Is this why PG didn't go to LA?

[JMys55]

Originally Posted by DevinKurant

This was well said. I’m a 90s kid so I pick MJ over Lebron (#biased) but this post was convincing. Great share.


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I agree. I am 90s kid as well (best decade of course, ha!) and would probably pick MJ over LeBron since Jordan's career and excitement was amazing. My goal was to share some additional thought to the conversation for those who believe LeBron is no where close to Jordan. Generally, fans use a few subjective metrics to make their conclusion, when the comparison is actually more complex than that, with both players and careers actually being very comparable.

I would bet if Jordan and LeBron ever had to face off in their prime, they would both beat each other at different times, with neither one completely dominating the other. It would be Magic vs. Bird 2.0 except taking place the 90s.

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[yiguiri2002]

My favorite part of this thread is people saying that, if it wasn't for the teams that beat LeBron's team, he would have more rings.

LeBron and Jordan are completely different animals.

- When Jordan first retired, Pippen, Kukoc and Grant were in their primes or entering theirs.
- When LeBron left Cleveland the first time, guys were either past their prime or not really good. And FWIW, they weren't even the best team in the conference.
- When Jordan retired after the shot, Bulls entered a rebuild, partly, because running the same team back would have resulted in a first round exit at best. Everyone was past their prime at that point.
- Last season's Cleveland team should have lost in the Conference Finals. Everyone in that team is past their prime or just not good enough.

Point is, you can't compare both situations. LeBron left a team with no All-Stars while Jordan left one with 2 (one being an All-NBA player).

[Orangejello727]

I dont know why people put so much emphasis into what a player like PG says?? The guy has done nothing in his career that sticks out to warrant the attention he gets. So he didnt want to play in LA and wanted to stay in OKA. Good for him. Dont dig for reasons that arent there. At the end of the day, guys like him fall way side within the pool of all other players that are not super stars.

Im glad he stayed in OKA. Come to to us when they win a title. Then whatever his yap is, it might be credible.

[Orangejello727]

Originally Posted by ninjacookies

But wait.

I thought the BO narrative was that Westbrook is the ultimate selfish team cancer that everyone can't wait to get away from?

I'm confused.

So what you're saying is if there is a single player out there like PG that says he wants to play with Russ, that equates to "everyone" feeling the exact same way??

It works both ways!

[pgisback]

Originally Posted by yiguiri2002

My favorite part of this thread is people saying that, if it wasn't for the teams that beat LeBron's team, he would have more rings.

LeBron and Jordan are completely different animals.

- When Jordan first retired, Pippen, Kukoc and Grant were in their primes or entering theirs.
- When LeBron left Cleveland the first time, guys were either past their prime or not really good. And FWIW, they weren't even the best team in the conference.
- When Jordan retired after the shot, Bulls entered a rebuild, partly, because running the same team back would have resulted in a first round exit at best. Everyone was past their prime at that point.
- Last season's Cleveland team should have lost in the Conference Finals. Everyone in that team is past their prime or just not good enough.

Point is, you can't compare both situations. LeBron left a team with no All-Stars while Jordan left one with 2 (one being an All-NBA player).

Yea, the comparisons are funny. The Bulls in 93/94 were 55-27. So either they were really good without MJ or the NBA was really bad in the 90s. Lebron leaves the Cavs and they're pretty much the worst team in the NBA. MJ could never lead this Cavs team to the Finals. Only one player in history could do that. AKA... the GOAT!

[yiguiri2002]

Originally Posted by pgisback

Yea, the comparisons are funny. The Bulls in 93/94 were 55-27. So either they were really good without MJ or the NBA was really bad in the 90s. Lebron leaves the Cavs and they're pretty much the worst team in the NBA. MJ could never lead this Cavs team to the Finals. Only one player in history could do that. AKA... the GOAT!

Jesus man, don't you ever get tired?

If you have a great team and you get a Top 5 All-Time player, you are winning the championship (Jordan)

If you have a bad team and you get a Top 5 All-Time player, you don't win anything (LeBron)

It's very simple. None of this makes one better or worse than the other one.

[pgisback]

Originally Posted by yiguiri2002

Jesus man, don't you ever get tired?

If you have a great team and you get a Top 5 All-Time player, you are winning the championship (Jordan)

If you have a bad team and you get a Top 5 All-Time player, you don't win anything (LeBron)

It's very simple. None of this makes one better or worse than the other one.

Sure it does. And going to the Finals is "winning something". You act like getting to the Finals is easy. With a lottery team it can only be done with one man and one man only. The GOAT. Not only did James get to the Finals with a much worse team but he had to play a team that was better than any team MJ had to play. All while putting up more points, rebounds, assists, steals, and blocks. What James has done the last 3 years is what makes him GOAT. Not even close anymore.

[yiguiri2002]

Originally Posted by pgisback

Sure it does. And going to the Finals is "winning something". You act like getting to the Finals is easy. With a lottery team it can only be done with one man and one man only. The GOAT. Not only did James get to the Finals with a much worse team but he had to play a team that was better than any team MJ had to play. All while putting up more points, rebounds, assists, steals, and blocks. What James has done the last 3 years is what makes him GOAT. Not even close anymore.

Getting to the Finals from the East is easy. LeBron getting to the Finals has more to do with the lack of good teams in the conference than anything else.

Like I said, those are 2 completely different things. LeBron shouldn't get credit for beating decent teams to get to the Finals nor he should get punished because he lost to an all-time great team. People make these arguments because they want to believe they are right and stuff like this validates them.

They both had to deal with different things with different results. Period.

[pgisback]

Originally Posted by yiguiri2002

Getting to the Finals from the East is easy. LeBron getting to the Finals has more to do with the lack of good teams in the conference than anything else.

Like I said, those are 2 completely different things. LeBron shouldn't get credit for beating decent teams to get to the Finals nor he should get punished because he lost to an all-time great team. People make these arguments because they want to believe they are right and stuff like this validates them.

They both had to deal with different things with different results. Period.

If it’s so easy why aren’t his Cavs even going to make the playoffs this year? If going to the Finals is easy going to the playoffs should be automatic.

[Noah]

Originally Posted by pgisback

Sure it does. And going to the Finals is "winning something". You act like getting to the Finals is easy. With a lottery team it can only be done with one man and one man only. The GOAT. Not only did James get to the Finals with a much worse team but he had to play a team that was better than any team MJ had to play. All while putting up more points, rebounds, assists, steals, and blocks. What James has done the last 3 years is what makes him GOAT. Not even close anymore.

Wan't the warriors a lottery team prior to a 7th pick?

So i guess it can be done by more than one man and one man only, and it can be done way better than the GOAT, not only did curry get to the finals he bounced lebron and continues to bounce Lebron in sweeping Fashion

Lebron has nice individual stats like Iverson and Stephon Marbury, Jordan has nice individual stats combined with team success

Going to the finals is "Winning Something" yea 2nd place, Jordan Never Played for 2nd place

[pgisback]

Originally Posted by Noah

Wan't the warriors a lottery team prior to a 7th pick?

So i guess it can be done by more than one man and one man only, and it can be done way better than the GOAT, not only did curry get to the finals he bounced lebron and continues to bounce Lebron in sweeping Fashion

Lebron has nice individual stats like Iverson and Stephon Marbury, Jordan has nice individual stats combined with team success

Going to the finals is "Winning Something" yea 2nd place, Jordan Never Played for 2nd place

The point about lottery teams you obviously didn’t understand. And I agree with. The Bulls as a team were amazing! GOAT team. Lebron GOAT player.

[Noah]

Originally Posted by pgisback

The point about lottery teams you obviously didn’t understand. And I agree with. The Bulls as a team were amazing! GOAT team. Lebron GOAT player.

When KD breaks every individual record Lebron has ever put up will he be the GOAT Player?

[pgisback]

Originally Posted by Noah

When KD breaks every individual record Lebron has ever put up will he be the GOAT Player?

No, because he joined a team that won 72 games without him. He'll forever be the biggest GOAT cupcake.

[Noah]

Originally Posted by pgisback

No, because he joined a team that won 72 games without him. He'll forever be the biggest GOAT cupcake.

Only Lebron fanboys call him cupcake, But the fact is KD is the Baker and lebron is the cupcake, KD eats Lebron up

But he Joined a 72 win team that was beat by your GOAT, KD has kept your GOAT from getting jewelry twice now and will continue to bounce him.

To be considered GOAT you have to keep someone from winning, Lebron hasn't kept anyone away from the throne.

He bounces from team to team ruining front offices, killing coaches, destroying teammates, turning ALL STAR and FUTURE HALL OF FAME teammates into what you Lebron fans call "bums" "corpses"

Then when he destroys the coaches and players confidence he leaves and Lebron fanboys get some sick thrill of seeing a Cavs team only win 20 games or whatever it was after losing a coach, 5-7 players, and lebron

He leaves the heat, wade only plays 40 games or so the next season, think bosh played 10-15 games, they trade 3-5 other players from the Lebron era and you fanboys act like well....... they are losing because 1 man left..... NANANANNANA Tell the whole story..

He Runs Kyrie------ THE FUTURE OF THE CAVS OUT OF TOWN, he gets them to sign his "FRIENDS" to horrible contracts to play with him and then he bounces.

Lebron has had more hall of fame and all star teammates then anyone of his era and Kd is a cupcake for joining a team that lost to lebron. YEAH RIGHT

[pgisback]

Originally Posted by Noah

Only Lebron fanboys call him cupcake, But the fact is KD is the Baker and lebron is the cupcake, KD eats Lebron up

But he Joined a 72 win team that was beat by your GOAT, KD has kept your GOAT from getting jewelry twice now and will continue to bounce him.

To be considered GOAT you have to keep someone from winning, Lebron hasn't kept anyone away from the throne.

He bounces from team to team ruining front offices, killing coaches, destroying teammates, turning ALL STAR and FUTURE HALL OF FAME teammates into what you Lebron fans call "bums" "corpses"

Then when he destroys the coaches and players confidence he leaves and Lebron fanboys get some sick thrill of seeing a Cavs team only win 20 games or whatever it was after losing a coach, 5-7 players, and lebron

He leaves the heat, wade only plays 40 games or so the next season, think bosh played 10-15 games, they trade 3-5 other players from the Lebron era and you fanboys act like well....... they are losing because 1 man left..... NANANANNANA Tell the whole story..

He Runs Kyrie------ THE FUTURE OF THE CAVS OUT OF TOWN, he gets them to sign his "FRIENDS" to horrible contracts to play with him and then he bounces.

Lebron has had more hall of fame and all star teammates then anyone of his era and Kd is a cupcake for joining a team that lost to lebron. YEAH RIGHT

Lol, "more hall of fame and all star teammates" than anyone of his era. That's a funny comment, as if playing with different all stars in different years means he's had more support than playing with the same all star for his entire career. It's funny what you guys have to come up with to argue against one of the most obvious things in sports history. And I think it's funny how you talk about the Cavs like they would have been better off without Lebron and Lebron ruined their amazing history of dominance, lol. You guys crack me up.

[csrockerzero]

Soooo many excuses.

If LeBron wants to silent the critics, he needs to win. Plain and simple. It takes a team to win, and the all-time greats enabled their entire team of players to perform at the level needed to win.

Is he the greatest individual talent of all-time? I think so.

Is he the greatest NBA player of all-time? No, not by a long shot.

[drobfan8]

LeBron is the only "GOAT" that had his direct opposite player get the finals MVP. And it's happened 4 times now. You'd think ay least someone else would get it right? Because Bron is a great defender right?

Iggy
Kawhi
KD
KD

[yiguiri2002]

Originally Posted by drobfan8

LeBron is the only "GOAT" that had his direct opposite player get the finals MVP. And it's happened 4 times now. You'd think ay least someone else would get it right? Because Bron is a great defender right?

Iggy
Kawhi
KD
KD

To be fair to LeBron, Curry deserved 2 of those. So only twice?

I think a better point would be to say he hasn't won an MVP in 5 seasons and he probably won't win one again. I think that's the biggest knock on LeBron, more than his Finals losses.

[Noah]

Originally Posted by pgisback

Lol, "more hall of fame and all star teammates" than anyone of his era. That's a funny comment, as if playing with different all stars in different years means he's had more support than playing with the same all star for his entire career. It's funny what you guys have to come up with to argue against one of the most obvious things in sports history. And I think it's funny how you talk about the Cavs like they would have been better off without Lebron and Lebron ruined their amazing history of dominance, lol. You guys crack me up.

Lebron is GREAT, and yes he has had more support than any other star player of his era

Cavs would be better right now if Lebron didn't run his ALL STAR teammate out of town

Lebron turns all stars into non all stars

[drobfan8]

Originally Posted by yiguiri2002

To be fair to LeBron, Curry deserved 2 of those. So only twice?

I think a better point would be to say he hasn't won an MVP in 5 seasons and he probably won't win one again. I think that's the biggest knock on LeBron, more than his Finals losses.

Yeh Steph was robbed twice.

Fair call.

I never get why people argue MJ had 3 All Stars. Rodman wasn't one with the Bulls, ever.

We know the first 3 peat had Pip and was Horace an All star once or more?

Edit, H. Grant was an All Star once and that was 1994 when MJ wasn't even there.

[pgisback]

Originally Posted by Noah

Lebron is GREAT, and yes he has had more support than any other star player of his era

Cavs would be better right now if Lebron didn't run his ALL STAR teammate out of town

Lebron turns all stars into non all stars

Playing with multiple all stars at various points does not mean he has had more support than others, lol. The Spurs and Warriors teams who beat him in the finals had far more support than he had. The things you guys come up with are so ridiculous they are funny.

Cavs were a lottery team before Lebron, lottery team after. Acting like Lebron ruined the Cavs is another hilarious outtake by the anti-Lebron blowout crowd.

[Noah]

Originally Posted by pgisback

Playing with multiple all stars at various points does not mean he has had more support than others, lol. The Spurs and Warriors teams who beat him in the finals had far more support than he had. The things you guys come up with are so ridiculous they are funny.

Cavs were a lottery team before Lebron, lottery team after. Acting like Lebron ruined the Cavs is another hilarious outtake by the anti-Lebron blowout crowd.

Yes that’s exactly what it means, having the greatest 3 point shooter of all time on your team is more support than having patty mills or Matt Bonner

Having wade in his prime is better than a 37 year old manu

Come on quit being a lap dog for a moment and admit it



Kyrie
Wiggins
Tristan

All had teams wanting them before lebron, traded Wiggins for Kevin love who lebron fans call a bum, Tristan is considered a bum after lebron, kyrie ran out of town

Trade values dropped on every person lebron has ever played with, and lebron wanted vets to play with so now they have a 37 year old korver with no trade bait, draft picks went to Atlanta. 35 year old Frye, 33 year old j.r, 32 year old George hill. All guys lebron wanted

How are they not worse as a franchise after what lebron stuck them with? Lebron quit again like a cupcake because he knew they were screwed by his horrible “decision” again

Cavs had cap room and trade bait to make something happen long term before lebron quit on Miami

Not saying the ring wasn’t worth it, but Cavs were not going to be a lottery team with the pieces they had prior to lebron coming

Now they will be for 4 years or so to clean up the mess lebron left them with, just like Miami it will take time

But I’m sure you will enjoy the Cavs losing because it fits your narrative that they can’t do anything without lebron.

[rats60]

Originally Posted by pgisback

Sure it does. And going to the Finals is "winning something". You act like getting to the Finals is easy. With a lottery team it can only be done with one man and one man only. The GOAT. Not only did James get to the Finals with a much worse team but he had to play a team that was better than any team MJ had to play. All while putting up more points, rebounds, assists, steals, and blocks. What James has done the last 3 years is what makes him GOAT. Not even close anymore.

LeBron isn't even a top 5 player, let alone in the conversation for GOAT. The Cavs are going to stink this year because they aren't a team. They are a collection of role players brought to Cleveland to support LeBron. LeBron has to be the center of the team and when you take him away, you don't have a team, you have a hot mess. Other top players are only a part of the team and mesh with their teammates. When they leave you can plug someone else and you still have a good team, just not great because you lost a great player.

Making in the Finals is not winning anything. Move the Cavs from the East to the West and they lose in the 2nd round. If what you say is true, the Lakers will make the Finals this year or at worst Conference Finals. His supporting cast in LA is better than the Cavs last year. We will see this year how much of LeBron's success is LeBron and how much is a product of no competition in the East the last 8 years.

[rats60]

Originally Posted by Noah

When KD breaks every individual record Lebron has ever put up will he be the GOAT Player?

LeBron's only record is most consecutive games of 10 points or more. Not even sure why such a low number is kept track of. Maybe he can get the records for most consecutive games with 5 points or 1 point.

[pgisback]

Originally Posted by rats60

LeBron isn't even a top 5 player, let alone in the conversation for GOAT. The Cavs are going to stink this year because they aren't a team. They are a collection of role players brought to Cleveland to support LeBron. LeBron has to be the center of the team and when you take him away, you don't have a team, you have a hot mess. Other top players are only a part of the team and mesh with their teammates. When they leave you can plug someone else and you still have a good team, just not great because you lost a great player.

Making in the Finals is not winning anything. Move the Cavs from the East to the West and they lose in the 2nd round. If what you say is true, the Lakers will make the Finals this year or at worst Conference Finals. His supporting cast in LA is better than the Cavs last year. We will see this year how much of LeBron's success is LeBron and how much is a product of no competition in the East the last 8 years.

I stopped when you said Lebron isn’t even a top 5 player. That makes the rest of your comment meaningless and the ramblings of someone who does not understand basketball. Carry on...