2016 Politics Thread - Enter At Your Own Risk - All Politics & Dumb Opinions Here - Page 295

JohnRyno · 10-06-2016, 09:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ssbledsoe

Hey what's up guys...

Ray27Ray52 · 10-06-2016, 09:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ssbledsoe

Hey what's up guys...

JohnRyno · 10-06-2016, 09:39 AM

Kevin Spacey should have entered the race, in character, as Frank Underwood.

NeilCO · 10-06-2016, 09:49 AM

I think this last page has been my favorite of the thread so far.

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ssbledsoe · 10-06-2016, 10:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnRyno

irfuji · 10-06-2016, 10:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by quackhead

Wrong. "Separation of church and state" is an interpretation. Nowhere does it specifically say "separation of church and state" in the Constitution.

Ok, I'm wrong. I can admit it. The constitution doesn't say that.

The Supreme Court has consistently and constantly reaffirmed that there is to be a separation between Church and State.

They derive that conclusion via an interpretation of the Constitution.

So yes, I was wrong to say it says clearly in the Constitution when in reality the Constitution implies it and the Supreme Court has reaffirmed that there is to be separation between Church and State.

atoaz12 · 10-06-2016, 01:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trixstar

You are aware that Mike Pence wanted to divert all national HIV funding into "conversion therapy" for the LGBT community right? Are you aware of what goes on in conversion therapy?

I did not know that. Also didn't know that is/was a thing.
Some of the methods I read about are pretty ridiculous.

I'm not sure what Pence, his conversion therapy stance in 2000, or conversion therapy itself has to do with my post though.

atoaz12 · 10-06-2016, 01:13 PM

All the separation of church and state talk...

So what do we base our morals, societal decision making on?
Has to come from some where

As mentioned earlier, anything can be classified as a religion.
What are are we separating from?

Boo · 10-06-2016, 01:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by awz50

Both vice president candidates suck to

Pence was setting up his run in 2020

Clarka3 · 10-06-2016, 01:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by atoaz12

All the separation of church and state talk...

So what do we base our morals, societal decision making on?
Has to come from some where

As mentioned earlier, anything can be classified as a religion.
What are are we separating from?

i don't know about you, but my morals came from not wanting to be a scumbag. that's universal across all religions.

and we are separating from choosing one religion to follow, therefore alienating a large swath of citizens.

NeilCO · 10-06-2016, 02:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Clarka3

i don't know about you, but my morals came from not wanting to be a scumbag. that's universal across all religions.

Exactly. If the only reason a person doesn't steal/cheat/murder is because they fear God's wrath, they're probably not a great person. Also, some of the worst liars/thieves/cheats I know are those who purport to be the most Catholic. Maybe they just repent and it washes away all their sins?

Some of the best people I know are also Catholic or Lutheran, though. I don't mean this as a knock on Christianity. I just think the premise that morals come from religion is flawed.

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atoaz12 · 10-06-2016, 02:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Clarka3

i don't know about you, but my morals came from not wanting to be a scumbag. that's universal across all religions.

and we are separating from choosing one religion to follow, therefore alienating a large swath of citizens.

I think everyone would aspire to not being a scumbag. Also sure that those who are don't recognize their own scumbag-ness - thus the need for a set of standards to classify
I just happen to use the Bible and apply the morals within when situations not specifically addressed come up

Quote:

Originally Posted by NeilCO

Exactly. If the only reason a person doesn't steal/cheat/murder is because they fear God's wrath, they're probably not a great person. Also, some of the worst liars/thieves/cheats I know are those who purport to be the most Catholic. Maybe they just repent and it washes away all their sins?

Some of the best people I know are also Catholic or Lutheran, though. I don't mean this as a knock on Christianity. I just think the premise that morals come from religion is flawed.

For those looking in on the Christian faith and seeing hypocrisy, it's tough. There are SOOO many people who claim, but it's just a show or what they say when asked. I understand why Christians get a bad rep.

And God's wrath should not be the reason anything is done. You should do good things because the idea of Christianity is being Christ-like - it's where the word comes from. Show God's love, help people, be a witness, etc.

NeilCO · 10-06-2016, 02:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by atoaz12

I think everyone would aspire to not being a scumbag. Also sure that those who are don't recognize their own scumbag-ness - thus the need for a set of standards to classify
I just happen to use the Bible and apply the morals within when situations not specifically addressed come up

For those looking in on the Christian faith and seeing hypocrisy, it's tough. There are SOOO many people who claim, but it's just a show or what they say when asked. I understand why Christians get a bad rep.

And God's wrath should not be the reason anything is done. You should do good things because the idea of Christianity is being Christ-like - it's where the word comes from. Show God's love, help people, be a witness, etc.

No doubt, it is not fair to judge Christianity by hypocritical "Christians," in the same way it's not fair to judge all Muslims by the relatively few terrorists, it's not fair to judge the BLM movement by rioters, etc. it's never fair to judge an entire group by the few who purport to be members but don't reflect the larger group's values.

My only point was that I don't think the inherent "goodness" in people derives from religion to the extent that some religious folks believe it does. I do recognize that it may be helpful in some situations to have values written down that you should try to follow. On the other hand, someone who isn't inherently "good," "fair," etc., might believe they can act badly so long as they repent (I have a couple people in mind).

ETA: we are moving into "Controversial Topics" territory. So I will add: I don't think either of the current candidates is actually religious. Not sure to what extent either of them pretends to be.

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VeedonFleece · 10-06-2016, 02:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NeilCO

Also, some of the worst liars/thieves/cheats I know are those who purport to be the most Catholic. Maybe they just repent and it washes away all their sins

Woah, buddy. I'm Catholic and I resemble that remark!

NeilCO · 10-06-2016, 02:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VeedonFleece

Woah, buddy. I'm Catholic and I resemble that remark!

I honestly can't tell if you're making a joke, or you meant to say resent.

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VeedonFleece · 10-06-2016, 03:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NeilCO

I honestly can't tell if you're making a joke, or you meant to say resent.

I rarely let mistakes slip through. I usually edit my posts if there are typos etc. I didn't make a mistake here.

On a less frivolous note, it's not so long ago that Christians in this corner of the world were blowing each other up and shooting people somewhat indiscriminately, based purely on which Christian sect they belong to, or were perceived to belong to. I'm agnostic but consider myself Catholic when the situation suits, as it did in Ireland for the latter portion of the 20th century.

NeilCO · 10-06-2016, 03:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VeedonFleece

I rarely let mistakes slip through. I usually edit my posts if there are typos etc. I didn't make a mistake here.

On a less frivolous note, it's not so long ago that Christians in this corner of the world were blowing each other up and shooting people somewhat indiscriminately, based purely on which Christian sect they belong to, or were perceived to belong to. I'm agnostic but consider myself Catholic when the situation suits, as it did in Ireland for the latter portion of the 20th century.

Lol. Got it.

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CrownCollector · 10-06-2016, 03:33 PM

Charges dropped, another cover up for the Obama/Clinton regime - Obama DOJ drops charges against alleged broker of Libyan weapons - POLITICO

tke1600 · 10-06-2016, 03:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NeilCO

No doubt, it is not fair to judge Christianity by hypocritical "Christians," in the same way it's not fair to judge all Muslims by the relatively few terrorists, it's not fair to judge the BLM movement by rioters, etc. it's never fair to judge an entire group by the few who purport to be members but don't reflect the larger group's values.

My only point was that I don't think the inherent "goodness" in people derives from religion to the extent that some religious folks believe it does. I do recognize that it may be helpful in some situations to have values written down that you should try to follow. On the other hand, someone who isn't inherently "good," "fair," etc., might believe they can act badly so long as they repent (I have a couple people in mind).

ETA: we are moving into "Controversial Topics" territory. So I will add: I don't think either of the current candidates is actually religious. Not sure to what extent either of them pretends to be.

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Here is my thoughts on this and take it as you will.

Some religions follow the bible. There are a ton of "scumbags" who do bad things even though they are part of that religion. They are committing these "sins" or crimes on their own, not from what the bible says or teaches them.

Religions that follow the Quran are different. In that book, it says over 100 times to inflict pain and kill unbelievers, etc to those who do not follow what the Quran says.

This is a major difference to me, because one religion is literally telling its believers to inflict "terrorism" in the name of that religion, while the bible based religions don't teach believers to do that. Thus the difference in being worried about those who follow the Quran compared to those who follow the bible.

Clarka3 · 10-06-2016, 04:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tke1600

Here is my thoughts on this and take it as you will.

Some religions follow the bible. There are a ton of "scumbags" who do bad things even though they are part of that religion. They are committing these "sins" or crimes on their own, not from what the bible says or teaches them.

Religions that follow the Quran are different. In that book, it says over 100 times to inflict pain and kill unbelievers, etc to those who do not follow what the Quran says.

This is a major difference to me, because one religion is literally telling its believers to inflict "terrorism" in the name of that religion, while the bible based religions don't teach believers to do that. Thus the difference in being worried about those who follow the Quran compared to those who follow the bible.

i dunno man, isn't the Old Testament all about that violence?

tke1600 · 10-06-2016, 04:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Clarka3

i dunno man, isn't the Old Testament all about that violence?

There is nothing to my knowledge about humans inflicting violence on other humans in the name of God or bible verses.

zachtruitt · 10-06-2016, 05:33 PM

God instructed Israel to destroy the other tribes and faiths of the area and only rewarded David upon his military defeats. God loved the sweet deaths of those who believed in Baal.

corndog · 10-06-2016, 05:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zachtruitt

God instructed Israel to destroy the other tribes and faiths of the area and only rewarded David upon his military defeats. God loved the sweet deaths of those who believed in Baal.

tke1600 · 10-06-2016, 06:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zachtruitt

God instructed Israel to destroy the other tribes and faiths of the area and only rewarded David upon his military defeats. God loved the sweet deaths of those who believed in Baal.

To make my point more clear, there is nothing that tells a reader of the Bible to act out violence against others in its teachings. The Quran tells its readers to act out in violence against unbelievers and to do other unhumane things according to modern society.

timber09 · 10-06-2016, 06:11 PM

Deuteronomy -

17 Do not sacrifice to the Lord your God an ox or a sheep that has any defect or flaw in it, for that would be detestable to him.

2 If a man or woman living among you in one of the towns the Lord gives you is found doing evil in the eyes of the Lord your God in violation of his covenant, 3 and contrary to my command has worshiped other gods, bowing down to them or to the sun or the moon or the stars in the sky, 4 and this has been brought to your attention, then you must investigate it thoroughly. If it is true and it has been proved that this detestable thing has been done in Israel, 5 take the man or woman who has done this evil deed to your city gate and stone that person to death. 6 On the testimony of two or three witnesses a person is to be put to death, but no one is to be put to death on the testimony of only one witness. 7 The hands of the witnesses must be the first in putting that person to death, and then the hands of all the people. You must purge the evil from among you.

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10-06-2016, 09:49 AM	#7354
NeilCO Member Join Date: Jan 2013 Posts: 5,282 sundaysportscards NeilCO	I think this last page has been my favorite of the thread so far. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk __________________ Timberwolves fan. Main PC is Gorgui Dieng, who has been top 35 in RPM Wins for two straight seasons. Don't @ me. Or do. I'll be around.

10-06-2016, 01:13 PM	#7358
atoaz12 Member Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Evans, GA Posts: 7,605 inthegamememorabilia	All the separation of church and state talk... So what do we base our morals, societal decision making on? Has to come from some where As mentioned earlier, anything can be classified as a religion. What are are we separating from? __________________ “Our culture has accepted two huge lies. The first is that if you disagree with someone’s lifestyle, you must fear or hate them. The second is that to love someone means you agree with everything they believe or do. Both are nonsense. You don’t have to compromise convictions to be compassionate.” ― Rick Warren

10-06-2016, 05:33 PM	#7372
zachtruitt Member Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Delaware Posts: 1,410 zachtruitt	God instructed Israel to destroy the other tribes and faiths of the area and only rewarded David upon his military defeats. God loved the sweet deaths of those who believed in Baal. __________________ Interested in Orioles HOFers and current O's. Oakland Raiders HOFers along with Rich Gannon. I am always looking for any Eastern Shore League (1920's to 1947) baseball memorabilia, please PM if you know of any for sale

10-06-2016, 09:39 AM	#7353
JohnRyno Banned Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: Fairway in Regulation Posts: 12,248 johnryno2012 johnryno	Kevin Spacey should have entered the race, in character, as Frank Underwood.

10-06-2016, 03:33 PM	#7368
CrownCollector Banned Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: NoLongerInLiberalHell Posts: 867	Charges dropped, another cover up for the Obama/Clinton regime - Obama DOJ drops charges against alleged broker of Libyan weapons - POLITICO

10-06-2016, 06:11 PM	#7375
timber09 Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Kirkland WA Posts: 1,787 timber-9 timber09	Deuteronomy - 17 Do not sacrifice to the Lord your God an ox or a sheep that has any defect or flaw in it, for that would be detestable to him. 2 If a man or woman living among you in one of the towns the Lord gives you is found doing evil in the eyes of the Lord your God in violation of his covenant, 3 and contrary to my command has worshiped other gods, bowing down to them or to the sun or the moon or the stars in the sky, 4 and this has been brought to your attention, then you must investigate it thoroughly. If it is true and it has been proved that this detestable thing has been done in Israel, 5 take the man or woman who has done this evil deed to your city gate and stone that person to death. 6 On the testimony of two or three witnesses a person is to be put to death, but no one is to be put to death on the testimony of only one witness. 7 The hands of the witnesses must be the first in putting that person to death, and then the hands of all the people. You must purge the evil from among you.