eBay seller yourcardconnection2010 shipping cost ordeal

[shrevecity]

Originally Posted by Bosoxfan5990

There is a specific option to choose for ESE, even if it is First Class Mail. That's where this argument loses steam. Prior to implementation of ESE, if the seller stated USPS First Class for $3.99 and sent PWE with a stamp, this argument would hold more water.

Tht is true but to say its not first class is inaccurate to say that it was not categorized correctly is more accurate. As I have said in the past I use standard shipping on most of my items that do not qualify for ESE that way as a seller I have the choice and flexibility of how to ship it. Even some of my ESE cards with free shipping have standard shipping. If Ebay really cared they would make the option not available for listings that were not set up with ESE from the start. Would be pretty simple coding. They could also easily set max shipping charges like they do in some categories.

[JeffG1954]

Originally Posted by shrevecity

Tht is true but to say its not first class is inaccurate to say that ir was notcategorized correctly is more accurate. As I have said in the past I use standard shipping on most of my items that way as a seller I have the choice and flexibility of how to ship it. Even some of my ESE cards with free shipping have standard shipping

I ship using the ESE program whenever possible, and I list mine using this option:

Economy Shipping
1-10 business day
Buyer pays

[shrevecity]

Originally Posted by JeffG1954

I ship using the ESE program whenever possible, and I list mine using this option:

Economy Shipping
1-10 business day
Buyer pays

I have used that a few times as well especially when the mail is running slower than usual that way it stretches the expected delivery times out. I think in the long run having that extended delivery date slows sales a bit.

[cholodolo]

Originally Posted by shrevecity

Clearly states on the ESE label first class mail. I find these arrive to most buyers faster than First Class Parcel which is what the first class on bubble mailers are. Regular 60 cents stamps are FIRST CLASS.

Attachment 532927


I have never said the seller was right but he did not really swap the class. A class swap would be stating first class and shipping media or priority to First Class(even though priority is usually as fast as First Class in reality).

They both use the word First Class, but it doesn't mean the same thing (and you know that). If they are the same -- why the price difference? So what did the seller do? Price Swap? Not Class swap? Is there a distinction?

I find that statement to be questionable given what we read daily on these boards regarding ESE, PWE, or whatever.

Unless a card was ESE or "Free Shipping" from LA, never had one arrive before a 3-Day BMWT.

[shrevecity]

Originally Posted by cholodolo

They both use the word First Class, but it doesn't mean the same thing (and you know that). If they are the same -- why the price difference? So what did the seller do? Price Swap? Not Class swap? Is there a distinction?

I find that statement to be questionable given what we read daily on these boards regarding ESE, PWE, or whatever.

Unless a card was ESE or "Free Shipping" from LA, never had one arrive before a 3-Day BMWT.

It's how the usps has defined it for years there is first class and first class parcel or package. They are shipped often together in the same bags to some locations. First class is letter size items first class parcel is for larger items weighing under 1lb or I think its limited to 13oz at counter.


https://faq.usps.com/s/article/What-...rst-Class-Mail

Times can vary depending on location. A lot of mail going to LA passes through Bell Gardens Erich is considered by most ebay sellers as one of the worst and slowest processing centers. It has improved but used to be a notorious black hole. Dallas has 2 big centers if they go through the main its pretty fast and any class of mail including media arrives in 3 days or less virtually anywhere in most situations. If they get routed to Coppell Texas then you are looking at 5 to 7 days on nearly everything. Hell if I send an item to my own town it takes 2 days minimum.

I just checked aside from a few anomalies most of the items I have sent since the first of the year arrived in 3 to 4 business days no matter how it was shipped. One I did find was going from Texas to Florida arriving in less than 24 hours it was a FCP item.

Over the years I have seen priority going less than 100 miles take 15 days, Media mail going to Hawaii take 2 days things happen. In December 2020 at one point I(like many other sellers at the time) had over 20 package that were over 3 weeks. Longest one in that time took 40 something days. Yet at same time many people were stating that PWEs were getting through at normal speeds.

[chiefsncards275]

Originally Posted by Bosoxfan5990

There are many reasons on BO to ask for an OPs eBay ID. This isn't one of them.

Starting a call out thread over $3 when the card arrived perfectly fine?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Bosoxfan5990]

Originally Posted by chiefsncards275

Starting a call out thread over $3 when the card arrived perfectly fine?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Oh you're one of those "card arrived perfectly fine, just ignore the fact that the card was shipped naked wrapped in Saran wrap thrown in an unpadded mailer" people?

[JeffG1954]

Originally Posted by shrevecity

It's how the usps has defined it for years there is first class and first class parcel or package. They are shipped often together in the same bags to some locations. First class is letter size items first class parcel is for larger items weighing under 1lb or I think its limited to 13oz at counter.


https://faq.usps.com/s/article/What-...rst-Class-Mail

Times can vary depending on location. A lot of mail going to LA passes through Bell Gardens Erich is considered by most ebay sellers as one of the worst and slowest processing centers. It has improved but used to be a notorious black hole. Dallas has 2 big centers if they go through the main its pretty fast and any class of mail including media arrives in 3 days or less virtually anywhere in most situations. If they get routed to Coppell Texas then you are looking at 5 to 7 days on nearly everything. Hell if I send an item to my own town it takes 2 days minimum.

I just checked aside from a few anomalies most of the items I have sent since the first of the year arrived in 3 to 4 business days no matter how it was shipped. One I did find was going from Texas to Florida arriving in less than 24 hours it was a FCP item.

Over the years I have seen priority going less than 100 miles take 15 days, Media mail going to Hawaii take 2 days things happen. In December 2020 at one point I(like many other sellers at the time) had over 20 package that were over 3 weeks. Longest one in that time took 40 something days. Yet at same time many people were stating that PWEs were getting through at normal speeds.

I agree with this.....almost all of my shipments have arrived in 3 days....some 2, some 4....but nothing more than 4. My shipments have included mostly ESE and First Class Package....only a couple of Priority. Something has changed for the better locally.....hope it lasts.

[rjp087]

Originally Posted by Bosoxfan5990

There are many reasons on BO to ask for an OPs eBay ID. This isn't one of them.

Thank you for your support. I know how this subforum works, and I didn't expect to get one of those typical Blowout hobbychad responses. I know very well that bringing some bs here will get you ridiculed and ran off the boards/potentially banned.

It's entertaining how the people who financially benefit from this practice--however small--defend it tooth and nail. Penny-sleeves are getting crazy expensive these days apparently

Am I insane for thinking that this practice is shameful? Morally bankrupt in nature? I could never charge $3.99 for an eBay standard envelope and not feel like some kind of hobby junkie piece of trash.

[DynaEtch]

Again, I can see both sides, but personally am on the side of OP considering Ebay standard envelope is literally an option for shipping and the seller did not select it. Choosing standard shipping (USPS first class) with $3.99 price is deceptive for sending a card ESE. Even if standard envelopes are technically defined as first class- just select the correct one in the drop down menu, which is ESE. That said, people are basically talking in circles at this point.

[Univibes]

Quick ebay search gets:

100 Ultra Pro Toploaders & 100 Penny sleeves $20
100 Team Bags $5.13
100 Gummed Closure White Standard Envelopes $7.99

All come free shipping. Subtotal is $33.12 so sales tax would need to be calculated. If we add 10% that should cover most of the USA.

Total $36.43

If the seller buys brand new quality supplies it will cost approximately 36.5 cents in supplies to ship 1 card….unless the seller intends to factor in costs for the spit to seal the envelope and the printer ink to print the postage. If we guesstimate an additional 13.5 cents then the total goes to 50 cents.

Starts to look like there is more profit in the shipping side than the card side.

[shrevecity]

I would be tempted to return the item if a seller sent a normal gummed envelope. At least use the self seal ones they cost a little more but are less gross.

[chiefsncards275]

Originally Posted by Bosoxfan5990

Oh you're one of those "card arrived perfectly fine, just ignore the fact that the card was shipped naked wrapped in Saran wrap thrown in an unpadded mailer" people?

Was it shipped naked? Please tell me that’s the case. From how I interpret it, it was shipped perfectly fine just in eBay standard envelope. Again it’s $3. How is this worth of a callout thread.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[rjp087]

Originally Posted by chiefsncards275

How is this worth of a callout thread.

Because it's hard to imagine a scenario where I'm the first person the seller has done this to, and I don't want it to happen to other people as well (which is the general gist of this forum, correct me if I'm wrong). Unless they're okay with paying $3.99 for a $0.57 service like you seem to be as long as the card "arrives perfectly fine", right? Or perhaps it's just the case that your own $4.50 "Standard Shipping" service is similar to this seller's? How do you ship the cards you charge $4.50 for shipping?

A seller shouldn't profit ~$3.50 on shipping expenses every time they sell a single card. I'm not really sure why you think that's an OK thing to do unless I'm right about the way you ship cards.

[Bosoxfan5990]

Originally Posted by chiefsncards275

Was it shipped naked? Please tell me that’s the case. From how I interpret it, it was shipped perfectly fine just in eBay standard envelope. Again it’s $3. How is this worth of a callout thread.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I'm not going to continue to argue with you. At worst, others in this thread are somewhere in the middle on the ethics of this seller. You're the only one who's completely contrarian. What does that say about you?

[chiefsncards275]

Originally Posted by rjp087

Because it's hard to imagine a scenario where I'm the first person the seller has done this to, and I don't want it to happen to other people as well (which is the general gist of this forum, correct me if I'm wrong). Unless they're okay with paying $3.99 for a $0.57 service like you seem to be as long as the card "arrives perfectly fine", right? Or perhaps it's just the case that your own $4.50 "Standard Shipping" service is similar to this seller's? How do you ship the cards you charge $4.50 for shipping?

A seller shouldn't profit ~$3.50 on shipping expenses every time they sell a single card. I'm not really sure why you think that's an OK thing to do unless I'm right about the way you ship cards.

Couldn’t you just have left a negative? That way potential buyers could see it and warn them that way?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[chiefsncards275]

Originally Posted by Bosoxfan5990

I'm not going to continue to argue with you. At worst, others in this thread are somewhere in the middle on the ethics of this seller. You're the only one who's completely contrarian. What does that say about you?

If someone charges $1.50 for pwe shipping and it only cost them $.57, should they get called out too for charging too much? I’m not saying what the seller did is right. I’m saying at the end of the day OP still got the item they paid for in the condition described. If he was so mad about it he could’ve left a negative. If this eBay seller had a PC card I needed I would still buy from them. I could care less if they pocket an extra $3 on shipping. This will be my last reply as well because quite frankly I don’t care that much. Sometimes it’s good to play devils advocate though.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[shrevecity]

Originally Posted by chiefsncards275

If someone charges $1.50 for pwe shipping and it only cost them $.57, should they get called out too for charging too much? I’m not saying what the seller did is right. I’m saying at the end of the day OP still got the item they paid for in the condition described. If he was so mad about it he could’ve left a negative. If this eBay seller had a PC card I needed I would still buy from them. I could care less if they pocket an extra $3 on shipping. This will be my last reply as well because quite frankly I don’t care that much. Sometimes it’s good to play devils advocate though.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Instead the OP choose to take actions that will get the feedback removed should seller call ebayand him hit with an ebay policy violation( that will get him auto blockedby many sellers). Demanding a partial without a return is against ebay rules. Doing so under threat of negative feedback is considered extortion.

Leave the neg and move on. If feedback gets removed what has been accomplished. The thread will be seen by a very small percentage of ebay members and will not affect his sales 1 bit in the grand scheme.

My 67 Aaron was sent to me in a 6x9 Manila envelope with no sleeve or top loader. I arrived in better shape than I expected seller got positive feedback and I messaged them letting them know what could have happened. It got to me how I expected it to be so I was happy. Really not a difficult concept to grasp

[rjp087]

Now I'm an extortion artist?

Oh brother. I'm done with this; I got enough affirmation from members that the seller's practice is inexcusable and his name is exactly where I want it to be. Done deal.

Cheers.

[shrevecity]

Did you tell the seller you would leave bad feedback if he refused to refund you? If you did that is feedback extortion per eBay rules.

Seller was wrong but your handling of the matter was wrong as well. Should have just nagged him called him out and moved on
Asking for partials is inexcusable. I have a 3 word reply for those. Return for refund. Then block then report to ebay.

[tonedef2oo8]

Originally Posted by Univibes

Quick ebay search gets:

100 Ultra Pro Toploaders & 100 Penny sleeves $20
100 Team Bags $5.13
100 Gummed Closure White Standard Envelopes $7.99

All come free shipping. Subtotal is $33.12 so sales tax would need to be calculated. If we add 10% that should cover most of the USA.

Total $36.43

If the seller buys brand new quality supplies it will cost approximately 36.5 cents in supplies to ship 1 card….unless the seller intends to factor in costs for the spit to seal the envelope and the printer ink to print the postage. If we guesstimate an additional 13.5 cents then the total goes to 50 cents.

Starts to look like there is more profit in the shipping side than the card side.

See how they ignore you?

That’s because you have a point and people feel entitled to making money off of shipping,

[callou2131]

I would neutral also. All ESE really is, is a version of PWE, If any of these clowns paid $3.99 and got PWE (which is also 1st class) they would be on here crying too. In 20+ years selling on eBay, I have never once overcharged for shipping, or didn't ship the way I have it listed on the menu, unless I upgraded to priority because it was an expensive item.

[Grid]

Originally Posted by cholodolo

That's a lot of words to say you agree with sellers doing stupid and shady stuff like this.

The fact you typed out the bolded...wow. Take it easy, Mr. Bezos selling cards on eBay.

How is it stupid and shady? Stupid and shady, is seeing the price of shipping, agreeing to it, and demanding money back.

My post was to show how silly it is for a buyer to expect to ONLY pay the cost of post. As if packing supplies were free. And thats also throwing out the fact, that sellers lose a portion of their shipping costs paid due to fees.

If a buyer only sees the $1.25 noted on the post, that doesn't mean it only cost the seller $1.25 to pack/ship and inclusive of fees paid to ebay on the shipping.

Originally Posted by tonedef2oo8

How does it feel to know you typed all that and it’s against eBay’s rules? Your supplies and handeling is NOT supposed to be charged for. And that’s according to eBay. Not some banana trying to pinch every last penny making excuses the entire way.


Want to know how you’re full of it. Go ahead and post a list of how much it costs. And make sure you put the buy in bulk price not the inflated price of one bubble mailer and the infamous 2.00 top loader. And remember you’re only allowed to charge the exact amount not gas tolls and all the added stuff you bananas love to try to use to justify this. Also remember you save from printing at home and shipping there. I know I know you have no printer and the post office is 800 miles away uphill on a hill of ice.

Wow, you seem angry. Did I do or say something to you? It is not against ebays rules. As a seller, you set the shipping costs charged and are absolutely allowed to take into aggregate packing costs and related handling.

You are making many assumptions here. Not every seller sells in bulk. Not every bulk seller, sells the same size items. Its often unreasonable to buy in bulk every size mailer you could ever need for every items you may sell.

Same goes with printing postage from home. Not every seller wants to invest in a scale and sign up for shipping services. Plus, not every seller wants to leave things in their mailbox/common area to be picked up. Might be easier to go to the post office to drop off. I couldnt even tell you were there is a free standing mail box near me.

A buyer demanding that I do all of your above, to then get my shipping costs down 20%, and only so i can turn that savings over to them directly is bananas.

I do NOT condone sellers using crazy high shipping costs. I never said I did. I only spoke in defense of this seller, as they combine shipping (up to an unlimited amount) at no extra charge. Just like the seller said, sometimes they win and sometimes they lose. But every time, the buyer sees the exact same shipping cost shown.

Originally Posted by shrevecity

Ebay clearly states a seller can charge handling costs and that it can include any supplies used to package that item to get it to the buyer so things like top loaders and penny sleeves can be included in that, sicce these items are used in packing of a card..

https://www.ebay.com/help/member-beh...docId=HELP1562

Only include shipping charges that are actually incurred and are related to the cost of shipping and handling the items being delivered:

Actual cost paid to the shipping service

Handling costs, including the cost of packaging materials and insurance

The actual cost of delivery confirmation or extra services, such as certificate of mailing, certified mail, collect delivery, delivery confirmation, registered mail, restricted delivery, return receipt, signature confirmation, special handling, or similar services



Now time and all that is debatable but look at some of the big sellers out there I guarantee they are adding employee salaries into their handling costs virtuallly any Ebay seller who has employees will do so and end of day Ebay does not care anymore. That is why they started charging fees to S&H and why the Shipping and Handling cost DSR was the first one Ebay dropped as being counted against sellers Of course now DSRs do not affect sellers at all, back in 2015 or so they did and Ebay decided that if the costs is clearly stated then the buyer has really no reason reason to complain about it after the fact.

This link also says you cannot use a slower service than stated in the listing like swapping first class for media or priority for first class. The debate here is in the wording the ESE is still FIRST CLASS so its not really swapping for a slower method its swapping for a cheaper method

Well said. Look, there was a huge problem on ebay of sellers listing items cheap, and then gouging buyers with high shipping costs.

Ebay used to list items by the lowest cost, ignoring shipping, so some sellers used that loop hole to their advantage. Ebay also didnt charge fees on shipping, so sellers could milk more money from sales.

Thats long gone, and the total dollars are taken into account for listings. Sellers pay fees on the total amount as well. Buyers no longer have to play games, as the sell price and shipping cost is clearly shown. And yet, here we are...

[Grid]

Originally Posted by tonedef2oo8

You’re confused on how he paid for one service and got a far less one? You must confuse often.

Would you be confused if you bought a name brand bag and got a plastic shopping bag also but only found out when it got to you?

Your analogy is flawed. No one is "buying" shipping services here. Thats the point I, and others, are trying to make. You dont end up with anything more or better, just because the seller paid for a different service. You still net the card.

If I bought a brand new bag, I would not accept a plastic shopping bag. In this scenario, its the bag I bought. That is tangible.

When it comes to this actual thread, the buyer didn't buy a shipping service. They bought a card. They got the card, in the exact condition it was purchased in.

There was no bait and switch like your bag story.

At the end of the day, if the seller would have paid and ate for next day air shipping, and put the card inside a bag packed in Ashera kitten fur. The buyer would still have exact what they bought, and thats the card in the condition sold.

If the seller went cheap, and saved a dollar and the card came bent in half in a PWE, the seller, and only the seller, would have been on the hook here. The buyer would have gotten all of their money back, including the shipping paid.

You bought a card, you knew the total cost to get it, and you got your card in the condition it should have been. The seller owes you nothing. You wouldn't have gotten anything different if the seller had shipped it Priority in a box.

[Joshi City]

I think OP is correct. Sellers can charge whatever they want for shipping as far as I'm concerned as its clearly stated what the charge will be. But the service listed for the shipping is how they should ship. If a listing says $20 for First Class Shipping, and I see they paid $5 to ship it to me First Class, I have no right to complain as the seller shipped it the listed service and I knew the amount ahead of time. But if I paid $5 for First Class and they sent it PWE, that would be an issue for me.

As a real example - a couple weeks ago I purchased a hobby box of cards. I only buy hobby boxes that ship via Priority Mail, as I like to get boxes as soon after launch as possible and that speeds it up. The box was listed as Priority, but he shipped it First Class. Course it took its sweet time and I got it a couple days after I would have if it was shipped Priority. Now is that a big deal? No, I didn't message him, it wasn't important enough to raise a stink about and it was Free Shipping so I didn't feel ripped off. But if I had paid $12 shipping for Priority and he sent it First Class and pocketed the extra, I'd absolutely messaged him and expected a refund difference.

The point isn't the cost but the honesty in shipping. It would be an easy tactic to get sales - list something as Priority to get eyeballs and then ship by a slower method while hoping people don't care. On the grand scheme of shady things a seller could do I don't have it very high, but it still shouldn't be encouraged.

If anyone has an issue with me expecting sellers to ship by the method in the listing, feel free to block me on eBay, my eBay name is under my profile. I charge a flat $4 for shipping cards but ship BMWT just like my listing says I will, even for one card.