PANINI FOTL BKB 10am CST

[RogerGodahell]

Originally Posted by COMCMax

Wonder how much extra cash they are sitting on lol...we sold 1200 boxes and made $2 million dollars. Somethings off...

Their accountant

They meant a pack was $120 each not a box....now they should be able to cover all the orders. Innocent mistake....their bad

[gorillaz]

Mine was ordered about 12ish, and I live about 30 minutes away from their facility.

[mindcycle]

Originally Posted by Giannis

The whole "ordeal" was caused by extremely massive demand.

Seems like Panini is doing something right or you guys wouldn't be wasting 3 hours to buy their products right?

Still not sure you're understanding..

The whole "ordeal" was caused by extremely massive demand.

Yes, that could have more than likely been prevented by proper planning/web traffic management, which was whole point of the original post you replied to of mine. If this was going to sell out in 5 minutes, it should have sold out in 5 minutes, not 3-4 hours of the server/site going up and down, botched orders, etc.. for it to finally reach "Sold Out" status.

No one should have to spend 3+ hours trying to order something online. Panini reps shouldn't have to spend days or weeks sorting out orders from a product that only had ~1600 units. That's the "ordeal" here.

[dengbang]

Originally Posted by Giannis

Sure it does. Does Prizm have RPAs? Does it have beautiful on card autos?

"Better" is a relative term, but true multi-color memorabilia and clear beautiful on card autos are not. Those are actual tangible things.

Prizm is just shiny metallic cards that are loud. They're nice, but I think it would be hard to say a "red shimmer" is tangibly better than a NT RPA.

Actual tangible things that can become worthless once there is some discovery of where the memorabilia came from or if someone else signed for the player.

No one is saying a shiny Prizm is better than an NT RPA, but the hobby revolves around value. And you can't compare opening up a $5 pack of cards to a $500 pack.

You obviously prefer those higher brands and that is fine, but my point is that each has it's own upside and downside. You can easily profit from either, but also get burned in the long run.

[mindcycle]

Originally Posted by auctionjmm

And finally, I know people at Panini. I was told about the on sale time long before the general public was and I was told "we don't expect Prizm basketball to sell out in less than 24 hours so no need to upgrade our servers". They were warned. That's all I'll say...

I can believe it. It's one thing to anticipate something like this and take steps to mitigate it but just simply not do enough. But to do nothing at all is all on them. I'm sure it will end up costing them quite a bit at the end of the day having to deal with all the cancelled/botched orders. The amount of potential charge backs alone could end up ruining their merchant account, and that's just the tip of the iceberg.

[Giannis]

Originally Posted by mindcycle

Still not sure you're understanding..

The whole "ordeal" was caused by extremely massive demand.

Yes, that could have more than likely been prevented by proper planning/web traffic management, which was whole point of the original post you replied to of mine. If this was going to sell out in 5 minutes, it should have sold out in 5 minutes, not 3-4 hours of the server/site going up and down, botched orders, etc.. for it to finally reach "Sold Out" status.

No one should have to spend 3+ hours trying to order something online. Panini reps shouldn't have to spend days or weeks sorting out orders from a product that only had ~1600 units. That's the "ordeal" here.

Has this ever happened before with Panini? Then you might have a point.

I honestly don't know since this is the first FOTL product launch I've been involved with.

It reminds me of what happens to Footlocker/Eastbay/etc or other shoe stores when brand new Jordan's come out. Website is completely down, and hard to use. So it seems like lots of companies experience this same problem.

[Giannis]

Originally Posted by dengbang

Actual tangible things that can become worthless once there is some discovery of where the memorabilia came from or if someone else signed for the player.

No one is saying a shiny Prizm is better than an NT RPA, but the hobby revolves around value. And you can't compare opening up a $5 pack of cards to a $500 pack.

You obviously prefer those higher brands and that is fine, but my point is that each has it's own upside and downside. You can easily profit from either, but also get burned in the long run.

Well, without outright FRAUD, I'm simply talking about tangible measurable things. Actual game used jerseys and clean on card autos do have immense tangible value. Knowing that Giannis or Steph Curry actually held your card and wrote their name on it has tangible value IMO.

I also agree Prizm is a value thing for collectors. But do you still believe the value is still there when FOTL boxes are on eBay for $500? Seems to me the value starts to decrease as the product hype has increased.

[messier2]

Anyone receive any cancellation emails in the last hour or so?

[dengbang]

Originally Posted by mindcycle

If this was going to sell out in 5 minutes, it should have sold out in 5 minutes, not 3-4 hours of the server/site going up and down, botched orders, etc.. for it to finally reach "Sold Out" status.

No one should have to spend 3+ hours trying to order something online. Panini reps shouldn't have to spend days or weeks sorting out orders from a product that only had ~1600 units. That's the "ordeal" here.

There's a lot of things that can cause issues for the server. With a company like Panini, who probably never sees traffic like that, there was no way they would put out more money to prevent crashing for just one release. People who buy popular shoes know this problem as it happens just about every other week.

As for people not having to spend 3+ hours to order something online, simply put the choice is yours. Some left after the first try, some kept trying and were able to purchase multiple, others tried all day and didn't get a single one. You just have to figure out what you want to do and ways to get it. Some people had better luck on the app, I was one of them. Had I just kept on using the site, I would not have gotten a single one. So I do understand the frustration, but this issue happens all the time.

[Giannis]

Originally Posted by dengbang

There's a lot of things that can cause issues for the server. With a company like Panini, who probably never sees traffic like that, there was no way they would put out more money to prevent crashing for just one release. People who buy popular shoes know this problem as it happens just about every other week.

As for people not having to spend 3+ hours to order something online, simply put the choice is yours. Some left after the first try, some kept trying and were able to purchase multiple, others tried all day and didn't get a single one. You just have to figure out what you want to do and ways to get it. Some people had better luck on the app, I was one of them. Had I just kept on using the site, I would not have gotten a single one. So I do understand the frustration, but this issue happens all the time.

Exactly.

[mfisher27]

With blowout buying these for $250 and the first one to sell via best offer for $300, where do people realistically think these end up? Do you think the high buy in price from blowout shows they weren't able to buy much, if any, yesterday?

[mindcycle]

Originally Posted by Giannis

Has this ever happened before with Panini? Then you might have a point.

I honestly don't know since this is the first FOTL product launch I've been involved with.

It reminds me of what happens to Footlocker/Eastbay/etc or other shoe stores when brand new Jordan's come out. Website is completely down, and hard to use. So it seems like lots of companies experience this same problem.

Yes, it has happened before but probably not to this magnitude i'd imagine. Just search this forum for crashes/outages on the rewards store when big cards come online.

That kind of stuff has happened for products that aren't even advertised so i'm just wondering what they expected/did for this release. Probably not very much would be my guess.

[Super32]

So here is the next issue. Black Friday which is a big Panini promotion. If Panini has Hobby Prizm boxes for sale then we could be looking another server bust. Probably not as bad as yesterday but the site will get hammered out of the gate.

[GeechQuest]

Originally Posted by mfisher27

With blowout buying these for $250 and the first one to sell via best offer for $300, where do people realistically think these end up? Do you think the high buy in price from blowout shows they weren't able to buy much, if any, yesterday?

I'd expect $350-$425 in a year.

I also expect these to dip below $300 in the first month as people list them all over eBay.

BO's buy price is extremely reasonable. If the masses knew about it (I'd say 1% of the hobby is on the forum), that actually might keep the prices higher for a while.

[dengbang]

Originally Posted by Giannis

Well, without outright FRAUD, I'm simply talking about tangible measurable things. Actual game used jerseys and clean on card autos do have immense tangible value. Knowing that Giannis or Steph Curry actually held your card and wrote their name on it has tangible value IMO.

I also agree Prizm is a value thing for collectors. But do you still believe the value is still there when FOTL boxes are on eBay for $500? Seems to me the value starts to decrease as the product hype has increased.

I couldn't tell you, honestly, but that has to do with more hype than product. Take a look at the 2003-04 UD Exquisite product. How much is a sealed box worth? $7000? What are your chances of getting anywhere near that in return? So let's say that the FOTL do reach $500, would I be shocked, probably not. Do I think there is still value there? Sure. Those /8 cards will have great value if you hit the right player. Remember those /8 Gala RC's? And if it is true that there are only 1600 boxes, then I could only see the value increasing as time goes on. That is only my opinion though, so take it with a grain of salt.

As far as tangible value, I think that was more of a thing in the past, before these forums and online marketplace existed. I can only imagine how many things these nba players have "touched". Autos and jerseys are a dime a dozen nowadays, so that's not the value you are describing. The value is that it is a rookie card with a patch and auto, considered to be the best card of a specific player in our hobby, barring any 1/1's etc

[byronscott4ever]

Originally Posted by Super32

So here is the next issue. Black Friday which is a big Panini promotion. If Panini has Hobby Prizm boxes for sale then we could be looking another server bust. Probably not as bad as yesterday but the site will get hammered out of the gate.

I think Panini will use the promo to sell stuff sitting around not Prizm

[mrchipz]

Originally Posted by mfisher27

With blowout buying these for $250 and the first one to sell via best offer for $300, where do people realistically think these end up? Do you think the high buy in price from blowout shows they weren't able to buy much, if any, yesterday?

I expect them to sell when in hand on release for $350-$400.
as people start realizing that the prizm will dry up and be busted in the first few weeks i see regular prizm , fotl prizm and retail to keep going higher.
i can see this going to $500 in just a matter of a few months or more.
95% of basketball collectors really only look forward to 2 releases.

prizm and nt. so do i hate that prizm is expensive this year yup. but at the same time we did this to ourselves.
i think it is very limited this year for some reason and when on release will spike across the board.
im actually contemplating just holding on to my boxes for a few months.

[AlabamaSlamma]

Panini gave away money with FOTL Prizm. $125 a box is the risk of a treasury note with the return of Bitcoin.

I highly doubt they make the same mistake again.

[COMCMax]

White Sparkle Prizm packs will be the next server storm of the century for them.

Panini tech guys..

[mindcycle]

Originally Posted by dengbang

There's a lot of things that can cause issues for the server. With a company like Panini, who probably never sees traffic like that, there was no way they would put out more money to prevent crashing for just one release. People who buy popular shoes know this problem as it happens just about every other week.

As for people not having to spend 3+ hours to order something online, simply put the choice is yours. Some left after the first try, some kept trying and were able to purchase multiple, others tried all day and didn't get a single one. You just have to figure out what you want to do and ways to get it. Some people had better luck on the app, I was one of them. Had I just kept on using the site, I would not have gotten a single one. So I do understand the frustration, but this issue happens all the time.

If this was the first ever instance of this happening I would agree with you, but it's not. See my above post.

Ultimately, yes it is a choice to spend 3+ hours trying to order something online. Or standing for hours to get into a store on black friday, etc.. So yes I get that. I stopped after my one "order" was placed after a little over an hour of trying. Which was just a card authorization it turns out. But my point is if you are going to be selling products online you need to plan for these types of situations. If they don't care because they're only game in town I guess it doesn't really matter and nothing will change. But for me Panini doesn't get a pass for this one. In all likelyhood it could have been mitigated at least to some degree. Especially knowing that your servers already have issues handling smaller traffic increases as evidenced by all of the rewards store outages that seem to happen quite regularly.

[mrchipz]

Originally Posted by AlabamaSlamma

Panini gave away money with FOTL Prizm. $125 a box is the risk of a treasury note with the return of Bitcoin.

I highly doubt they make the same mistake again.

completely agree. if it was just regular hobby i would have paid that.
but this is the first year of the limited #/8 red shimmers and you get 2 per box!
i would have paid $300 a box for it i know almost everyone would have. i mean thats basically the cost of regular hobby anyway, but you get 2 very rare cards that are more limited then the golds and they look awesome.
they could have sold this for $300 and the outcome would have been the same.
for once i thank panini for doing something right by the collectors. they didnt get too greedy and threw us a bone.

[dengbang]

Originally Posted by COMCMax

White Sparkle Prizm packs will be the next server storm of the century for them.

Panini tech guys..

Lawl I feel sorry for them

[smalltown]

Originally Posted by AlabamaSlamma

Panini gave away money with FOTL Prizm. $125 a box is the risk of a treasury note with the return of Bitcoin.

I highly doubt they make the same mistake again.

It's actually smart for them to do this. Pumps up the 1st off the Line program as a whole and creates a ton of happy customers.

[COMCMax]

Originally Posted by dengbang

Lawl I feel sorry for them

I would hope/believe they would take a different approach than this last one. Operation Cluster Duck.

[kyle121592]

I would imagine it’ll take several days to straighten out the payment mess. Is anybody actually confident they will receive their “confirmed” orders?