Lebron James 2003 Topps Chrome Gold Refractor /50, the new "unicorn" vs. Exquisite

[jterp5]

Originally Posted by Archangel1775

The basis of this argument is that the Gold Refractor/50 should be on equal footing as a Gold Prizm/10 that didn't exist in 2003...but if it did it should be equal to an Exquisite /99 Rookie Patch Auto but since it doesn't exist the Gold Refractor/50 will do it.

Nahhhh

I will say this, if someone wanted a copy of a Topps Chrome LeBron Rookie Card, I can choose from:

Base *
Refractor *
Black Refractor /500
X-Fractor /220
Gold Refractor /50
Printing Plates (4) /1

If I want an Exquisite Rookie Patch Auto

/99
/23
/25 Gold
/1 Rainbow

Also it has a jersey patch
Also is has an autograph

It'll never happen

That's kind of the point. You can't "choose" a Gold refractor /50, as there are none publicly for sale atm. Exquisite RPA 99's are hitting the auction block every other month (or at least it seems) - there is even one for sale now.

Not saying the Gold is equal to or worth more, but it does make you wonder what the value is given the increased difficulty in locating a copy someone is willing to part with, as well as the print run, iconic nature of TC, current craze/rush on golds, etc

[GOATMJ]

Rarity or how less frequent a card becomes available for sale doesn't always mean it's a more valuable card.

Exquisite will always be more coveted and more valuable than the Gold Refractor. Exquisite > Topps Chrome

[jterp5]

Originally Posted by GOATMJ

Rarity or how less frequent a card becomes available for sale doesn't always mean it's a more valuable card.

Exquisite will always be more coveted and more valuable than the Gold Refractor. Exquisite > Topps Chrome

I don't believe the question is whether Gold is more valuable than the Exquisite. OP (I think) is asking current value. It seems nobody knows, so we'll have to wait for the next auction

[HOFrookies]

Originally Posted by mglevy125

Full disclosure I am biased here.


That being said I do respectfully disagree based on a few different factors. The sheer number of public exquisite sales versus tc gold over the last 12 months is pretty staggering. It seems nobody wants to be the guinea pig in testing the waters selling their gold publicly, while collectors capturing profit on exquisites is a monthly happening at this point.

Check the running list of manipulated/trimmed cards on Blowout. I was looking at it yesterday and couldn’t believe how many Lebron exquisite rpas were on the list (it was nearly double digits or close to it). I’d guess as more trimming/switching patches/overall manipulation on these types of cards come to light, particularly for the new hobbyists throwing big money in the market, investors will turn to something a little more immune to alteration. That’s not to say that the golds can’t be trimmed, but worrying about the auto being traced or patch getting switched isn’t a factor.

Both cards are grails, i just think the gap between them is closer than most probably think.

I have to agree with you. Last public sale was almost a year ago.
I also think you would get a different kind of investor/collector for the TC Gold Ref vs. RPAs.

[HOFrookies]

Originally Posted by bmf

And it won’t even sniff the Exquisite/23 gold.

Abra nailed it… this is nothing more than OP driving hype train… again.

Hype train?
How so? Is there one on sale, or one that you know of coming that I am "driving"?

[HOFrookies]

Originally Posted by imbluestreak23

Aesthetically I'd rather have the BC Gold than a TC Gold.

Topps Chrome is just a blah looking card.

Which one do you like?
Bowman Gold or Bowman Gold Refractor?

[HOFrookies]

Originally Posted by jterp5

I don't believe the question is whether Gold is more valuable than the Exquisite. OP (I think) is asking current value. It seems nobody knows, so we'll have to wait for the next auction

Thanks jterp5.
You are 100% correct.
I know that the Exquisites (/99, /23), grade for grade; will be worth more than the TC Gold Ref.

My original question was: Is the TC Gold Ref. going to be more rare, harder to chase down?
If so, what is the value?
The youtube video shows someone paying "over $1 million" in May of 2021 for a BGS true gem.
What's that now?
What about a PSA 10?

Those were my original questions...

[mc1]

Originally Posted by HOFrookies

Hype train?
How so? Is there one on sale, or one that you know of coming that I am "driving"?

Theres already a thread about this card.

Thats why its a hype thread boss.

[imbluestreak23]

Originally Posted by HOFrookies

Which one do you like?
Bowman Gold or Bowman Gold Refractor?

Gold Ref

The hobby got it wrong by anointing TC the card over BC. I mean, guess it’s hard to say that the market is wrong as it’s always right but it’s like the bass Topps flagship rage when historically those cards were hot kaka. BC has a nicer image and I like the pinstripe borders. Something about old Bowman Chrome from the early 00s just feels good!

[mindcycle]

[Kylekorverfan]

I would like to think the 03 gold chrome ref is the grail of grails in terms of gold refractors for lebron. However, I think the 2012 prizm gold /10 might actually be worth more?

I think in March or whatever a bgs 9.5 sold for 700ish K on Goldins.. if not more, then it’s very very close in value to the 03 chrome gold ref.

[pcptrade]

Originally Posted by HOFrookies

Which one do you like?

I used to own BC Gold Refractor #44/50 PSA 10 that I won at Goldin but sold it after I acquired the TC Gold Refractor.

https://goldinauctions.com/LotDetail...entoryid=44183

Just looking at both TC and BC Gold Ref side by side, it was easy for me to decide on which one to keep and which one to let go. There is no denying that BC Gold Refractor is a nice looking card but it can't hold a candle to TC Gold Refractor imo.

Lebron 2003 Topps Chrome RC Gold Refractor #24/50 by icollector23, on Flickr

[pcptrade]

Originally Posted by Kylekorverfan

I would like to think the 03 gold chrome ref is the grail of grails in terms of gold refractors for lebron. However, I think the 2012 prizm gold /10 might actually be worth more?

I think in March or whatever a bgs 9.5 sold for 700ish K on Goldins.. if not more, then it’s very very close in value to the 03 chrome gold ref.

2012 Prizm Gold/10 BGS 9.5 sold for 570K in April at Goldin and Novo posted in May that he acquired the TC Gold Refractor BGS 9.5 for more than a million.

[bmf]

Originally Posted by imbluestreak23

Aesthetically I'd rather have the BC Gold than a TC Gold.

Originally Posted by imbluestreak23

The hobby got it wrong by anointing TC the card over BC. I mean, guess it’s hard to say that the market is wrong as it’s always right but it’s like the bass Topps flagship rage when historically those cards were hot kaka. BC has a nicer image and I like the pinstripe borders. Something about old Bowman Chrome from the early 00s just feels good!

Agree, the bowman chrome gold refractor /50 is on another level.

[sebreg]

That's an interesting question regarding 03 tc gold vs 12 prizm gold Bron. Who knows, over the longer term the 12 gold could overtake the 03 gold. Such things will be determined by a very small pool of buyers, so volatility could be expected. Personally I'd rather rather the 12 prizm gold, I prefer the aesthetics, love the rarity, and it is an incredibly important set as well.

[tmar214]

I’m always skeptical of big private deals where the buyer announces the alleged price they paid after the fact. Sure many are likely the real number but it seems like an easy way to manipulate the price of rare valuable cards.

[nomarkj]

I find it quite interesting that it there is even conversation about the 12 Prizm gold outselling the 03 Topps Chrome in similar grades. I’ll stake myself in the camp that the prizm will never outsell the gold refractor. Ever.

That’s the beauty of collecting what we like, though. It just never even occurred to me that an incredibly rare 9th year card would outsell an incredibly rare rookie card.

[duron]

May I play within the pump?

How about the fact Topps Chrome didn’t even get Gold Refractors right until 2006. The “gold” refractors prior to that are more like Yellow-Orange. Those poor, non-chrome, bland borders… abhorrent.

[tmar214]

Originally Posted by nomarkj

I find it quite interesting that it there is even conversation about the 12 Prizm gold outselling the 03 Topps Chrome in similar grades. I’ll stake myself in the camp that the prizm will never outsell the gold refractor. Ever.

That’s the beauty of collecting what we like, though. It just never even occurred to me that an incredibly rare 9th year card would outsell an incredibly rare rookie card.

So much of what a rare card sells for is how many people want it. If their are 5-6 huge lebron collectors who aren’t overly price sensitive they should all be able to pick up a gold chrome rc eventually. If they all view the 2012 gold prizm as a must have the opportunity to buy one might only come up every few years.

Prices can get wacky in that way where a card that maybe should be viewed as less valuable can eventually end up selling for more. Especially on the super high end where you may be looking at people with hundreds of millions or more vying for them.

[r338]

Originally Posted by tmar214

So much of what a rare card sells for is how many people want it. If their are 5-6 huge lebron collectors who aren’t overly price sensitive they should all be able to pick up a gold chrome rc eventually. If they all view the 2012 gold prizm as a must have the opportunity to buy one might only come up every few years.

Prices can get wacky in that way where a card that maybe should be viewed as less valuable can eventually end up selling for more. Especially on the super high end where you may be looking at people with hundreds of millions or more vying for them.

Yes there is a huge difference between serial numbered /99 versus /50 versus /10.

[nomarkj]

Originally Posted by tmar214

So much of what a rare card sells for is how many people want it. If their are 5-6 huge lebron collectors who aren’t overly price sensitive they should all be able to pick up a gold chrome rc eventually. If they all view the 2012 gold prizm as a must have the opportunity to buy one might only come up every few years.

Prices can get wacky in that way where a card that maybe should be viewed as less valuable can eventually end up selling for more. Especially on the super high end where you may be looking at people with hundreds of millions or more vying for them.

While I do understand what you’re saying, this point held true back in March when a 12 Prizm did sell publicly. All these people with hundreds of millions of dollars vying for it showed what they are willing to pay. As other people have mentioned, a 03 Gold has not sold publicly recently. That is the wildcard here I suppose.

[pcptrade]

If anyone has or knows anyone who has a 2003 TC Gold Refractor BGS 9.5 and willing to sell it for $1 million, please PM me. I have a buyer with funds immediately available!

[sebreg]

Originally Posted by nomarkj

I find it quite interesting that it there is even conversation about the 12 Prizm gold outselling the 03 Topps Chrome in similar grades. I’ll stake myself in the camp that the prizm will never outsell the gold refractor. Ever.

That’s the beauty of collecting what we like, though. It just never even occurred to me that an incredibly rare 9th year card would outsell an incredibly rare rookie card.

100%, that is the beauty of these things, we each have different tastes and ways of valuing things. If I was a hundred-millionaire (big reveal: I am not) I'd prioritize and pay more premium for the 12 prizm gold. Of course, my tastes in this case may be the anomaly, where 9/10 people would rather go with the tc gold rc. Even though it's completely out of my sphere of collecting I do enjoy following the sales on these upper echelon cards.

[Asian62150]

2003 TC Gold should easily and always be more expensive than a 9th year Gold.

But when it comes to cards /10 or 1/1...the price is whatever someone is willing to pay. And according to K Goldin, there are some ppl out there who want to be able to say "I paid the most in history for x card." So the next 12 Gold could fetch $5M. Who knows.

If it does, I think everyone holding a 2003 TC Gold will think their card is worth at least $10M though.

[sebreg]

It's def true that on average hobby would prioritize rc over 9th year card. I used to be extremely rc-focused but my tastes have shifted over time, so for me that's why I don't mind prioritizing a 9th year card over a 1st year card. As ludicrous as it may seem haha!