Star Co. Basketball is Hottt!

[2dueces]

I submitted these raw before Beckett was in business. What’s the boards opinion on prices in these slabs?



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[Hellcat]

Originally Posted by GOATcards

i got caught up in the pump in '92, Bro. Market surge all documented in Beckett, etc.

I can't remember what your response was to the comparison to the Mantle RC vs. the more iconic and sought-after card from a year later. Have you seen a pump succeed for the 51B Mantle, BRO???

Not apples to apples comparison. Mantle you have the 1951 Bowman horizontal card vs vertical. As you should know the hobby isn’t very fond of horizontal cards. The 1952 Topps is only 1 year difference so easier for collectors to value the 52 more even though I’m the belief the 51 Bowman should be more valuable. The Jordan Star 101 vs 3rd year Fleer 57 easier to see where the value lies along with collectibility. So stop saying “pump” there’s no pump bro it’s Jordan’s only rookie who happens to be the greatest basketball player of all-time. It’s hard for you to see the value?! In the age of hundreds if not 1000s of rookies per player. I don’t what else to tell you.

[KhalDrogo]

Originally Posted by 2000man

That’s the part I’m focused on. The customer is not savvy to the insights to grading and submission in my opinion. He didn’t understand what most people on this board do. You don’t play games with submission levels.

However I would think for PSA ..Should have just sent it back. The damage creates the professional questions or concerns here.

I’m sure PSA damaged the card intentionally so that they could pay out $25k. Great business practice!

[98pmgs]

Originally Posted by mindcycle

He’s 100% doing it for the money. I mean the guy literally calls himself the sports card “investor”…

I for one am not worried about the more seasoned collectors. Most see through his lack of experience and general poor advice. The ones I am worried about are collectors who watch his videos and then buy into stuff like base, high pop cards, or flavor of the month card pumps. Sure, it raises values and makes money for a few people, but inevitably prices out actual collectors and then most of the time leads to a crash of those cards once the bag can no longer be passed as easily. Lots of guys who didn’t get in and out quickly are now holding huge losses.

Make no mistake, the advice he gave during the pandemic was in no shape or form good for the hobby. It did nothing but perpetuate pump and dump style “collecting”. It didn’t grow the hobby organically where people joined for the love of sports and collecting players or teams they enjoy watching. It showed potential entrants that it’s fine if you can’t pronounce a players name correctly as long as you can look at graphs and throw money at stuff based arbitrary reasoning from a talking head. Because look at all this money to be made!

Bro, why do you worry about them? They don’t worry about you.
I agree with Bush22. Make your own decisions. Don’t worry about others. Nobody asking you to be their super hero.

SCI is no worst or better then the conspiracy theorists out there who preach the downfall in cards the past decade.
How much money was lost for all those who sold early based on other peoples theories?

Best to just mind your own business, stay in your own lane and let other people spend their money how they like.

[mindcycle]

Originally Posted by 98pmgs

Bro, why do you worry about them? They don’t worry about you.
I agree with Bush22. Make your own decisions. Don’t worry about others. Nobody asking you to be their super hero.

SCI is no worst or better then the conspiracy theorists out there who preach the downfall in cards the past decade.
How much money was lost for all those who sold early based on other peoples theories?

Best to just mind your own business, stay in your own lane and let other people spend their money how they like.

The sentence right after the one you bolded answers that question.

Sure, it raises values and makes money for a few people, but inevitably prices out actual collectors and then most of the time leads to a crash of those cards once the bag can no longer be passed as easily.

I'd ask why you wouldn't want to look out for all collectors? Why just sit back and watch them lose a bunch of money and then just as quickly leave? If I have the chance to sway someone's collecting habits for the better, i'm taking it. We can use more collectors who will stick around for the betterment of the hobby instead of some pie in the sky early retirement plan.

[strider_boi]

Originally Posted by 2000man

Heard a cautionary tale recently people may like to know. Collector-investor had a Jordan 101 still sealed in the bag. This is same guy who sold the PSA 8 101 to the sports card investor in AC.

He opened the bulls bag just to submit the 101 to PSA. He really thought he had a shot at getting a 9. After submission , PSA goes QUIET for a couple weeks. This would get anybody’s concern up!

Finally they called him and said they graded it an 8, but then DAMAGED it while encapsulating and now it’s only a 5”

They said they’re only willing to give him $24,999 because He “only” paid $1,000 to get it graded (and that fee is for cards with a $24,999 max declared value)

He chose the $1,000 again because He though it was just insuring against the card getting lost in the mail. The thought of PSA damaging thr card never even crossed his mind.

So after telling me this, the skeptic now comes out a bit in me. How can you trust PSA? They undoubtedly were aware he sold the first 101 PSA 8 for $100 K and didn’t want him to do it again at the $1,000 submission level!

Then the supposed damage during The encapsulate process. Is that true ? or a bitter grading company …perhaps they did a card swap altogether? Maybe I’m just paranoid but I’d be create hell over that. Regardless it happened.

That guy stopped by my table n bought maybe 20-30k in bgs star cards. He was inspecting them like crazy to cross over..

[Gary]

Originally Posted by KhalDrogo

I’m sure PSA damaged the card intentionally so that they could pay out $25k. Great business practice!

Ok that's twice in a week Ive agreed with you,I might need a break from blowout.


The info is right on PSA's website,he either cheeped out or didn't read the site,either way it costs him and its his own fault.

[duron]

Originally Posted by 98pmgs

Bro, why do you worry about them? They don’t worry about you.
I agree with Bush22. Make your own decisions. Don’t worry about others. Nobody asking you to be their super hero.

SCI is no worst or better then the conspiracy theorists out there who preach the downfall in cards the past decade.
How much money was lost for all those who sold early based on other peoples theories?

Best to just mind your own business, stay in your own lane and let other people spend their money how they like.

[AbraCalabro]

Originally Posted by 98pmgs

Bro, why do you worry about them? They don’t worry about you.
I agree with Bush22. Make your own decisions. Don’t worry about others. Nobody asking you to be their super hero.

SCI is no worst or better then the conspiracy theorists out there who preach the downfall in cards the past decade.
How much money was lost for all those who sold early based on other peoples theories?

Best to just mind your own business, stay in your own lane and let other people spend their money how they like.

[2010GBPackers]

Originally Posted by 2000man

Heard a cautionary tale recently people may like to know. Collector-investor had a Jordan 101 still sealed in the bag. This is same guy who sold the PSA 8 101 to the sports card investor in AC.

He opened the bulls bag just to submit the 101 to PSA. He really thought he had a shot at getting a 9. After submission , PSA goes QUIET for a couple weeks. This would get anybody’s concern up!

Finally they called him and said they graded it an 8, but then DAMAGED it while encapsulating and now it’s only a 5”

They said they’re only willing to give him $24,999 because He “only” paid $1,000 to get it graded (and that fee is for cards with a $24,999 max declared value)

He chose the $1,000 again because He though it was just insuring against the card getting lost in the mail. The thought of PSA damaging thr card never even crossed his mind.

So after telling me this, the skeptic now comes out a bit in me. How can you trust PSA? They undoubtedly were aware he sold the first 101 PSA 8 for $100 K and didn’t want him to do it again at the $1,000 submission level!

Then the supposed damage during The encapsulate process. Is that true ? or a bitter grading company …perhaps they did a card swap altogether? Maybe I’m just paranoid but I’d be create hell over that. Regardless it happened.

If it indeed was an 8, PSA would have upcharged him in order to receive the card back, so the bolded part is moot. PSA f'ed up and damaged a card - it actually happens more than you think - and the submitter (high_speed_card_chase) definitely knows better than to sub a possible PSA 9 card at a $1k level. It sucks, no doubt, but those well-versed with PSA (and he is) know there is always that possibility.

And, no. No chance in hell PSA damaged it on purpose.

[Dontom]

Originally Posted by GOATcards

so that's 3 elephants in the room then, the fact that it's MJ's rookie card, the fact that it has disappointing eye appeal (close-up image of MJ's smudged-up mouth area; the cropping), and the fact that its cut size varies so on the face it's trimmer-bait. Yay 101

Almost all of the 101's are cut short from the factory. Less then 10% are full size. They are short from top to bottom but are the same from left to right. Left to right is were this card struggles and has issues with centering so trimming a full size 101 isn't going to do you much good unless there's a huge dinged top corner or something to that effect. Personally the last thing I would do to a full size 101 is trim it because you would be turning a rare full size card into a more common short 101.

As you can see from the thousands of pages of trimmed cards on these boards ANY card is trimmer bait so that doesn't make the 101 special. In fact I would say the 101 is less susceptible to trimming then other cards because most are already short to being with and going any shorter would most likely get caught. Also the 101 is distinctly diamond cut from left to right so trimming it left to right would be more evident compared to other cards. It also has a slight red bleed on the back that would be cut off if one of the edges were trimmed. With that said are there trimmed 101's that have been mistakenly graded? I would bet on it. I would also bet on it that there are far larger percentage of trimmed and slabbed 86 fleer Jordans relative to their populations.

As far as eye appeal, would I have liked them to use a nice action shot of him dunking like the Court Kings card instead? Of coarse but to me it's his rookie card and that's all that matters. It's his only NBA licensed card, not from a subset or promo, that came out during his rookie year and if the image they used was him taking a dump at center court then I would still think it's a very important card to the hobby and a must have for any serious Basketball collector.

[Hellcat]

I’m one of the guys with the “big” 101 as in top to bottom. Mine towers over most 101s. If I did have a soft corner I can see how someone would be tempted to trim since it would still be within the guidelines.

[oldschoolball]

Originally Posted by Dontom

.... it's his rookie card and that's all that matters. It's his only NBA licensed card, not from a subset or promo, that came out during his rookie year and if the image they used was him taking a dump at center court then I would still think it's a very important card to the hobby and a must have for any serious Basketball collector.

Mic Drop ......

[GOATcards]

Originally Posted by Hellcat

Not apples to apples comparison. Mantle you have the 1951 Bowman horizontal card vs vertical. As you should know the hobby isn’t very fond of horizontal cards. The 1952 Topps is only 1 year difference so easier for collectors to value the 52 more even though I’m the belief the 51 Bowman should be more valuable. The Jordan Star 101 vs 3rd year Fleer 57 easier to see where the value lies along with collectibility. So stop saying “pump” there’s no pump bro it’s Jordan’s only rookie who happens to be the greatest basketball player of all-time. It’s hard for you to see the value?! In the age of hundreds if not 1000s of rookies per player. I don’t what else to tell you.

So like with the horizontal '51 Bowman you are willing to concede that there are eye-appeal-related collectibility issues with the 101? Guess I need to re-post that close-up on his face?

[GOATcards]

Originally Posted by Hellcat

I’m one of the guys with the “big” 101 as in top to bottom. Mine towers over most 101s. If I did have a soft corner I can see how someone would be tempted to trim since it would still be within the guidelines.

I could see how the tallboy/jumbo 101s might command a premium. Assures they aren't trimmed. (The one I owned was full-length as well, huge top border.)

[Spfld Ponies]

Originally Posted by GOATcards

I could see how the tallboy/jumbo 101s might command a premium. Assures they aren't trimmed. (The one I owned was full-length as well, huge top border.)

I've always liked the larger cards top to bottom, realizing that they are less common for the 84-85 set. True enough, those obviously aren't trimmed top/bottom. Agree with the earlier poster, the left/right width is pretty standard, unless trimmed.

I've found a lot of folks are interested in the three base sets. While the all-star and other subsets still garner interest, even high grade commons in the base sets sell pretty well. I can't keep enough 76ers / Lakers / Celtics / and Mavs in stock from the 83-84 inaugural set. Those short-printed teams are truly hard to find. Must be at least a few set collectors out there among Star fans. When PSA begins grading the 3 base sets, I bet we'll see several in the registry.

[Hellcat]

Originally Posted by GOATcards

So like with the horizontal '51 Bowman you are willing to concede that there are eye-appeal-related collectibility issues with the 101? Guess I need to re-post that close-up on his face?

The 57 is a far superior card as in design. The problem is it’s a 3rd year card. We have to go with what Star gave us and and thank God they did!

[2010GBPackers]

Originally Posted by GOATcards

So like with the horizontal '51 Bowman you are willing to concede that there are eye-appeal-related collectibility issues with the 101? Guess I need to re-post that close-up on his face?

Stop trying to make "fetch" happen. Cool, you don't like the photo. No one else cares.

[Uncbuddha]

First PSA 9 101 is in. Going to be interesting.

[MJGOAT23]

Originally Posted by Uncbuddha

First PSA 9 is in. Going to be interesting.

wonder what it looks like. Could be a high subgraded BGS with 7-8 centering sub because PSA cares little about tilting. You see it in how they grade the 86 Fleer Stickers.

[pcptrade]

Originally Posted by Uncbuddha

First PSA 9 101 is in. Going to be interesting.

#Boring.

Vintage baseball is the hot topic now on social media getting all the pump and attention

[rueben21]

Was debating crossing these over. Any thoughts or think I should stay put in the BGS slabs?

[pcptrade]

Originally Posted by rueben21

Was debating crossing these over. Any thoughts or think I should stay put in the BGS slabs?

It is tricky. The BGS 8.5 is worth around 35K right now. If it crosses over to a PSA 8, it will be worth around 85K, If it crosses over to a PSA 7, it will be worth around 30K. Grading fee is 3K. You have to take all that into account.

[bkcardcollector]

how do they get 3k to grade a card. yeesh. ridiculous.

[MJGOAT23]

Originally Posted by pcptrade

It is tricky. The BGS 8.5 is worth around 35K right now. If it crosses over to a PSA 8, it will be worth around 85K, If it crosses over to a PSA 7, it will be worth around 30K. Grading fee is 3K. You have to take all that into account.

I dont understand the PSA premium on this card. Does everyone actually think the new 8's that are coming out were BGS 9 or higher? They're the same BGS 8 and 8.5's. I get the PSA premium on the vast majority of cards the Registry etc, but for this card it's so fabricated given the graded pop that these are being pooled from.