2020 Politics Thread - Enter At Your Own Risk - RULES IN OP

[mattglet]

Well said Astros. (In your long post that I'm not going to quote)

As for the gloating part, it's probably a request falling on deaf ears due to the constant and consistent "snowflake" trolling that went on for a couple of years.

Two wrongs don't make a right, but there is certainly reaction for the initial action.

[GeechQuest]

Originally Posted by Astros19

Trump would be 82 years old at the end of his term if he chose to run in 2024. Its already ridiculous to think that Biden will be 81 by the end of his term.
Let's be honest, anybody and everybody, including myself, is an idiot for voting for people that should have retired 15-20 years ago.

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We had a choice to trend younger and smarter.

Looks like 60,000+ of us took that shot.

[Hootiefish]

I've come to the point where I (selfishly, I know) quite enjoy the Electoral College, despite the fact that "my" candidate has been on the losing side of it twice.

It makes the whole process so much more exciting! I mean, how boring would it be to have an election where, as soon as the numbers from California, New York, and Chicago were tabulated, we'd have our winner?

Besides, I now know more about the counties in Arizona than I ever thought I could.

[Astros19]

Originally Posted by mattglet

Well said Astros. (In your long post that I'm not going to quote)

As for the gloating part, it's probably a request falling on deaf ears due to the constant and consistent "snowflake" trolling that went on for a couple of years.

Two wrongs don't make a right, but there is certainly reaction for the initial action.

Thank you.
I'm sure I on plenty more than one occasion have made snarky sarcastic comments given the nature of some of the conversations.
Just want to point out that I'm certainly not innocent by any means.

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[JustRachel]

Just getting a head start for next time....



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[Astros19]

Were any of you as surprised by the number of states who's population was smaller than New York City as I was?
I was really shocked.
In 2018 NYC had a population of 8.4 million people. That's just crazy.
I'm so glad I don't live there.
No offense to those that do, just not for me.

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[Hootiefish]

Originally Posted by Astros19

Were any of you as surprised by the number of states who's population was smaller than New York City as I was?
I was really shocked.
In 2018 NYC had a population of 8.4 million people. That's just crazy.
I'm so glad I don't live there.
No offense to those that do, just not for me.

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I couldn't imagine.

I'm from a town with fewer people in it than a single apartment building in NYC.

[discostu]

Again, equating the Russia Investigation to these wild claims of voter fraud are different.

Very different.

And they remain very different until indictments are made. Until guilty pleas are delivered.

Trump is merely doing what he was expected to do, what he did prior to winning in 2016. Make an escape plan to make it seem like the only way he could lose would be if someone cheated.

He denigrated election integrity his entire presidency. He will certainly do so for the rest of his life.

He has routinely criticized, bullied and strong-armed people for decades to prop himself up.

But every night, he knows that he lost to "the single worst candidate in the history of America." And he lost fairly and bigly.

Wenodis.

[Astros19]

Originally Posted by discostu

Again, equating the Russia Investigation to these wild claims of voter fraud are different.

Very different.

And they remain very different until indictments are made. Until guilty pleas are delivered.

Trump is merely doing what he was expected to do, what he did prior to winning in 2016. Make an escape plan to make it seem like the only way he could lose would be if someone cheated.

He denigrated election integrity his entire presidency. He will certainly do so for the rest of his life.

He has routinely criticized, bullied and strong-armed people for decades to prop himself up.

But every night, he knows that he lost to "the single worst candidate in the history of America." And he lost fairly and bigly.

Wenodis.

In you're eyes they're different. Not everybody's though. They both could be considered a huge waste of time and taxpayer dollars.
Other than that one could replace Trump with Hillary and she for he in the rest of your post and there wouldn't be much difference at all.

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[marl1220]

"I'm gonna sue. Sue who? Sue you, sue everybody."

-Jerky Boys

[free2131]

Originally Posted by Astros19

In you're eyes they're different. Not everybody's though. They both could be considered a huge waste of time and taxpayer dollars.
Other than that one could replace Trump with Hillary and she for he in the rest of your post and there wouldn't be much difference at all.

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Talking about Russian interference (IE posting false stories on Twitter, Facebook, etc) in an effort to undermine our faith in the voting process is A LOT different than our President saying that Democrats DIRECTLY committed fraud in our voting system.

No one (at least hardly anyone) thought that Russia DIRECTLY interfered in our actual vote counts in 2016. Misinformation was the charge against Russia (which experts in both parties agreed happened). Charges against Trump conspiring with Russians were based on him wanting their help in that misinformation campaign and digging up dirt on other political opponents.

In this instance, Trump is saying that Democrats rigged an election. That they actively changed/threw away/manipulated ballots to directly change the results of this election. That is a WAY more serious charge directed at a political party in OUR country. That is WAY different and A LOT more dangerous.

[JustRachel]

Originally Posted by discostu

Again, equating the Russia Investigation to these wild claims of voter fraud are different.

Very different.

And they remain very different until indictments are made. Until guilty pleas are delivered.

Trump is merely doing what he was expected to do, what he did prior to winning in 2016. Make an escape plan to make it seem like the only way he could lose would be if someone cheated.

He denigrated election integrity his entire presidency. He will certainly do so for the rest of his life.

He has routinely criticized, bullied and strong-armed people for decades to prop himself up.

But every night, he knows that he lost to "the single worst candidate in the history of America." And he lost fairly and bigly.

Wenodis.

I've been struggling trying to find words to respond to this. Every time I have tried, vile hatred for our President has come out and that's not what I want to say.

I want to say that, while my feelings for the man and his presidency are what they are, there is some good that will come from all of this mess. Mr. Trump has taught us a lot. There are many lessons we can attribute to the last few years.

It is my sincere hope that we do just that. Trump exposed quite a few weaknesses in our system, from rampant media bias to election issues and everything in-between. He brought issues to the forefront that Americans had somehow overlooked for a while, like our trade deficiencies and the corruption we call Washington. His presidency elevated issues like systemic racism and the treatment of our veterans back into our minds. I'm not sure how those issues managed to lessen in importance before Trump came along and I'm not saying nobody noticed them, but Mr. Trump put them front and center again and forced us to face them.

He was elected during a time when illegal immigration and terrorism were huge issues for Americans. We were all bickering about things that today might not even make our Top 10 list of problems. It's not that our problems of today didn't exist four years ago, it's that we didn't realize how important they were until Trump came along and reminded us.

Mr Trump didn't fix our problems. Nevertheless, the gift he left for us is a renewed sense of what those problems are. For that, Americans can be grateful.

As Mr. Trump's reign comes to an end, I hope Americans of all political affiliations can learn from the lessons the Trump Administration has taught us. However we feel about the man, I hope we can agree we've learned a lot from him.

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[Astros19]

Originally Posted by free2131

Talking about Russian interference (IE posting false stories on Twitter, Facebook, etc) in an effort to undermine our faith in the voting process is A LOT different than our President saying that Democrats DIRECTLY committed fraud in our voting system.



No one (at least hardly anyone) thought that Russia DIRECTLY interfered in our actual vote counts in 2016. Misinformation was the charge against Russia (which experts in both parties agreed happened). Charges against Trump conspiring with Russians were based on him wanting their help in that misinformation campaign and digging up dirt on other political opponents.



In this instance, Trump is saying that Democrats rigged an election. That they actively changed/threw away/manipulated ballots to directly change the results of this election. That is a WAY more serious charge directed at a political party in OUR country. That is WAY different and A LOT more dangerous.

Well in the other instance Democrats were saying Trump conspired with Russia to win an election and that was proven false.

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[Astros19]

Originally Posted by JustRachel

I've been struggling trying to find words to respond to this. Every time I have tried, vile hatred for our President has come out and that's not what I want to say.

I want to say that, while my feelings for the man and his presidency are what they are, there is some good that will come from all of this mess. Mr. Trump has taught us a lot. There are many lessons we can attribute to the last few years.

It is my sincere hope that we do just that. Trump exposed quite a few weaknesses in our system, from rampant media bias to election issues and everything in-between. He brought issues to the forefront that Americans had somehow overlooked for a while, like our trade deficiencies and the corruption we call Washington. His presidency elevated issues like systemic racism and the treatment of our veterans back into our minds. I'm not sure how those issues managed to lessen in importance before Trump came along and I'm not saying nobody noticed them, but Mr. Trump put them front and center again and forced us to face them.

He was elected during a time when illegal immigration and terrorism were huge issues for Americans. We were all bickering about things that today might not even make our Top 10 list of problems. It's not that our problems of today didn't exist four years ago, it's that we didn't realize how important they were until Trump came along and reminded us.

Mr Trump didn't fix our problems. Nevertheless, the gift he left for us is a renewed sense of what those problems are. For that, Americans can be grateful.

As Mr. Trump's reign comes to an end, I hope Americans of all political affiliations can learn from the lessons the Trump Administration has taught us. However we feel about the man, I hope we can agree we've learned a lot from him.

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Yep, it was good and bad learning experience.

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[Skipscards]

Originally Posted by jewcer2k5

So absolutely wrong. We are the only country where more people can vote for a leader and that leader doesn’t take office. Why does the land the people are on matter? The electoral college is extremely out dated and it actually over values the votes from smaller states and undervalues votes from larger states. People vote, not land.

It’s because we are not one group of people. We are 50 distinct, but united states. The people don’t elect the President, the states do. The founding fathers set it up this way because they were concerned one of the 13 original colonies could dictate the way the country was run and create a de facto monarchy which is what they were trying to escape. We’re a Representative Republic, not a Democracy. The electoral college is elegant and genius.

[free2131]

Originally Posted by Astros19

Well in the other instance Democrats were saying Trump conspired with Russia to win an election and that was proven false.

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Yes, conspiring as in asking for help in spreading misinformation and sowing dissent as well as help with getting dirt on political opponents. Not help DIRECTLY committing voting fraud.

The difference between the two is HUGE, in my opinion.

[NeedChapmans]

Originally Posted by free2131

No one (at least hardly anyone) thought that Russia DIRECTLY interfered in our actual vote counts in 2016. Misinformation was the charge against Russia (which experts in both parties agreed happened). Charges against Trump conspiring with Russians were based on him wanting their help in that misinformation campaign and digging up dirt on other political opponents.

Have you blacked out the last four years already? (There were no charges against Trump BTW so that statement is pretty insane to say).

For four years, the claim was Trump was an agent of Russia. Everyday, we had unnamed sources create fake narratives and stories about lawyers in Prague and Wikileaks emails etc. etc. You think all of that is just hunky dory, while people claiming voter fraud now is outrageous?

All of the Russia stuff was vetted and no evidence came out. Likely true of the voter fraud claims as well but if you truly believe your your team's claims were OK, and red teams claims are beyond the pale; perhaps there's a more obvious reason for that.

[JustRachel]

Originally Posted by Astros19

Well in the other instance Democrats were saying Trump conspired with Russia to win an election and that was proven false.

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Again, it was not proven false. I know, it's semantics to some, but there is a big difference between "proven false" and "unproven".

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[NeedChapmans]

Originally Posted by free2131

Yes, conspiring as in asking for help in spreading misinformation and sowing dissent as well as help with getting dirt on political opponents. Not help DIRECTLY committing voting fraud.

The difference between the two is HUGE, in my opinion.

The Russia investigation had zero to do voting "fraud". That doesn't make it any less ridiculous.

[RedSoxFan28]

@realDonaldTrump
I WON THIS ELECTION, BY A LOT!

12m ago

[JustRachel]

Originally Posted by NeedChapmans

Have you blacked out the last four years already? (There were no charges against Trump BTW so that statement is pretty insane to say).



For four years, the claim was Trump was an agent of Russia. Everyday, we had unnamed sources create fake narratives and stories about lawyers in Prague and Wikileaks emails etc. etc. You think all of that is just hunky dory, while people claiming voter fraud now is outrageous?



All of the Russia stuff was vetted and no evidence came out. Likely true of the voter fraud claims as well but if you truly believe your your team's claims were OK, and red teams claims are beyond the pale; perhaps there's a more obvious reason for that.

It is fair to say that if one is outrageous, both are outrageous.

Both are outrageous.

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[Astros19]

Originally Posted by NeedChapmans

Have you blacked out the last four years already? (There were no charges against Trump BTW so that statement is pretty insane to say).



For four years, the claim was Trump was an agent of Russia. Everyday, we had unnamed sources create fake narratives and stories about lawyers in Prague and Wikileaks emails etc. etc. You think all of that is just hunky dory, while people claiming voter fraud now is outrageous?



All of the Russia stuff was vetted and no evidence came out. Likely true of the voter fraud claims as well but if you truly believe your your team's claims were OK, and red teams claims are beyond the pale; perhaps there's a more obvious reason for that.

I don't know why this is so hard for some to come to terms with. Unless of course it's what their news source has been feeding them.

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[free2131]

Originally Posted by NeedChapmans

Have you blacked out the last four years already? (There were no charges against Trump BTW so that statement is pretty insane to say).

For four years, the claim was Trump was an agent of Russia. Everyday, we had unnamed sources create fake narratives and stories about lawyers in Prague and Wikileaks emails etc. etc. You think all of that is just hunky dory, while people claiming voter fraud now is outrageous?

All of the Russia stuff was vetted and no evidence came out. Likely true of the voter fraud claims as well but if you truly believe your your team's claims were OK, and red teams claims are beyond the pale; perhaps there's a more obvious reason for that.

I meant charges as in charges in the court of public opinion. I DON'T think the claims against Trump being in league with Russia was okay, BUT, I do think that what Trump is alleging is happening in the 2020 election is MORE dangerous and damaging than what Democrats were alleging during the 2016 election.

[JustRachel]

Originally Posted by RedSoxFan28

@realDonaldTrump
I WON THIS ELECTION, BY A LOT!

12m ago

Where is the Maury Povich meme when you need it?

Lol. "Nationwide ballot counts have determined that is a lie."

#FakeNews

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[JustRachel]

Originally Posted by free2131

I meant charges as in charges in the court of public opinion. I DON'T think the claims against Trump being in league with Russia was okay, BUT, I do think that what Trump is alleging is happening in the 2020 election is MORE dangerous and damaging than what Democrats were alleging during the 2016 election.

The bolded is the only part of this statement I agree with.


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