The Hotstove Thread

[Homerun]

Originally Posted by Hollywood42

Have fun with that

It's not as impossible as it appears. The Sox have a ridiculous amount of money to spend. They would have to significantly outbid everyone but you never know.

[Hollywood42]

I'm not even saying you won't get him. I just think you wouldn't be quite so happy about it a few years down the road

Originally Posted by Homerun

It's not as impossible as it appears. The Sox have a ridiculous amount of money to spend. They would have to significantly outbid everyone but you never know.

[Homerun]

Originally Posted by Hollywood42

I'm not even saying you won't get him. I just think you wouldn't be quite so happy about it a few years down the road

It's a risk I'm willing to take. The Sox NEED a superstar type talent. Desperately. Obviously he has flaws but he's still an elite talent.

[Hollywood42]

Why blow $200 million on the first stud? Not saying your roster is complete crap right now, but you're a lot more than one stud away from winning. You'll need your top prospects to turn out if you're going anywhere in the next few years, in which case I don't know if it makes sense to spend multiple hundreds of millions of dollars on a stud for 7+ years and take away money down the road for possible extensions to the prospects if they do even turn out

Originally Posted by Homerun

It's a risk I'm willing to take. The Sox NEED a superstar type talent. Desperately. Obviously he has flaws but he's still an elite talent.

[Homerun]

Originally Posted by Hollywood42

Why blow $200 million on the first stud? Not saying your roster is complete crap right now, but you're a lot more than one stud away from winning. You'll need your top prospects to turn out if you're going anywhere in the next few years, in which case I don't know if it makes sense to spend multiple hundreds of millions of dollars on a stud for 7+ years and take away money down the road for possible extensions to the prospects if they do even turn out

Almost everyone who the Sox are counting on in this rebuild are under team control through at least the 2023 season, so they can afford to pay big money for a superstar now since the payroll is ridiculously low. Guys in their primes don't come along in free agency all that often, gotta seize the opportunity while it's there.

[packman80]

Originally Posted by base set

Moutakas declined his option with Milwaukee - $15 Million. Maybe San Diego wants to double down, otherwise this seems a bit optimistic. But I don’t know the current value of 1 WAR, either.

Soria also declined his option in Beer Town, for $10 Million. He did have a good 2nd half for the Brewers; I wonder which NL division plays the AL Central next year. Optimism again, methinks.

Moutakas must have had one to many of Milwaukee's Best LOL No way do I see him finding a deal to pay him more than $15 million. Though I doubt the Brewers would have picked up the option either.

Soria him declining was smart move as pitching is always in demand and very likely he is going to find a deal that pays him more than $10 million.

[JackThree]

Originally Posted by Homerun

Nah, the Sox are getting Machado.

I don’t think the Sox will go “all in” on a free agent just yet. I figure around the 2020/2021 offseason, once all their young core guys are called up - Robert, Rutherford, Madrigal, etc...

This offseason I could see them sign a couple guys for 2 years with an option year added. I figure Moustakas, Brantley & Gio Gonzalez and a bullpen arm would fit the bill until those guys above are ready. The Sox could start to compete for a Wild Card spot in 2019 with those three, while bringing up some new blood from the minors - Eloy, Hansen, Adams, Stephens, Zavala, Burdi and probably Collins & Basabe in September.

[Cheddar]

Originally Posted by Homerun

Almost everyone who the Sox are counting on in this rebuild are under team control through at least the 2023 season, so they can afford to pay big money for a superstar now since the payroll is ridiculously low. Guys in their primes don't come along in free agency all that often, gotta seize the opportunity while it's there.

I feel like the White Sox timeline is a little bit longer, especially with the injuries to a handful of prospects this season. I don’t think it’s worth dumping 250+ mil into a player when there is SO much uncertainty to what you have. I say you see what you’ve got when Eloy comes up this year, then Robert, Adolfo, Madrigal in a couple years, and if you’re in a good spot with those guys, go drop a fortune on Francisco Lindor.

[Hollywood42]

Not trying to crap on your team, despite my fandom, but I think it's VERY aggressive to think the Sox should be trying to get a WC slot this season

Originally Posted by JackThree

I don’t think the Sox will go “all in” on a free agent just yet. I figure around the 2020/2021 offseason, once all their young core guys are called up - Robert, Rutherford, Madrigal, etc...

This offseason I could see them sign a couple guys for 2 years with an option year added. I figure Moustakas, Brantley & Gio Gonzalez and a bullpen arm would fit the bill until those guys above are ready. The Sox could start to compete for a Wild Card spot in 2019 with those three, while bringing up some new blood from the minors - Eloy, Hansen, Adams, Stephens, Zavala, Burdi and probably Collins & Basabe in September.

[Homerun]

Originally Posted by Cheddar

I feel like the White Sox timeline is a little bit longer, especially with the injuries to a handful of prospects this season. I don’t think it’s worth dumping 250+ mil into a player when there is SO much uncertainty to what you have. I say you see what you’ve got when Eloy comes up this year, then Robert, Adolfo, Madrigal in a couple years, and if you’re in a good spot with those guys, go drop a fortune on Francisco Lindor.

What if those guys don't pan out though? Then what? I'm not a fan of playing the waiting game and kicking the metaphorical can down the road. Just sign Machado and go from there.

[Hollywood42]

That's not really how it works

Originally Posted by Homerun

What if those guys don't pan out though? Then what? I'm not a fan of playing the waiting game and kicking the metaphorical can down the road. Just sign Machado and go from there.

[Homerun]

Originally Posted by Hollywood42

That's not really how it works

What do you mean?

[Cheddar]

Originally Posted by Homerun

What if those guys don't pan out though? Then what? I'm not a fan of playing the waiting game and kicking the metaphorical can down the road. Just sign Machado and go from there.

That’s what I’d be worried about. What if those guys don’t pan out and Machado flops? You’re stuck with a horrible team and an albatross of a contract you can’t move. That’s crippling for a franchise like the White Sox who can’t afford to blow money all over the place and not worry about it.

[Hollywood42]

What Cheddar said, and more. It makes no sense at all to take that risk right now

Originally Posted by Homerun

What do you mean?

Originally Posted by Cheddar

That’s what I’d be worried about. What if those guys don’t pan out and Machado flops? You’re stuck with a horrible team and an albatross of a contract you can’t move. That’s crippling for a franchise like the White Sox who can’t afford to blow money all over the place and not worry about it.

[Homerun]

Originally Posted by Hollywood42

What Cheddar said, and more. It makes no sense at all to take that risk right now

How is it all that different than when the Cubs signed Jon Lester prior to the 2015 season? That was less money and he didn't have as much baggage as Machado, but very few of the Cubs core players were established when they signed Lester.

[Cheddar]

Originally Posted by Homerun

How is it all that different than when the Cubs signed Jon Lester prior to the 2015 season? That was less money and he didn't have as much baggage as Machado, but very few of the Cubs core players were established when they signed Lester.

As you mentioned, I think the financials of the deal are going to be significantly different. I think Machado is going to require about 100 mil more than it cost for Lester. The Cubs and Sox are also in very different financial situations. The Cubs generate much, much more money than the White Sox do, and there’s going to be even more Cubs money on the way when they launch their network. They can afford to throw some bad money out there, as evidenced by Heyward, Darvish, and Chatwood.

[Hollywood42]

Cheddar got it again. The Sox and Cubs really aren't that comparable despite playing in the same city

Originally Posted by Homerun

How is it all that different than when the Cubs signed Jon Lester prior to the 2015 season? That was less money and he didn't have as much baggage as Machado, but very few of the Cubs core players were established when they signed Lester.

Originally Posted by Cheddar

As you mentioned, I think the financials of the deal are going to be significantly different. I think Machado is going to require about 100 mil more than it cost for Lester. The Cubs and Sox are also in very different financial situations. The Cubs generate much, much more money than the White Sox do, and there’s going to be even more Cubs money on the way when they launch their network. They can afford to throw some bad money out there, as evidenced by Heyward, Darvish, and Chatwood.

[Homerun]

Originally Posted by Cheddar

As you mentioned, I think the financials of the deal are going to be significantly different. I think Machado is going to require about 100 mil more than it cost for Lester. The Cubs and Sox are also in very different financial situations. The Cubs generate much, much more money than the White Sox do, and there’s going to be even more Cubs money on the way when they launch their network. They can afford to throw some bad money out there, as evidenced by Heyward, Darvish, and Chatwood.

I definitely see what you're saying and history dictates that the Sox don't spend all that much in free agency. I'm trying to be hopeful though, I want a winning team on the South Side so badly.

[Cheddar]

Originally Posted by Homerun

I definitely see what you're saying and history dictates that the Sox don't spend all that much in free agency. I'm trying to be hopeful though, I want a winning team on the South Side so badly.

I really do think it’s coming. The best thing that Hahn has done so far is to get Reinsdorf to trust him and take the reigns over from Kenny Williams. They are stockpiling a ton of talent, Hahn really seems to have a knack for maximing the returns on in the trade market. Last year just really sucked because of all injuries that happened to a bunch of guys that they’re going to be counting on in the near future.

[bwalter1]

Originally Posted by Homerun

I definitely see what you're saying and history dictates that the Sox don't spend all that much in free agency. I'm trying to be hopeful though, I want a winning team on the South Side so badly.

James Shields better be gone, especially to free up some $. They have to get pitching, pitching and more pitching. Whether it is call ups or signing a few they have to get a better pitching staff. A team era of 4.83 is not going to get a team to the playoffs. They also have gave up the most walks in the majors last year. Rodon, Giolito, and Lopez showed some promise at times but need to see steps forward with consistency from them. The bullpen and Sp should be their main focus.

As far as Machado to the White Sox or another big player on offense it would not be smart to put all that money into them as their current staff will give up more runs than he would add. Dig into their minors and see what they can fill holes with if they aren't going to spend alot.

Also Moncado with his .235 average and 217 ks is not going to cut it. The sox will be in the playoffs again but that will be a few years so don't go throwing money at one position player and hoping what they already have wakes up.

[SethMurphy]

Anyone have a conversation or interesting news/rumors on any of the other teams not wearing White Sox

[Boo]

Originally Posted by SethMurphy

Anyone have a conversation or interesting news/rumors on any of the other teams not wearing White Sox

I'm not sure any news or rumors about the WS are interesting.

[FT35]

Originally Posted by Homerun

I definitely see what you're saying and history dictates that the Sox don't spend all that much in free agency. I'm trying to be hopeful though, I want a winning team on the South Side so badly.

With ya man. I know Soxtalk has been lighting up with Machado talk, but I'm just not as sure about him as I was this time last year. He's going to cost a billion dollars and we are more than Machado away form contending. I'd let the elite fight over this contract and use the $ we have on pieces that are based around winning today's game--SP/roster flexibility/BULLPEN. In other words, use Milwaukee's model rather than the Cubs'. We can't afford the Cubs' model. But we can still add 1-2 nice bats AND begin to assemble some sort of pitching staff if we can begin to add some pieces.

I do believe they will spend THIS WINTER...there are too many options out there not to spend...and we all know Jerry wants to knock as many years off this re-build as humanly possible. Just don't know if Harper/Machado make sense right now. Neither have proven they are capable of leading a team to a championship--and both are prone to "off" years. Remember this number when weighing Machado and Harper. 2. That's the TOTAL number of 100 RBI seasons that they have COMBINED. 1 each and both came this year in contract years...I'm sorry...I bleed black/white, but for a team like the White Sox, that SCREAMS pass...we'd ABSOLUTELY get the "under" on all their unmotivated Sox years--at record-breaking rates. We completely FAIL at Free Agency.

Give me Moose, Grandal on the cheap with something to prove, Marwin Gonzalez, Eovaldi or Happ, and BULLPEN CENTRAL for the same money as Machado/Harper.

[BostonNut]

Originally Posted by Boo

I'm not sure any news or rumors about the WS are interesting.

[base set]

Brewers finished with #5 ERA in MLB. Also #5 in bullpen ERA. So this week they fired the Bullpen coach and the Pitching coach split for Cincinnati. Hitting coach bailed too.