The Official NBA Playoff Thread—-20/21 Edition

[Spacemanspif]

Originally Posted by Grizzkid12

Trae and Tyler Herro aren't on the same planet. Bad take

that's not remotely what I was saying.

[ballhawkdawk]

Originally Posted by MIRRABB

I get it, he's very hype-able and the reality is not as sexy as the idea that he's carrying the team game after game.

The thing is, the "nobodies" are actually a really good and balanced team, and Clint Capela has rated incredibly good this year as far as defensive and rebounding metrics. Which has been massive for a team that was at the bottom of the league in defense and rebounding last year.

"Relative nobodies" ... not "nobodies." I get that Huerter, Bogdanovic, Collins, and Capela are all very solid players, and guys like Danilo and Lou Will can provide the occasional spark, but that is the makeup of a high end middle of the road team, just as their final standings indicated. Zero All-Stars, zero All NBA defense, zero All NBA. This isn't the Nets, 76ers, Bucks, Lakers, Jazz, etc... the kind of the teams that dominated for most of the season and were expected to continue to do so in the playoffs.

They're a very balanced team, but who provides the balance? That pick and roll didn't just happen by accident. Trae puts immense pressure on defenses. I can find all the stats I want to make a case against the Hawks or Trae, but eventually reality is what it is, and they're winning and he's the driving force. The numbers bore me.

[tjforce]

Don't know if it helps or hurts anyone's case.. but the other thing that needs to be taken into account in the job Nate McMillan has done.

If for nothing else, not making back decisions when the game is on the line.

Doc definitely made some bad choices (all bench unit in Game 1?)

Coach Bud made a questionable choice by trusting key end of game shots to Connighton and 0-9 Middleton.

[rustywest]

Originally Posted by ballhawkdawk

"Relative nobodies" ... not "nobodies." I get that Huerter, Bogdanovic, Collins, and Capela are all very solid players, and guys like Danilo and Lou Will can provide the occasional spark, but that is the makeup of a high end middle of the road team, just as their final standings indicated. Zero All-Stars, zero All NBA defense, zero All NBA. This isn't the Nets, 76ers, Bucks, Lakers, Jazz, etc... the kind of the teams that dominated for most of the season and were expected to continue to do so in the playoffs.

They're a very balanced team, but who provides the balance? That pick and roll didn't just happen by accident. Trae puts immense pressure on defenses. I can find all the stats I want to make a case against the Hawks or Trae, but eventually reality is what it is, and they're winning and he's the driving force. The numbers bore me.

Whats the record with the new coach Nate?

[Dame]

Originally Posted by MIRRABB

I'm not naturally a hater of any player, but this stuff makes me crazy lol.

Trae had one amazing game after a 7 game series where he shot 39/32, and somehow he's playing at a historical level. I don't get it.

Yeah, you obviously didn't follow them all series long.

His 1st game output ranks among the elite as well, if we're going by numbers fwiw.

Originally Posted by ballhawkdawk

Team leader on a team full of relative nobodies that just demoralized the #1 seed and is now taking it to yet another team that was supposed to stomp them out real easy.

Forget the numbers. It’s the Trae show.

Gets it^

[GOATcards]

Originally Posted by ballhawkdawk

Team leader on a team full of relative nobodies that just demoralized the #1 seed and is now taking it to yet another team that was supposed to stomp them out real easy.

Forget the numbers. It’s the Trae show.

That red-headed guy looks like decent supporting cast.

[MIRRABB]

Originally Posted by ballhawkdawk

"Relative nobodies" ... not "nobodies." I get that Huerter, Bogdanovic, Collins, and Capela are all very solid players, and guys like Danilo and Lou Will can provide the occasional spark, but that is the makeup of a high end middle of the road team, just as their final standings indicated. Zero All-Stars, zero All NBA defense, zero All NBA. This isn't the Nets, 76ers, Bucks, Lakers, Jazz, etc... the kind of the teams that dominated for most of the season and were expected to continue to do so in the playoffs.

They're a very balanced team, but who provides the balance? That pick and roll didn't just happen by accident. Trae puts immense pressure on defenses. I can find all the stats I want to make a case against the Hawks or Trae, but eventually reality is what it is, and they're winning and he's the driving force. The numbers bore me.

I can ignore stats and say this still makes no sense. Trae was doing all the same things last year and they were 20-47.

[ballhawkdawk]

Originally Posted by rustywest

Whats the record with the new coach Nate?

Good. That's all I know.

Nate has been a coach for like 20 years now and has never been considered a top end coach. I'm not about to start pretending he's the reason this team is unshakable. That comes from the leader on the floor.

[TSonn]

Originally Posted by ballhawkdawk

"Relative nobodies" ... not "nobodies." I get that Huerter, Bogdanovic, Collins, and Capela are all very solid players, and guys like Danilo and Lou Will can provide the occasional spark, but that is the makeup of a high end middle of the road team, just as their final standings indicated. Zero All-Stars, zero All NBA defense, zero All NBA. This isn't the Nets, 76ers, Bucks, Lakers, Jazz, etc... the kind of the teams that dominated for most of the season and were expected to continue to do so in the playoffs.

They're a very balanced team, but who provides the balance? That pick and roll didn't just happen by accident. Trae puts immense pressure on defenses. I can find all the stats I want to make a case against the Hawks or Trae, but eventually reality is what it is, and they're winning and he's the driving force. The numbers bore me.

Yep. Didn't Doc even say it didn't matter if Trae was missing shots, every time he had the ball he still forced the 76ers to change up their defense?

Basically...
When Trae's shot is on = Curry 2.0
When Trae's shot is off = Nash 2.0

Trae's playmaking and vision are what make him a hassle for defensives, regardless. If his shot is on, he can win you any game like all superstars.

[ballhawkdawk]

Originally Posted by MIRRABB

I can ignore stats and say this still makes no sense. Trae was doing all the same things last year and they were 20-47.

He wasn't, though. The pick and roll was never this lethal.

We gonna say the same thing about Luka when he gets over the hump? "He did xyz the same before, therefore his teammates get all the credit." Sprinkle in a couple pieces and a little continuity and we're acting like Clint Capela, Kevin Huerter, and Nate McMillan are steering the ship. Trae is the guy. I can't see it for you.

[ballhawkdawk]

Originally Posted by TSonn

Yep. Didn't Doc even say it didn't matter if Trae was missing shots, every time he had the ball he still forced the 76ers to change up their defense?

Basically...
When Trae's shot is on = Curry 2.0
When Trae's shot is off = Nash 2.0

Trae's playmaking and vision are what make him a hassle for defensives, regardless. If his shot is on, he can win you any game like all superstars.

Offensive pressure and moxie are his biggest attributes. Once they come up with a stat for that stuff BO can sleep better knowing that his greatness has finally been quantified. He took the soul right out of the 76ers. That's hard for me to admit.

[rustywest]

Originally Posted by ballhawkdawk

Good. That's all I know.

Nate has been a coach for like 20 years now and has never been considered a top end coach. I'm not about to start pretending he's the reason this team is unshakable. That comes from the leader on the floor.

Huh? 27-11 + 9-4 is pretending? - coming from 14-20? Probably a factor

Yes, it comes from the leader on the floor.

Do I have your permission to believe both things are true

[KhalDrogo]

Trae is the number one reason for their success, but I don’t think it’s fair to minimize the contributions of the other players by calling them relative nobodies. Especially in this injury riddled playoffs. They have ridiculous depth and experience. That gives them a huge advantage in being able to tolerate off nights from guys. Trae was terrible in game 7, but they won because Huerter, Gallinari, Capela, and Collins came up big.

[ballhawkdawk]

Originally Posted by GOATcards

That red-headed guy looks like decent supporting cast.

Credit to Huerter, he had a stretch of games in the Philly series where he looked completely dead, and he ramped it right back up when it counted the most. He was a major problem in game 7.

But that's not my point. My point was that Trae isn't playing with multiple All-Stars. There are a half dozen or so teams loaded with talent, and the Hawks aren't one of them. There's a reason why half of BO was crowning the Bucks after they beat the Nets, and 76ers/Hawks game 7 hadn't even taken place yet. Because we'd seen the Hawks take the life out of the 76ers already, and figured it wouldn't happen to the Bucks because they're that much better on paper.

[KhalDrogo]

Originally Posted by ballhawkdawk

Credit to Huerter, he had a stretch of games in the Philly series where he looked completely dead, and he ramped it right back up when it counted the most. He was a major problem in game 7.

But that's not my point. My point was that Trae isn't playing with multiple All-Stars. There are a half dozen or so teams loaded with talent, and the Hawks aren't one of them. There's a reason why half of BO was crowning the Bucks after they beat the Nets, and 76ers/Hawks game 7 hadn't even taken place yet. Because we'd seen the Hawks take the life out of the 76ers already, and figured it wouldn't happen to the Bucks because they're that much better on paper.

It’s funny you say that because I see it exactly the opposite. I think the Hawks are much better than the Bucks, even if the Bucks should win the series. I thought the Bucks would have been better off against a hobbled Embiid.

[rustywest]

Originally Posted by KhalDrogo

Trae is the number one reason for their success, but I don’t think it’s fair to minimize the contributions of the other players by calling them relative nobodies. Especially in this injury riddled playoffs. They have ridiculous depth and experience. That gives them a huge advantage in being able to tolerate off nights from guys. Trae was terrible in game 7, but they won because Huerter, Gallinari, Capela, and Collins came up big.

Wow, this is the first ever semi-positive post I've seen from whatever dwelling you reside in Dungeon/hovel/shanty/office block/sibling or parental basement/2 beddy apartment/suburbian lifestyler/mid-level roller pad... who knows, who cares

But I hope its a new leaf

[ballhawkdawk]

Originally Posted by rustywest

Huh? 27-11 + 9-4 is pretending? - coming from 14-20? Probably a factor

Yes, it comes from the leader on the floor.

Do I have your permission to believe both things are true

You can believe whatever you want. We're just talking here.

Nate's been a coach for 20 years. Made it past the first round of the playoffs (before this season) only once. Credit to Nate, he keeps his team focused and has them playing great defense, but at the end of the day he's just a dude standing there with a clipboard, and the offense needs a maestro to run it.

[ballhawkdawk]

Originally Posted by KhalDrogo

It’s funny you say that because I see it exactly the opposite. I think the Hawks are much better than the Bucks, even if the Bucks should win the series. I thought the Bucks would have been better off against a hobbled Embiid.

I honestly didn't know what to think about the Bucks coming out of the semis. I was more stunned to see such a degree of confidence in a team that looked terrible for the first three games of that series against the Nets. But I read it over and over again on here that the Bucks were somehow NBA champs after beating the Nets... without even knowing who they'd play in the conference finals or NBA finals.

[ballhawkdawk]

Maybe I have no idea what I'm talking about. I had 76ers in 5, so...

Anyway, back to work.

[rustywest]

Originally Posted by ballhawkdawk

You can believe whatever you want. We're just talking here.

Nate's been a coach for 20 years. Made it past the first round of the playoffs (before this season) only once. Credit to Nate, he keeps his team focused and has them playing great defense, but at the end of the day he's just a dude standing there with a clipboard, and the offense needs a maestro to run it.

Got it, arguing just for the sakes of it

[Zedlaw]

Teams like the Hawks are fun because most of their rotation is punching above their salary. Always seems like the perfect storm when you can be good and deep but at the cost of experience. Then comes experience and now you have to pay everyone and you’re walking the tightrope of building a roster on a budget and wondering why you’re left with Pat Connaughton air balling game deciding threes. Atlanta does have a real advantage in roster depth here.

[tjforce]

To settle the argument on Trae vs Team.. I say it's both.

Just look at the roster construction around him. No stars, but it's custom fit to Trae in that you have:

-Capela and Collins, who can set the PnR and go get the lob as well as anybody

-Huerter and Bogdan, who provide shooting from anywhere on the floor


Atlanta FO nailed it when they put this squad together.

[hairyangryfella]

Originally Posted by oshmeehan

Boxout and get defensive boards and attack their weak defenders in Trae, Bogi, Gallo, and Huerter and the Bucks should be able to win this series.

Lol, way to show you've not watched a Hawks game all year and have no idea what you're talking about there

Originally Posted by rustywest

But I'll take the Bucks from 0-1 here. Blowouts Buck guy noted they are notoriously slow starters, and that's true.

Yeah... He also said one of the Hawks' best defenders is a weak defender, so while he may know about his own team, he's got no idea about the other.

[armoursave]

Well Bud is the master of adjustments so………(said nobody ever)

Atlanta much deeper, you have steady offense at all positions and Lou coming off the bench. The defense is plenty good enough.

Biggest shot of game one was the 2 offensive rebound Collins corner three.

[atoaz12]

Glad Nate has found a group that jives with his message and style

No coach is smart until they are (Belichick, Torre, Nick Nurse all come to mind)