Why was arteepower's thread about leore ripping him off deleted?

[gomiamigo]

Originally Posted by GeechQuest

I’ll be honest and say I also don’t know how they manage risk. I’ll also say NOBODY knows how to manage risk against collateralized cards....

Odds of PWCC blowing up like all other non-productive asset backed lenders: -110

I'm bid on that up to -125.

[auburn35]

I never did get a response from Blowout as to why the thread was deleted, so the forum is forced to speculate.
This lawsuit that Alt filed against Beckett yesterday, could be related. Leore trying to cleanup his past before proceeding with another grading claim?

ALT is looking for $350,000+ in damages for a 2009 Steph Curry BGS 9.5 Topps Chrome Gold RC 26/50 that was purchased from Goldin Auctions and then later determined by PSA and BGS to be trimmed.

Interestingly, it sounds like the card (allegedly trimmed) was removed from the BGS case, prior to submitting to PSA and being identified as trimmed.

[imbluestreak23]

^^

That guy effn sucks. He just needs to go away

[mcb0419]

So they are suing not only for the full purchase price from 2 years ago, but for appreciation through August 2022? I didn't read too closely, but why are they using August? If it's like most other big time cards, the Dec 2022/Jan 2023 valuation would lower than August and I don't see why they'd be entitled to that (assuming this has merit)

[pcptrade]

Originally Posted by auburn35

Interestingly, it sounds like the card (allegedly trimmed) was removed from the BGS case, prior to submitting to PSA and being identified as trimmed.

Beckett will say that the trimming could have happened after it was cracked from their slab and prior to submitting to PSA. That was likely their excuse and hence the lawsuit. This is why it is not a good idea to crack a high end card unless you are willing to take the huge risk.

[Deadshot]

Originally Posted by mcb0419

So they are suing not only for the full purchase price from 2 years ago, but for appreciation through August 2022? I didn't read too closely, but why are they using August? If it's like most other big time cards, the Dec 2022/Jan 2023 valuation would lower than August and I don't see why they'd be entitled to that (assuming this has merit)

Looks like last sold was 11/26 for $204k. The current Card Ladder value is $184k. I'm assuming the legal paperwork was (conveniently) prepared ahead of time.

[nbahobbyaddict]

Originally Posted by pcptrade

Beckett will say that the trimming could have happened after it was cracked from their slab and prior to submitting to PSA. That will be their excuse.

Their excuse? The trimming could have in fact happened after it was cracked — it’s not an excuse, it’s a legitimate defense. Who would be dumb enough to NOT defend themselves with that argument? Also, who would trust Alt’s word that it was not trimmed after it was cracked?

[pcptrade]

Originally Posted by nbahobbyaddict

Their excuse? The trimming could have in fact happened after it was cracked — it’s not an excuse, it’s a legitimate defense. Who would be dumb enough to NOT defend themselves with that argument? Also, who would trust Alt’s word that it was not trimmed after it was cracked?

I should have used the word defense instead of excuse since this is a lawsuit Alt can try using card measurements before and after cracking to prove their point but not sure if it will hold in the court.

[Deadshot]

Originally Posted by nbahobbyaddict

Their excuse? The trimming could have in fact happened after it was cracked — it’s not an excuse, it’s a legitimate defense. Who would be dumb enough to NOT defend themselves with that argument? Also, who would trust Alt’s word that it was not trimmed after it was cracked?

And if there's anything we've learned over time, this company's name and TRUST are not synonymous. Even if you ignore the arteepower situation.

Ironic, because they’ve tried really hard to incorporate that into their branding/DNA. I saw a screenshot from their BETA in 2020 where they called themselves, “The most trusted alternative asset platform.”

Remember the browser extension that stole people's data? They knew that was happening. It doesn’t seem to have been any sort of accident.

And then a couple weeks ago, they promised a bunch of people a $30 credit for filling out a survey. When a bunch of people did said survey, they claimed the threshold was met (despite never publicly establishing one to begin with).

Only after a bunch of people complained, they changed their tune and sent out the following message, “The trust of our users is essential to us, and we appreciate the feedback we’ve received. As a startup, we are always looking to improve, and are reaching out to those who did not receive the $30 ALT credit and making it right by applying it to your account by December 6th.”

Once again, they’re trying to tell you how trustworthy they are. If they were that trustworthy to begin with, they never would’ve put people in that situation.

So either they're just sketchy in general, or they need to fix their business practices. Both situations are not good.

[KhalDrogo]

We all know Alt is the scummiest of all the card platforms. There’s really no competition. I’d work with Gary V, Evan Mathis, etc before anyone at Alt.

[auburn35]

Originally Posted by Deadshot

Looks like last sold was 11/26 for $204k. The current Card Ladder value is $184k. I'm assuming the legal paperwork was (conveniently) prepared ahead of time.

I didn't even look at the value but with the card apparently identified as being altered in September, using the August value (prior to being labeled altered) would make sense.
Is that $350,000 accurate and was august the highest value, post purchase?

[Deadshot]

The only other two that were higher were private sales of $550k and $575k reported in December 2021 and February 2022 respectively. The PWCC sale was for $336k in August.

[auburn35]

Nice video breakdown from Deadshot, via his Wax Museum Podcast YouTube channel.

[Gem10collection]

I'm glad someone is holding BGS accountable. Hopefully this will be a warning shot to other "authenticators" in the space.

The institutional side of the hobby is still too immature (and takes advantage of its customers/collectors) and needs to grow up to help propel it to the next level.

[Brwdot]

Does Alt stand for Leore Adivar being the "ult"imate scam artist?

[Brwdot]

BGS grades within tolerances. So does PSA. Both companies readily admit that they have graded trimmed cards. Leore Avidar is fully aware of this. The companies attempt to do the best that they can and are not the police for whether or not a card has been trimmed, and there is no reasonable expectation to hold them responsible for whether or not a card was trimmed. Had the previous thread still existed people could see what type of person Leore Avidar is and has to be the reason why that thread was deleted. It's just gotta be.

[Deadshot]

Originally Posted by Brwdot

Does Alt stand for Leore Adivar being the "ult"imate scam artist?

I like ALTered better, but to each his own.

[mindcycle]

Originally Posted by Brwdot

Had the previous thread still existed people could see what type of person Leore Avidar is and has to be the reason why that thread was deleted. It's just gotta be.

Money talks I guess. Lots of threads getting locked/deleted around here lately.

[Brwdot]

Originally Posted by mindcycle

Money talks I guess. Lots of thread getting lock/deleted around here lately.

Someone should send this to SportsCardRadio along with the Original thread that was saved so that there could be a documented report of it out there.

[thenwhatjk]

Need to get darscards35kd to weigh in in here

[RogerGodahell]

Originally Posted by Brwdot

Someone should send this to SportsCardRadio along with the Original thread that was saved so that there could be a documented report of it out there.

Please no. We need those psychotic deranged loudmouths to quietly disappear forever as well. They're just as bad and annoying in their own way as any of the other parties. How anyone can stand listening to them is beyond me. But to each their own.

[auburn35]

While waiting for Beckett's response, thought I would share some additional sections from the complaint, I found to be interesting. Also a couple deposition quotes from Jeromy Murray (BGS President). The quotes come from a older but similar Beckett litigation (Beckett settled), in which a card was removed from a graded BGS holder and later deemed altered by both BGS and PSA.




For some reason, ALT thinks ISA is among the top grading companies. Sorry CSG.



Beckett (Jeromy Murray) admits they're liable for misgraded cards, just need them to admit fault.

[I only pull for]

If pictures on this forum can be used to accuse people of trimming, then before and after pics of the Curry should be able to prove guilt or innocence in this case.
BGS has had plenty of dirty things brought out of its closet since the trimming scandal was uncovered on this forum. Beckett does not deserve a free pass in this situation, even though many on here hate ALT, it doesn't excuse BGS grading a trimmed card.
These grading companies need to be held accountable.

[Deadshot]

But are there any actual "before" pictures? My understanding is PSA examined it and believed it to be short.

[I only pull for]

Originally Posted by Deadshot

But are there any actual "before" pictures? My understanding is PSA examined it and believed it to be short.

There are pictures of the card in the BGS holder. It shouldn't be that difficult to tell if the card was trimmed after it was cracked.
Are there any before pictures of the card before BGS graded it the first time?
I would hope the people over at ALT did their due dilligence before filing a lawsuit.