc, with no precedent. How does a collector relate to that, when streaming through the endless ebay listings? It's not like a Topps baseball set that has gold #'d out of that year or topps blacks put out every year that have a history...or even Masterpieces now with the epic purples and legendary oranges.

-Artist autos are cool and neat addition, but like even creator autos from comics, they just arent valued as, say sports autos are.

-While the base has fresh original art which I like, most of the inserts dont (unlike Masterpieces). So again the set has this mish-mash feel rather than single identity.

-It's hard to even tell what are the best cards to get (I guess emerald and black medallions? artist auto animation cel?). Which are nearly impossible to pull given the print run which is looking huge the more I look at it.

Maybe some or combination of the above. Not trying to be too negative on the set because I do like it, just not for $300-400 a box. The money isnt there.

Agree

But coming from the baseball market

Cosmic is 550
Ben baller 350
Bowman best 350

It’s all brutally priced. Dist and big breakers making a lot of money

Need to hit a massive card just to break even

[DynaEtch]

Originally Posted by kyle1707

Agree

But coming from the baseball market

Cosmic is 550
Ben baller 350
Bowman best 350

It’s all brutally priced. Dist and big breakers making a lot of money

Need to hit a massive card just to break even

Good point. I guess it just comes with the nature of bustin wax, no matter which hobby its in, it's a losing proposition. I dont know enough about those sets from sports, but maybe Marvel products like this even outperform a lot of sets from a ROI perspective. The base set at the very least goes for something, compared to sports.

But man..at 300-400 a box, it is almost a sure thing here to be losing. It seemed like with spidey and x-men metal people were pulling green pmgs here and there and selling them for thousands, and with this set Im seeing fewer big cards like that sold..but again maybe not a lot of wax is being opened. Or maybe it's that there's only 50*10=500 emerald medallions vs 200*10 = 2000 green pmgs.

[smanzari]

LCS got some more boxes in - I really do like this stuff! (Wish it were cheaper!)

Here are my top from the boxes:

[Rictor]

Originally Posted by kyle1707

You’re correct. Which is dumb

Why wouldn't Spider-Man be in an Avengers set? Along with Wolverine, he's been on several Avengers teams. Plus, he's even an Avenger in the Marvel movies.

Heck, it would be hard to come up with a Marvel hero that hasn't been on an Avengers team at some point.

[BobCollects]

Originally Posted by smanzari

LCS got some more boxes in - I really do like this stuff! (Wish it were cheaper!)

Here are my top from the boxes:

Is that a sketch of Aleta from the original Guardians of the Galaxy?


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[smanzari]

Originally Posted by BobCollects

Is that a sketch of Aleta from the original Guardians of the Galaxy?


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I think its Dazzler, but could definitely be wrong. I don't think she was ever a proper "Avenger" but did appear in some books with them and is part of the A-Force (which maybe they're considering an Avengers Team for this(??))

[kyle1707]

Originally Posted by smanzari

LCS got some more boxes in - I really do like this stuff! (Wish it were cheaper!)

Here are my top from the boxes:

Jambalaya
Sketch
Cut

Great stuff

[Gambit C10]

Originally Posted by smanzari

I think its Dazzler, but could definitely be wrong. I don't think she was ever a proper "Avenger" but did appear in some books with them and is part of the A-Force (which maybe they're considering an Avengers Team for this(??))

Sketch cards don't necessarily follow the theme of the set, even if a theme is required.

I would expect villians and other random characters that may or may not have been in avengers books to be the subject matter for a sketch.

Really killer sketch btw, and it may be decently valuable because there are those who seek the atypical character sketches.

[smanzari]

Originally Posted by Gambit C10

Sketch cards don't necessarily follow the theme of the set, even if a theme is required.

I would expect villians and other random characters that may or may not have been in avengers books to be the subject matter for a sketch.

Really killer sketch btw, and it may be decently valuable because there are those who seek the atypical character sketches.

Ah, that makes sense - Thanks! I hope it is Dazzler, as she's been pretty popular recently and I think the artist is a pretty "Big One" based on sales (Viskratos)

[Gambit C10]

Originally Posted by smanzari

Ah, that makes sense - Thanks! I hope it is Dazzler, as she's been pretty popular recently and I think the artist is a pretty "Big One" based on sales (Viskratos)

I think Aleta is correct (I'm unfamiliar with this character). Dazzler typically has the big star icon in the center of her outfit unless its original white costume.

I thought at first it was a captain universe or captain marvel type character since the outfit looked cosmic related. Aleta looks most accurate after scanning google images of the character. There also seems to be differing depictions of her outfit too.

[smanzari]

Originally Posted by Gambit C10

I think Aleta is correct (I'm unfamiliar with this character). Dazzler typically has the big star icon in the center of her outfit unless its original white costume.

I thought at first it was a captain universe or captain marvel type character since the outfit looked cosmic related. Aleta looks most accurate after scanning google images of the character. There also seems to be differing depictions of her outfit too.

Now that I look, I am thinking the same - I've never heard of her, but that's OK, typically the sketch cards I pull are pretty plain/bland and this one definitely is not!

[DynaEtch]

Whatever the character, that's a great looking sketch.

I think Aleta is right. Her costume should be a little more revealing down the middle I believe, but perhaps with this being an UD marvel set, the artist didnt want to push it (total guess territory here). Either way, heck of a sketch.

[DynaEtch]

Even pulling a sketch period in this product seems tough. Cant remember seeing too many pulled on streams.

Also the Hulk art on that Ultra Power is nice!

[Gambit C10]

Originally Posted by DynaEtch

Whatever the character, that's a great looking sketch.

I think Aleta is right. Her costume should be a little more revealing down the middle I believe, but perhaps with this being an UD marvel set, the artist didnt want to push it (total guess territory here). Either way, heck of a sketch.

Yea, i noticed that too. Looks like it was originally sketched like the revealing version, but was colored in a nearly solid black where the revealing location should be. Maybe the artist did a black mesh-like effect to tone down the outfit.

[smanzari]

Originally Posted by DynaEtch

Whatever the character, that's a great looking sketch.

I think Aleta is right. Her costume should be a little more revealing down the middle I believe, but perhaps with this being an UD marvel set, the artist didnt want to push it (total guess territory here). Either way, heck of a sketch.

Originally Posted by Gambit C10

Yea, i noticed that too. Looks like it was originally sketched like the revealing version, but was colored in a nearly solid black where the revealing location should be. Maybe the artist did a black mesh-like effect to tone down the outfit.

You guys are right - I have it in hand and didn't even notice until you all mentioned it. With that I think its Definitely Aleta.

Here's a bigger pic to see- I wonder if Marvel/Disney "sent it back" and he went on and colored it in

[DynaEtch]

Pheww...that's a fantastic sketch.

Yea looks like that could have happened, hard to say. I imagine UD ensures these sketches are family friendly to an extent. Of course other examples like Joe's Shanna the She-Devil in the actual set in MM2016 for example showed a lot more than that.

[glorbgorb]

Honestly I'm surprised they sent anything back to be "corrected". We've all heard stories from artists where cards were rejected with nary an explanation. I find it hard to believe they would go through the trouble to send it back to be corrected.

[machine74]

Is there a FUA base and parallel photo list anywhere? I'd like to see what each of them looks like. Some are selling set lots, but if anyone knows of a good place on IG or anywhere else, I'd appreciate it greatly. Thanks.

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[CicadaMound]

It has a TCDB entry that'll fill up eventually. Not a ton on there yet.

https://www.tcdb.com/ViewSet.cfm/sid...MarvelAvengers

[vc15nba]

What is this?

[hobbystuff]

I got one of those black envelopes also in one of my boxes.There was a Comic Cover #/29 inside

[DynaEtch]

Yea it’s a comic cover insert, I believe #’d out of the issue of the comic. Why they have them in an inner pack I have no clue.

The grail here would be the avengers #1 numbered 1/1.

[PurplesaurusRex]

That's underwhelming. You'd think they would save that for autos, comic clippings or something a little more special.

[DynaEtch]

Originally Posted by PurplesaurusRex

That's underwhelming. You'd think they would save that for autos, comic clippings or something a little more special.

My thoughts too. I guess if you get one of the top 10 avengers covers people might be after them, but still.

Are the black inner packs tamper proof? Like could it be sold as a mystery, not being able to see inside?