25-26 NBA Regular Season thread.

[ninjacookies]

Originally Posted by Chryghst

ATL’s got a 2-3-2 playoff schedule. Best case OO gets moved and worst case if AD ends up a Hawk.

Do we like this move? OO doesn't miss any time. AD's a part-timer at best, no-timer at worst.

[blackvodka]

It feels like the Grizzlies have the momentum going into the 4th. They tied it up.

Sent from my motorola razr 2024 using Tapatalk

[ninjacookies]

Laravia is a man amongst sedentary fossils.

[rhigh2390]

Originally Posted by blackvodka

It feels like the Grizzlies have the momentum going into the 4th. They tied it up.

Sent from my motorola razr 2024 using Tapatalk

You have to blow out the Lakers to beat them. If it's close, they've got ya. All 11 of their losses have been by double digits. That's why their net rating is deceiving.

[tjforce]

Originally Posted by rhigh2390

They won't have the offense either. Teams will just double Murray and Denver doesn't have other consistent offensive players. I imagine they'll be #6 or 7 when Joker comes back.

They'll keep beating their share of bad teams.... Heck, they already beat the Raptors on the road and took Cleveland to the brink.

Nets, Hawnks, Bucks, Pels, Mavericks, Wizards, Hornets, Lakers, Wizards, Bucks, Grizzlies are all teams that they play between now and Jan 25.

If Murray can go hero mode for a month and the rest of the team keeps playing defense like they did yesterday, they'll keep afloat.

[Chryghst]

Originally Posted by ninjacookies

Do we like this move? OO doesn't miss any time. AD's a part-timer at best, no-timer at worst.

For Atlanta? No I hate it. But Ressler clearly gets blinded by big names like AD, Dejounte Murray, Trae Young etc. Kind of strange since his best hits have been developing relatively unknown guys like Dyson and JJ…

For your fantasy team? Would be a big upgrade, since Atlanta barely plays in the 3 weeks of our fantasy playoffs.

[ninjacookies]

Originally Posted by Chryghst

For Atlanta? No I hate it. But Ressler clearly gets blinded by big names like AD, Dejounte Murray, Trae Young etc. Kind of strange since his best hits have been developing relatively unknown guys like Dyson and JJ…

For your fantasy team? Would be a big upgrade, since Atlanta barely plays in the 3 weeks of our fantasy playoffs.

Seems OO wanted to simultaneously tank his own stock and my weekly in exchange for my playoff aspirations today.

I don't quite know how to feel about that.

[Chryghst]

Alright….it’s a hot take….but was Nico….right? Understand the execution was terrible. Reaves should have been in the trade, along with every Lakers pick and every swap. But is this team (with Kyrie and Reaves) better than the team they had with Luka?

I understand he had to go because the org was toxic, but they’ve also been showing some flashes even without Kyrie back yet.

[ninjacookies]

Originally Posted by Chryghst

Alright….it’s a hot take….but was Nico….right? Understand the execution was terrible. Reaves should have been in the trade, along with every Lakers pick and every swap. But is this team (with Kyrie and Reaves) better than the team they had with Luka?

I understand he had to go because the org was toxic, but they’ve also been showing some flashes even without Kyrie back yet.

Mavs would never have been in the position to land Coop if not for the trade. And I feel as though Coop's skillset makes him a lot easier to build around going forward as opposed to Doncic. I also feel as though they can build with a more defensive mindset similar to what Phoenix is doing.

The trade was botched, but I don't hate their future outlook. I don't think they would have ever won it all with Luka, and the Lakers are in the same predicament right now having to navigate a mini rebuild within the next 2 years.

Unfortunately we'll probably never be able to see what the Mavs squad was capable of with Kyrie most likely not returning this year and AD possibly on the move.

[Chryghst]

Originally Posted by ninjacookies

Mavs would never have been in the position to land Coop if not for the trade. And I feel as though Coop's skillset makes him a lot easier to build around going forward as opposed to Doncic. I also feel as though they can build with a more defensive mindset similar to what Phoenix is doing.

The trade was botched, but I don't hate their future outlook. I don't think they would have ever won it all with Luka, and the Lakers are in the same predicament right now having to navigate a mini rebuild within the next 2 years.

Unfortunately we'll probably never be able to see what the Mavs squad was capable of with Kyrie most likely not returning this year and AD possibly on the move.

I don’t think Luka will ever win one. They had a ton of shooting variance in that OKC series, and I thought it was notable after they made the finals that Harden basically said ‘see…a team can win with this style’. And Harden actually has the capability to turn it up defensively.

Unpopular opinion but I think Dallas should keep AD. No point in selling for pennies on the dollar imho, unless they get a legitimate offer from a desperate team.

[ninjacookies]

Originally Posted by Chryghst

I don’t think Luka will ever win one. They had a ton of shooting variance in that OKC series, and I thought it was notable after they made the finals that Harden basically said ‘see…a team can win with this style’. And Harden actually has the capability to turn it up defensively.

Unpopular opinion but I think Dallas should keep AD. No point in selling for pennies on the dollar imho, unless they get a legitimate offer from a desperate team.

Luka's been better defensively this year (which is not saying much at all), but he's still a basic freebie against upper level scorers in iso. These are the same issues Atlanta faces with Trae. Lakers have to essentially surround him with an OKC-esque level ensemble to compensate for the matador stance.

Dallas would be dumb to trade AD. Unless the haul is incredible, it's not going to move the needle for them and there's really nothing a team like Atlanta (outside of JJ which ain't happening) could offer them that would improve their overall makeup.

They've held out this long so just pray Kyrie returns so they can at least see what this current cast looks like with everyone healthy. For however long that lasts.

[cms11]

Originally Posted by ninjacookies

Mavs would never have been in the position to land Coop if not for the trade. And I feel as though Coop's skillset makes him a lot easier to build around going forward as opposed to Doncic. I also feel as though they can build with a more defensive mindset similar to what Phoenix is doing.

The trade was botched, but I don't hate their future outlook. I don't think they would have ever won it all with Luka, and the Lakers are in the same predicament right now having to navigate a mini rebuild within the next 2 years.

Unfortunately we'll probably never be able to see what the Mavs squad was capable of with Kyrie most likely not returning this year and AD possibly on the move.

Luka can win a title, but needs defensive players around him. If the Lakers trade for Giannis in the offseason that would make a massive difference.

[ninjacookies]

Originally Posted by cms11

Luka can win a title, but needs defensive players around him. If the Lakers trade for Giannis in the offseason that would make a massive difference.

Giannis would be an incredible get, but that still doesn't address the other 2 mid grade starters (assuming Reaves can kick the recent health bugs) and most especially their bench. They are so far removed from a contending roster as it stands. And the problem is that they'll have majority of their cap tied into 3 names. Which results in the same patchwork roster with c level vets and walk-ons. It's in their DNA.

[ninjacookies]

Boston serving up a healthy dose of humble pie after the Clips cute lil recent surge.

What happens when you actually play a good team.

[kipgen]

Part of the reason the Luka trade is looked at as a bad trade is because the return was bad for a player of Luka's caliber. Now we know that the Mavericks ended up getting Cooper but at the time there would've been no way to know that unless you believe in the draft lottery being rigged for Dallas (which you definitely wouldn't be crazy to believe, in my opinion). Imagine a scenario in which the Mavericks ended up with the ninth pick and Collin Murray Boyles or whatever. Their situation doesn't look anywhere near as good and Nico is (rightfully) still shamed.

[rhigh2390]

Originally Posted by cms11

Luka can win a title, but needs defensive players around him. If the Lakers trade for Giannis in the offseason that would make a massive difference.

What would the framework for a Gianni's trade to LA look like? I don't see how they could.

Also, no matter how you look at it, the Luka trade was all-time bad. People keep trying to convince themselves otherwise, but it was horrible for Dallas.

[Chryghst]

Originally Posted by rhigh2390

What would the framework for a Gianni's trade to LA look like? I don't see how they could.

Also, no matter how you look at it, the Luka trade was all-time bad. People keep trying to convince themselves otherwise, but it was horrible for Dallas.

The trade they made was all-time bad. How they went about it was true malpractice. But I do think it’s possible we’ll look back and think that Nico was right about Luka. I do not think he’ll age well, and it will be very challenging to build a roster around him in the short term. Easier to do in LA than Dallas for sure, but Luka might be the type of player that would have benefitted from being the final piece rather than the 1st piece (ie multiple high lottery picks being drafted by a team before they took Luka).

Dallas had practically no way to upgrade their roster around Luka. He was good enough to keep them out of the high lottery, but his deficiencies were hard to cover up without young cost controlled pieces that you find in the high lottery. LAL have FA draw, but many of the same issues persist imo. Maybe I’m wrong and they’ll beat OKC and SA regularly in the next decade, but I just don’t see it.

[rhigh2390]

Originally Posted by Chryghst

The trade they made was all-time bad. How they went about it was true malpractice. But I do think it’s possible we’ll look back and think that Nico was right about Luka. I do not think he’ll age well, and it will be very challenging to build a roster around him in the short term. Easier to do in LA than Dallas for sure, but Luka might be the type of player that would have benefitted from being the final piece rather than the 1st piece (ie multiple high lottery picks being drafted by a team before they look Luka).

Dallas had practically no way to upgrade their roster around Luka. He was good enough to keep them out of the high lottery, but his deficiencies were hard to cover up without young cost controlled pieces that you find in the high lottery. LAL have FA draw, but many of the same issues persist imo. Maybe I’m wrong and they’ll beat OKC and SA regularly in the next decade, but I just don’t see it.

I guess I'm just really high on Luka because there's no way I would have ever traded him at that time. Just coming off a Finals run as a 25 year old. Yes, he has defensive downfalls, but like you said, the trade was all-time bad. I would have continued to tweak the roster to improve defensively and ride or die with him. He is a top player in the game and wanted to be in Dallas. Still just doesn't make any sense to trade him, even at full value, let alone what Dallas got for him. It's 5x worse than if Minny traded Ant right now for Zion or even SA trading Wemby for Zion because they don't think he will stay healthy. Of course there is that concern, but you have to take that risk. Anyone that says now or even in the future that Nico was right is pretty delusional.

The Lakers would be legit title contenders right now if they didn't have a 41-year-old taking up $52 million. It has nothing to do with Luka not being able to lead a team.

[Chryghst]

Originally Posted by rhigh2390

I guess I'm just really high on Luka because there's no way I would have ever traded him at that time. Just coming off a Finals run as a 25 year old. Yes, he has defensive downfalls, but like you said, the trade was all-time bad. I would have continued to tweak the roster to improve defensively and ride or die with him. He is a top player in the game and wanted to be in Dallas. Still just doesn't make any sense to trade him, even at full value, let alone what Dallas got for him. It's 5x worse than if Minny traded Ant right now for Zion. Anyone that says now or even in the future that Nico was right is pretty delusional.

The Lakers would be legit title contenders right now if they didn't have a 41-year-old taking up $52 million. It has nothing to do with Luka not being able to lead a team.

This is the fun thing about sports. We’ll see! I get where you’re coming from because I felt the same way about Mookie Betts.

I honestly think Minny is in a similar situation with Ant. He doesn’t have the defensive issues, but so much of life is timing, and Ant just made that team too good too quickly that now they’re stuck in the middle. They really needed that Dillingham pick to hit. The best teams seem to hit on 2-3 picks in a narrow window (BOS: Smart, Brown, Tatum), (OKC: Shai, Jdub, Chet), (HOU: Sengun, Amen, Tari/Jabari?-maybe 2.5), (SA: Wemby, Castle, Harper). The teams that hit on 2 like DEN (Jokic, Jamal) can hang with the top teams but are always missing something. The teams that hit on just 1 really struggle as that player gets onto bigger contracts and they don’t have 2nd/3rd bites at the apple in the top 10. You can try what Milwaukee did, shifting things around to open multiple windows, but the margin is just so small and the window so short.

I think there’s an argument Mavs should have waited until after Luka signed the supermax, and they definitely should have got a better return, but I also kind of get it. I know it sounds strange to say Minny and LAL are in the middle, but when you consider 1/3 of the league is trying to lose, they’re kind of in the middle of the rest. But we will see. One of us will be wrong in 7 years either because the Lakers/Wolves have won a couple, or those franchises are moving off those guys to rebuild. Very curious to see what Lakers do with all that money though, you got an ideas?

[Bosoxfan5990]

Originally Posted by ninjacookies

Boston serving up a healthy dose of humble pie after the Clips cute lil recent surge.

What happens when you actually play a good team.

And they're getting a Top 5 player back this year!

[JustinVerlander07]

Originally Posted by Chryghst

The trade they made was all-time bad. How they went about it was true malpractice. But I do think it’s possible we’ll look back and think that Nico was right about Luka. I do not think he’ll age well, and it will be very challenging to build a roster around him in the short term. Easier to do in LA than Dallas for sure, but Luka might be the type of player that would have benefitted from being the final piece rather than the 1st piece (ie multiple high lottery picks being drafted by a team before they took Luka).

Dallas had practically no way to upgrade their roster around Luka. He was good enough to keep them out of the high lottery, but his deficiencies were hard to cover up without young cost controlled pieces that you find in the high lottery. LAL have FA draw, but many of the same issues persist imo. Maybe I’m wrong and they’ll beat OKC and SA regularly in the next decade, but I just don’t see it.

If they traded him and got a kings ransom (like they should have), I think (and perhaps I'm wrong) the reaction would've been something like "holy crap why would they do that? .....but they got all this stuff for him" and while it's very likely the Mavs fanbase is still very upset, I think the general public would've defended the trade (definitely by this point, maybe not right away).

[yiguiri2002]

Originally Posted by Chryghst

This is the fun thing about sports. We’ll see! I get where you’re coming from because I felt the same way about Mookie Betts.

I honestly think Minny is in a similar situation with Ant. He doesn’t have the defensive issues, but so much of life is timing, and Ant just made that team too good too quickly that now they’re stuck in the middle. They really needed that Dillingham pick to hit. The best teams seem to hit on 2-3 picks in a narrow window (BOS: Smart, Brown, Tatum), (OKC: Shai, Jdub, Chet), (HOU: Sengun, Amen, Tari/Jabari?-maybe 2.5), (SA: Wemby, Castle, Harper). The teams that hit on 2 like DEN (Jokic, Jamal) can hang with the top teams but are always missing something. The teams that hit on just 1 really struggle as that player gets onto bigger contracts and they don’t have 2nd/3rd bites at the apple in the top 10. You can try what Milwaukee did, shifting things around to open multiple windows, but the margin is just so small and the window so short.

I think there’s an argument Mavs should have waited until after Luka signed the supermax, and they definitely should have got a better return, but I also kind of get it. I know it sounds strange to say Minny and LAL are in the middle, but when you consider 1/3 of the league is trying to lose, they’re kind of in the middle of the rest. But we will see. One of us will be wrong in 7 years either because the Lakers/Wolves have won a couple, or those franchises are moving off those guys to rebuild. Very curious to see what Lakers do with all that money though, you got an ideas?

They made the conference finals two straight seasons. How are they stuck in the middle?

[blackvodka]

The Cavs & Pistons game was actually solid. Daniss oddly was the x- factor, especially from beyond the arch. Potential ECSF match-up?

Sent from my motorola razr 2024 using Tapatalk

[Chryghst]

Originally Posted by JustinVerlander07

If they traded him and got a kings ransom (like they should have), I think (and perhaps I'm wrong) the reaction would've been something like "holy crap why would they do that? .....but they got all this stuff for him" and while it's very likely the Mavs fanbase is still very upset, I think the general public would've defended the trade (definitely by this point, maybe not right away).

Agree with you. They should have set themselves up for the next decade with that trade, and then if they got Cooper on top? We’d be looking at the next OKC situation.

[Chryghst]

Originally Posted by yiguiri2002

They made the conference finals two straight seasons. How are they stuck in the middle?

I think GMs make this mistake too. I don’t think you can measure teams by what round they made it to. Clippers lost in the 1st round last year, but they were probably the 3rd best team in the west? Thunder-Nuggets was essentially the WCF last year (in 2nd round), if not the nba finals.

It’s highly matchup dependent, injury dependent, and there can be variance in a 7-game series. I don’t think the Wolves have been remotely close to making the finals either of the last 2 years. They beat an injured/dysfunctional Lakers team followed by the Warriors without Curry? Season before, do they beat OKC if Dallas doesn’t get insane 3pt shooting variance? Personally I don’t think so.

On top of that, how do they get better? Utah has most of their picks, Minnesota isn’t a FA destination, stars like KD don’t even want to get traded there. Their only chance is to buy distressed assets like Trae, which could be a disaster. If you don’t think they’re in the middle now, they definitely will be soon. And no fault of Ant at all other than impatience by the GM not to tank his first couple seasons there.