First Buzz: 2024 Topps Heritage High Number baseball cards (will update)

[jduds]

Originally Posted by ObanMontecristo

I’m with you. I wish the format was the same as base Heritage & Mini- The ‘75 design is my all-time favorite, and i was building the master base set, the Refractors /575 (which look like they’re gone?), and a master, master Mini set (I’ve got all the SPs, Inserts, Variations and Autos from regular Heritage Mini).

If this is becoming a breakers’ product with more chromes/inserts, etc., maybe that’ll result in more singles being ripped/sold, which could help completing the mini set- although sealed wax prices could rise

A few extra chromes won't make this attractive to breakers. Heritage is one most breakers shy away from and I don't see anything new to change that here unless Topps secretly funnels a ton of it to them cheaply (posssible) to get it going. The Mini chase could be interesting as there are a LOT of folks building that set this year. I think the Mini crowd would hoover this up if they had 10 minis a box. I'm not sure how much they'll buy if it is just two.

[rfgilles]

Has Heritage High ever included action base variations for players in Heritage (regular)?This is the first year that Francisco Lindor doesn't have an Action Variation.

Given that they are including Chromes for all players, maybe additional variations are possible?

[bub838]

Originally Posted by jduds

A few extra chromes won't make this attractive to breakers. Heritage is one most breakers shy away from and I don't see anything new to change that here unless Topps secretly funnels a ton of it to them cheaply (posssible) to get it going. The Mini chase could be interesting as there are a LOT of folks building that set this year. I think the Mini crowd would hoover this up if they had 10 minis a box. I'm not sure how much they'll buy if it is just two.

Nearly every breaker on Fanatics Live will be breaking this at release. Breakers break Heritage, I don't know why this idea that they don't break it persists. They may not like breaking it but they have allocations they have to get through.

[bub838]

I want to know if /699 /75 /5 /1 are the only chrome, or if they will also be including /999 /575 /375 from the first release.

If it's the former, there won't be much of this made at 5 chrome per box (I doubt this is the case.)

[whitmm]

Originally Posted by bub838

Nearly every breaker on Fanatics Live will be breaking this at release. Breakers break Heritage, I don't know why this idea that they don't break it persists. They may not like breaking it but they have allocations they have to get through.

And plenty of people will buy into breaks because of the RC autos that will be in it.

[mfw13]

Originally Posted by premium1981

The hobby is hotter than it has ever been and more people are coming in than ever.

Do have any evidence to support this assertion?

And what percentage of these "people coming in" are actually collectors, as opposed to flippers trying to make a quick buck?

At some point, all the breakers/gamblers/flippers are either going to run into financial trouble and/or going to move on.....who's going to support Fanatics then if all the collectors have left?

[StlBen]

Originally Posted by mfw13

And what percentage of these "people coming in" are actually collectors, as opposed to flippers trying to make a quick buck?

There is only a market for flippers if there is collectors. Like the flippers are selling to someone.....

[ObanMontecristo]

Originally Posted by jduds

A few extra chromes won't make this attractive to breakers. Heritage is one most breakers shy away from and I don't see anything new to change that here unless Topps secretly funnels a ton of it to them cheaply (posssible) to get it going. The Mini chase could be interesting as there are a LOT of folks building that set this year. I think the Mini crowd would hoover this up if they had 10 minis a box. I'm not sure how much they'll buy if it is just two.

It’s more than a few extra chromes- before, you’d be lucky to get 1 chrome per 2 boxes. What they’re doing with extra parallels/inserts here just screams to me that they’re trying to make it a breaker product




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[FatButcher]

Originally Posted by StlBen

There is only a market for flippers if there is collectors. Like the flippers are selling to someone.....

It certainly feels like in football/basketball the flippers are just selling to each other hoping to inflate prices without being the one holding the bag.

The true collector base with baseball is much larger, but it does feel like its tilting towards "bag holding" avoidance as the goal instead of collecting more and more.

It was well said earlier that me or you or any one person on this board won't move the needle, but I'm definitely moving towards other areas of the hobby. My habits were opening a good amount of the products breakers don't love (Heritage, Pro Debut, some flagship) that are base heavy. This will likely be the last product I do that, only hanging around for the 1975 design and to complete sets I started with the initial release.

[Skipscards]

Originally Posted by mfw13

Do have any evidence to support this assertion?

And what percentage of these "people coming in" are actually collectors, as opposed to flippers trying to make a quick buck?

At some point, all the breakers/gamblers/flippers are either going to run into financial trouble and/or going to move on.....who's going to support Fanatics then if all the collectors have left?

I would suspect there are more people buying product but, yeah, there may be fewer "collectors". The process works like this:

Breaker opens product
Customer hits something big
Breaker buys big hit from customer at a discount
Customer is happy to have instant cash to make up for the losses on other breaks
Breaker inserts big card in one of their repack products
Someone else hits same big card
Breaker buys big hit from customer at a discount
Repeat

[base set]

I will enjoy ripping a Hobby, and some “Value” whatevers. “Mega” or just “Blaster” ?

I won’t be building the Minis from this so would prefer to pass those along to anyone else on here trying that.

I would like to buy one Superfractor from this, and one Gold. Player not important, scrubbier the better.

[jduds]

Originally Posted by ObanMontecristo

It’s more than a few extra chromes- before, you’d be lucky to get 1 chrome per 2 boxes. What they’re doing with extra parallels/inserts here just screams to me that they’re trying to make it a breaker product




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I think it’s more just trying to add some value to a very watered down product in general. Breakers won’t start breaking Heritage for an extra three Chrome a box. If Topps was gearing Heritage towards breakers, you’d see more autos, case hit inserts, sketch cards, and rare game-used hits (those four attract breakers) added with the amount of base declining. There are changes but none I would say are explicitly geared towards breakers who will most likely continue to largely ignore it.


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[jbriskin05]

These changes could make Heritage a better product going forward...it makes no sense to me to change the format midyear...they should have held these over until 2025 Heritage instead

[mfw13]

Originally Posted by StlBen

There is only a market for flippers if there is collectors. Like the flippers are selling to someone.....

Yes....but often it's to other flippers....it's a game of hot potato where everyone is trying to find the "greater fool", and nobody wants to be left holding the proverbial bag.

[Kilomonster]

Why didn’t they simply flip the top and bottom colors on the Brett?

The vertical is ridiculous.

[auctionjmm]

I think a higher price would make sense if they are doing the full mini product within HHN. Those boxes 4x'd pretty easily. Now, there would of course be far less cards but that is partially offset by the smaller set. If Topps did 1 mini per pack, that would be 288 minis per case. IF there are mini SPs, #'d minis, and mini autos like in the first release, you could easily justify a higher price point. If it's just the 225, some hike may be justifiable. There's a lot of what-ifs until full details come out.

[premium1981]

Originally Posted by mfw13

Yes....but often it's to other flippers....it's a game of hot potato where everyone is trying to find the "greater fool", and nobody wants to be left holding the proverbial bag.

I’m traveling so it’s hard for me to type a long response on my phone, but how is this different than any other field? When someone sells apple stock someone else has to buy it. The person buying hopes to make money. All investments type transactions are usually similar to this. Bottom line is demand is demand. People were buying Brian Taylor years ago in hopes of making money. I agree that there are a lot of fools going to end up with bags. But that doesn’t mean they won’t purchase new bags in hopes of doing better.

And the other thing that some people here don’t seem to understand is that the collector market is massive. Yes, there are more flippers than you can count. But I see and hear about people collecting now than ever before. Our hobby is stronger and bigger than you realize.

[PDCCollectibles]

Originally Posted by mfw13

Do have any evidence to support this assertion?

And what percentage of these "people coming in" are actually collectors, as opposed to flippers trying to make a quick buck?

At some point, all the breakers/gamblers/flippers are either going to run into financial trouble and/or going to move on.....who's going to support Fanatics then if all the collectors have left?

I feel you've been trying to make this same point for 5, 6, 7+ years...yet here we are....breakers/gamblers/flippers can also be collectors, imo. According to you and others, this hobby was 'supposed' to crash multiple times over the last several years. In talking to my LCS' and the crowds at shows, not happening any time soon. I'm seeing more and more of the younger generation interested in cards

[rudan007]

Originally Posted by jbriskin05

These changes could make Heritage a better product going forward...it makes no sense to me to change the format midyear...they should have held these over until 2025 Heritage instead

Agreed. The new parallels and the inconsistency with the Minis will make for a lot of weird master set combinations. Why not just wait till 2025 to enact changes?

[13CardinalsFan]

Originally Posted by rfgilles

Has Heritage High ever included action base variations for players in Heritage (regular)?This is the first year that Francisco Lindor doesn't have an Action Variation.

Given that they are including Chromes for all players, maybe additional variations are possible?

Yes they have. 2022 High Number had several Action Variation for players in regular heritage.

[rfgilles]

Originally Posted by 13CardinalsFan

Yes they have. 2022 High Number had several Action Variation for players in regular heritage.

Nice. Good to know.

[coupie21]

Originally Posted by Skipscards

$1,300 for a case of high number? Yikes.

Blowout showing cases of hobby out of stock. Some must not think the price is too ridiculous. Checked last night and case price was over $1400...now showing out of stock. I am actually quite dumbfounded that people are buying this at such a high buy in price.

[KhalDrogo]

Originally Posted by PDCCollectibles

I feel you've been trying to make this same point for 5, 6, 7+ years...yet here we are....breakers/gamblers/flippers can also be collectors, imo. According to you and others, this hobby was 'supposed' to crash multiple times over the last several years. In talking to my LCS' and the crowds at shows, not happening any time soon. I'm seeing more and more of the younger generation interested in cards

The gambling addiction is real and it is glorious. Of course, it will destroy individual lives and families, but that’s okay. Everything in this world is now about growing the divide between the haves and have nots. This is why all assets continue to appreciate at unprecedented rates. The haves can and will continue to fuel it all. The have nots are irrelevant.

[FatButcher]

Originally Posted by coupie21

Blowout showing cases of hobby out of stock. Some must not think the price is too ridiculous. Checked last night and case price was over $1400...now showing out of stock. I am actually quite dumbfounded that people are buying this at such a high buy in price.

The crazy part is this is definitely the kind of product that will be available on the Topps site beyond the first few minutes of release at likely much lower prices.

Don't get the rush to buy from big 3 on this one.

[auctionjmm]

Originally Posted by FatButcher

The crazy part is this is definitely the kind of product that will be available on the Topps site beyond the first few minutes of release at likely much lower prices.

Don't get the rush to buy from big 3 on this one.

All depends on the minis. If there's a few per box and no parallels or autos, then I agree. No reason to pay a higher price now.

But if the minis are 1 per pack and have parallels and autos, then you have a product within a product scenario where these prices will go insane. Look what regular mini sells for now. It's a two-for-one deal in that case. Prices would soar.

Until more info is released, I couldn't even tell you what a fair price is for this.