Jumbo Patch Cards are 10x-200x rarer than autograph cards yet unappreciated

[Skeely]

Originally Posted by Noles939913

He’s even selling the card in his profile pic LOL. Account is solely for pumping his cards.

as much as i disagree with ops statements on patches many members have cards that are for sale in there profile pic. its quite common. There is a reason for the bst section here. Its for buying selling and trading. Also the majority of the members here including myself are always pumping something up so even if op is its not rare or distinguishable from many other good members.

[Skeely]

Originally Posted by pewe

It’s why many of the autos from the “hit products” you are referring to sell for a large discount even if they might be a “1/1”

Essentially relevant autos are restricted to a smaller set of product...

FWIW my son loves patch cards: “dad, can I feel it???”

But the ones I love the most are game used with actual game referenced and relevant in the card, like this




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I love tribute, the red sox and game worn relics so naturally I LOVE that card. I love seeing your devers cards every time pewe. Your 2 year mark collection showoff thread was the #@#@#@#@.

[jjstock]

Originally Posted by Noles939913

He’s even selling the card in his profile pic LOL. Account is solely for pumping his cards.

If you look at the prices on the cards, I'm not "seriously" selling these.
I can't convince you that I am not pumping but that's that.

[jjstock]

Originally Posted by koreanmarklee

Are you not counting the In The Name relics in Topps Flagship?
Even if you're not...there are a lot of sets which combine really nice patches with autos:
Five Star, Museum, Flawless, National Treasures, Luminaries, Dynasty, Inception, Definitive, Diamond Icons to name a few. This isn't including Leaf cards, which oversaturate the patch market with products like Leaf Trinity etc
I don't know why people would pay premium for a jumbo patch when the market is flooded with (auto+patch) cards.

I am counting the in the name.

Inception are player used if I am not mistaken.
Dynasty patches are 2x bigger than the normal patch, but not quite jumbo (4x) size.

The number of jumbo (4x) + auto cards aren't that much - I'm confident that even if you include those, the total number of jumbo patch cards is probably still in the 100-200 range, which is dwarfed by the 5k-20k range of autos in general

[jjstock]

Originally Posted by ddearing

My opinion may be in the minority, but I stay away from them because the certificates on them do not even say that they were ever touched by the player on the card. From a legal standpoint and using their certification on the card as it reads, they could purchase a single jersey of a scrub on the Angels and use it in Mike Trout patch cards. It would be "game used" and not from "any particular game, event, or season". This would save the companies a lot of money and I'd be willing to bet this is exactly what they do most of the time.

I miss the old Donruss and UD jersey/bat cards that read like
"You have just received a card that contains a piece of an authentic game-used bat, used by Babe Ruth, outfielder for the New York Yankees"
or
"on the front of this card is an authentic piece of a jersey worn by Ken Griffey jr in an official Reds Major League baseball game."

Why would they get rid of this language if it was still true?

Agree 100%

[jjstock]

Originally Posted by Skeely

as much as i disagree with ops statements on patches many members have cards that are for sale in there profile pic. its quite common. There is a reason for the bst section here. Its for buying selling and trading. Also the majority of the members here including myself are always pumping something up so even if op is its not rare or distinguishable from many other good members.

I agree with you. There's a difference between trying to get people to collect what you do, and outright market manipulation (fake sales)

I don't see anything wrong with trying to get more people to enjoy collecting what I do (which is jumbo patches)

[redsandbengals]

Originally Posted by ddearing

My opinion may be in the minority, but I stay away from them because the certificates on them do not even say that they were ever touched by the player on the card. From a legal standpoint and using their certification on the card as it reads, they could purchase a single jersey of a scrub on the Angels and use it in Mike Trout patch cards. It would be "game used" and not from "any particular game, event, or season". This would save the companies a lot of money and I'd be willing to bet this is exactly what they do most of the time.

I miss the old Donruss and UD jersey/bat cards that read like
"You have just received a card that contains a piece of an authentic game-used bat, used by Babe Ruth, outfielder for the New York Yankees"
or
"on the front of this card is an authentic piece of a jersey worn by Ken Griffey jr in an official Reds Major League baseball game."

Why would they get rid of this language if it was still true?

I miss this too. I liked the picture of the actual jersey on the back of the card.

[pewe]

Originally Posted by Skeely

I love tribute, the red sox and game worn relics so naturally I LOVE that card. I love seeing your devers cards every time pewe. Your 2 year mark collection showoff thread was the #@#@#@#@.

Thanks! So kind of you


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[DevonMPalmer]

Originally Posted by redsandbengals

I miss this too. I liked the picture of the actual jersey on the back of the card.

Remember when Donruss noticeably dropped something like 250k+ on a famous Babe Ruth jersey? When have we heard of Topps doing this?

Just compare Tribute to National Treasures... Panini still has Topps beat with their game used inventory. I hate the lack of logos and won't ever buy the stuff, but some of the names are quite old and killer. As a Yankee fan, getting Herb Pennock stuff in the present day? Topps would never, aside from maybe a 1/1 cut in a 20k product.

Frankly, it seems Panini is still utilizing material they had from when they had a license... And Topps is not, because all their best stuff (think with the stamp) comes after their monopoly.

[speedyjg13]

The reason why these patch cards do not sell for much is because there is no proof they were used in a game. I stay far away from these, even if they come with an on card auto. Most of these patches/swatches are player worn, which means Topps probably met them in Spring Training and told them to put on and take off these 10 jerseys. Player does it in 2 minutes and there you go, player worn jersey swatches/patches from a jersey they probably bought at Big 5.

Topps Definitive has the MLB hologram on almost all their patch cards. I would buy those if there was a player I liked since I would know the player personally wore that patch in an MLB game.

For example, this 2020 Definitive Mike Trout card (NOT MY CARD) has a swatch on it which was used in a real MLB game. If you look up the game, you see Trout hit a homerun while wearing the swatch. What's better than having a card that you know for a fact Trout used to hit a HR.

Don't fall for the Topps scam of these crazy looking patches/swatches that were never used in an MLB game.

If I get any patch cards, they MUST come with an MLB authentication hologram. No MLB hologram, I keep scrolling.

The hologram looks like the one below.

[jjstock]

I am curious about the fear that the patches aren't used in a real game.

So in this thread, I've showed how jumbo patch cards are 10-200x rarer than autograph cards.

However, they aren't necessarily super rare: there's probably 50-100 jumbo patch cards available to be made from each jersey, and I'd imagine that Topps/Panini have 100x of game-used jerseys to use.

While it's possible that the patches are fake, I find it doubtful considering how cheap it is to make it real.

(obviously my comments relate to modern/active players)

[djolley86]

I think we can all agree that every single non-MLB authenticated (with the sticker) relic/patch is probably a fake, right? Just look at the wording on the back of the cards. The vagueness of their wording around its authenticity tells you all you need to know.

[speedyjg13]

Originally Posted by jjstock

I am curious about the fear that the patches aren't used in a real game.

So in this thread, I've showed how jumbo patch cards are 10-200x rarer than autograph cards.

However, they aren't necessarily super rare: there's probably 50-100 jumbo patch cards available to be made from each jersey, and I'd imagine that Topps/Panini have 100x of game-used jerseys to use.

While it's possible that the patches are fake, I find it doubtful considering how cheap it is to make it real.

(obviously my comments relate to modern/active players)

It doesn't matter how rare these cards are.... they could be /1 but as long as they don't have the MLB authentication hologram, they are worthless (to me), regardless of what they are serial numbered out of.

[LC2nine10]

Also rarity doesnt equal value.
Id rather have an auto than a tiny piece of fabric.

Didn't panini get caught with fake Russel Wilson patches in freaking Flawless?

[374cardshop]

Originally Posted by DevonMPalmer

This changed in the new decade... Right? I was a much more involved collector as a teen in the 2000s and patches seemed to be all the rage, accompanied with the now cringe-inducing siiiiiiiick, NASTY, MOJO, etc. identifiers. I still have a lot of these and they were pricier than the associated autos.

Topps has never produced anything like 05 Donruss Prime Patches or UD's Exquisite. Autos seemed to be much more rare back then and were basically Sweet Spot or SP Authentic.

Back than, everything seemed to be much more likely to actually have been game used too. I think the current vague authenticity statements go hand in hand with the current issues.

I remember those 2005 Sweet Spot Classic patches. I think the cheapest ones back then went for about $30-50 the bigger names well into the 3 figure range and some of the really amazing ones hit 4 figures.

[Chrisyork33]

Originally Posted by jjstock

I am curious about the fear that the patches aren't used in a real game.

So in this thread, I've showed how jumbo patch cards are 10-200x rarer than autograph cards.

However, they aren't necessarily super rare: there's probably 50-100 jumbo patch cards available to be made from each jersey, and I'd imagine that Topps/Panini have 100x of game-used jerseys to use.

While it's possible that the patches are fake, I find it doubtful considering how cheap it is to make it real.

(obviously my comments relate to modern/active players)

Supply and demand determine value.

Currently collectors have a higher demand for autos in spite of the higher supply.

This can always change.

If this is what you PC and you perceive you are receiving a discount to their intrinsic value then I’d be excited.

[Noles939913]

Originally Posted by DevonMPalmer

Remember when Donruss noticeably dropped something like 250k+ on a famous Babe Ruth jersey? When have we heard of Topps doing this?

Just compare Tribute to National Treasures... Panini still has Topps beat with their game used inventory. I hate the lack of logos and won't ever buy the stuff, but some of the names are quite old and killer. As a Yankee fan, getting Herb Pennock stuff in the present day? Topps would never, aside from maybe a 1/1 cut in a 20k product.

Frankly, it seems Panini is still utilizing material they had from when they had a license... And Topps is not, because all their best stuff (think with the stamp) comes after their monopoly.

Did Panini ever have a baseball license? Also I’ve seen examples where they used model bats that were never used in a game and likely never touched by the player on some of their knob/plate cards of older players.

[DevonMPalmer]

Originally Posted by Noles939913

Did Panini ever have a baseball license? Also I’ve seen examples where they used model bats that were never used in a game and likely never touched by the player on some of their knob/plate cards of older players.

Not Panini, but many of their brands were Donruss/Leaf/Playoff, who absolutely had a license back then.

[jjstock]

Originally Posted by djolley86

I think we can all agree that every single non-MLB authenticated (with the sticker) relic/patch is probably a fake, right? Just look at the wording on the back of the cards. The vagueness of their wording around its authenticity tells you all you need to know.

No, they aren't fake, and I don't think there's a consensus that they're fake.

[jjstock]

For more reference on scarcity: Tier One Prodigious Patch cards seem to be one every 2-3 cases


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[djolley86]

Originally Posted by jjstock

No, they aren't fake, and I don't think there's a consensus that they're fake.

What gives you any indication that they are real? If they were, wouldn't card makers be more thorough/descriptive of the card's authenticity? Most relics now say that it is an "event worn" item not from any particular game, etc. 90% of the relics out there don't even allude to the fact that the "relic" is even worn by the specific player on the front of the card. Seems sketchy to me.

[jjstock]

Originally Posted by djolley86

What gives you any indication that they are real? If they were, wouldn't card makers be more thorough/descriptive of the card's authenticity? Most relics now say that it is an "event worn" item not from any particular game, etc. 90% of the relics out there don't even allude to the fact that the "relic" is even worn by the specific player on the front of the card. Seems sketchy to me.

While anything is possible, it seems far more likely that the 10k autographs produced every year are fake than the limited number of jumbo patch cards (~100) are fake. A player might have 100+ jerseys every year, and each jersey can make 30-50 jumbo patch card.

Both autographs and patch cards should be real. If any are fake then the card manufacturers are being cheapskates considering the high margins they make


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