Official ECF thread: (2)Boston Celtics vs. (4)Cleveland Cavaliers - Page 45

pac213up · 05-24-2018, 11:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ntgm37

I'm loving Tatum, but why isn't he more aggressive on the defensive end? I've seen it in different games where he just stands and watches as a player slashes by and he doesn't provide help. It's a little aggravating. Same on the offensive side, sometimes he just stands in his corner looking disconnected and doesn't seem to be interested. I might be over blowing it, but it irritates me.

You would have to know if he is staying within the scheme of what Stevens is asking him to do to really evaluate either of those things. In general though I think as you see him bulk up a bit he will mix it up more on the interior D....right now he just kinda gets thrown out of the way.

BlueXtreme · 05-24-2018, 11:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pac213up

If DM was on the Celtics they would not have made it this far.

Why is that?

pac213up · 05-24-2018, 12:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlueXtreme

Why is that?

Tatum is a more efficient scorer and his size is better for the defensive system Stevens runs.

BlueXtreme · 05-24-2018, 12:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pac213up

Tatum is a more efficient scorer and his size is better for the defensive system Stevens runs.

I can see the size comment. The efficient scorer comment is conditional imo. DM is the only player on the entire team who can create his own shot. Defenses could hone in on that fact. Their offense was straight painful to watch at times.

jcardstore · 05-24-2018, 01:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pac213up

Tatum is a more efficient scorer and his size is better for the defensive system Stevens runs.

I agree that Tatum is a more efficient scorer but that's only because there are multiple scoring threats and the Celtics have a much more well rounded offense. Teams aren't really exclusively targeting Tatum to shut him down and he's routinely guarded by smaller, weaker defenders.

DM is a much better scorer than Tatum overall, he's craftier around the rim, much better off the dribble, maybe not as good of a spot-up guy but DM has a wider array of offensive moves.

I guarantee if he was in a Brad Stevens run offense he would absolutely be a much more efficient scorer and a much better overall scorer than Tatum.

BlueXtreme · 05-24-2018, 01:07 PM

Delete

pac213up · 05-24-2018, 01:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jcardstore

I guarantee if he was in a Brad Stevens run offense he would absolutely be a much more efficient scorer and a much better overall scorer than Tatum.

Yeah....I'm not really buying that although I think both guys are great. Tatum's size is what gives him the advantage both offensively and certainly defensively when it comes to hitting 3's as much as anything. The difference in 3 pt shooting was significant. The Celtics defense is why they are where they are and Tatum just has more impact on that end without giving up much offensively.

jcardstore · 05-24-2018, 02:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pac213up

Yeah....I'm not really buying that although I think both guys are great. Tatum's size is what gives him the advantage both offensively and certainly defensively when it comes to hitting 3's as much as anything. The difference in 3 pt shooting was significant. The Celtics defense is why they are where they are and Tatum just has more impact on that end without giving up much offensively.

I actually went back and looked and I guess it was a case of the eye test lying to me.

I figured Tatum would have had many more open looks just because of the players that surrounded him. I'll go by the NBA's definition of "open" primary defender 4+ feet away

Tatum had less than half as many open 3s and shot 10pts higher 44% vs 34% and 150 more open 2s and shot it 7pts lower 51% vs 58%. Could be the way Tatum was utilized but these numbers were surprising to me because I expected that DM was significantly better on open looks and that he just took a bunch of contested ones which actually wasn't the case.

pac213up · 05-24-2018, 02:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jcardstore

I actually went back and looked and I guess it was a case of the eye test lying to me.

I figured Tatum would have had many more open looks just because of the players that surrounded him. I'll go by the NBA's definition of "open" primary defender 4+ feet away

Tatum had less than half as many open 3s and shot 10pts higher 44% vs 34% and 150 more open 2s and shot it 7pts lower 51% vs 58%. Could be the way Tatum was utilized but these numbers were surprising to me because I expected that DM was significantly better on open looks and that he just took a bunch of contested ones which actually wasn't the case.

I just think if you have 2 gifted players like this, for the most part the guy with a 5" height difference is going to be able to impact the game more. There are always rare exceptions but I do not think this is one of them. Long term both teams should be extremely excited about the players they got. This was a very strong draft class and these 2 were the cream of the crop.

ThoseBackPages · 05-25-2018, 05:27 PM

hope its a good game tonight

drobfan8 · 05-25-2018, 06:33 PM

I hope it's a great game and Boston win..

Cs vs Dubs would make for a pretty exciting contest.

alias21 · 05-25-2018, 06:49 PM

Think if the Celtics win tonight they will win the series

ThoseBackPages · 05-25-2018, 07:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alias21

Think if the Celtics win tonight they will win the series

lyyca · 05-25-2018, 07:09 PM

GO C's!!!!

drobfan8 · 05-25-2018, 07:42 PM

Let's do.it Cs

M4YH3M1 · 05-25-2018, 07:44 PM

Awful foul on Love... just ridiculous.

M4YH3M1 · 05-25-2018, 07:46 PM

JR BRICK!

M4YH3M1 · 05-25-2018, 07:47 PM

Terrible shot selection from Cavs..

Bron baseline fade-away..

JR dribble fade away jumper contended...

They don't even want it.

drobfan8 · 05-25-2018, 07:48 PM

Cs should go at Love every time. Get that 2nd foul

JMarchand1981 · 05-25-2018, 07:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by drobfan8

Cs should go at Love every time. Get that 2nd foul

Completely true

ThoseBackPages · 05-25-2018, 07:51 PM

Love concussion?

Bars and Bar · 05-25-2018, 07:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by drobfan8

Cs should go at Love every time. Get that 2nd foul

Or go at his head...

SHowley2003 · 05-25-2018, 07:51 PM

Hopefully Love and Tatum are fine. Looks like they each felt that. Tough way to start the game if either of them are out for any significant time tonight.

JMarchand1981 · 05-25-2018, 07:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SHowley2003

Hopefully Love and Tatum are fine. Looks like they each felt that. Tough way to start the game if either of them are out for any significant time tonight.

Tatum is back.

M4YH3M1 · 05-25-2018, 07:54 PM

This is all working to LeBrons favour.. Now the headlines can read;

"LeBron gets no Love but makes 50 point Triple Double to Force Game 7"

05-24-2018, 01:07 PM	#1106
BlueXtreme Member Join Date: Nov 2009 Posts: 1,978 LostSand	Delete Last edited by BlueXtreme; 05-24-2018 at 01:09 PM.

05-25-2018, 05:27 PM	#1110
ThoseBackPages Member Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Long Island Posts: 89,193 ThoseBackPages	hope its a good game tonight __________________ Pumpers Paradise #YouCryIBuy Four things that we cannot change each others minds about: Politics, Religion, Third Party Grading, and 2021 Bowman's Best Rookie Cards

05-25-2018, 06:33 PM	#1111
drobfan8 Member Join Date: Apr 2013 Location: Brisbane, Australia Posts: 17,805 drobfan8 drobfan8	I hope it's a great game and Boston win.. Cs vs Dubs would make for a pretty exciting contest. __________________ Wanted, 03/04 Exquisite Base Gold Tim Duncan and 05/06 Exquisite Base Gold /25 Michael Jordan

05-25-2018, 07:09 PM	#1114
lyyca Member Join Date: Nov 2012 Posts: 1,146	GO C's!!!! __________________ "I always told myself my progression is gonna be become a rotation player, become a starting point guard and then win an NBA championship. And people are definitely going to laugh when they hear that. They're not going to be laughing if it actually happens." - Jeremy Lin, 2011

05-25-2018, 07:42 PM	#1115
drobfan8 Member Join Date: Apr 2013 Location: Brisbane, Australia Posts: 17,805 drobfan8 drobfan8	Let's do.it Cs __________________ Wanted, 03/04 Exquisite Base Gold Tim Duncan and 05/06 Exquisite Base Gold /25 Michael Jordan

05-25-2018, 06:49 PM	#1112
alias21 Member Join Date: Oct 2016 Posts: 1,046	Think if the Celtics win tonight they will win the series

05-25-2018, 07:44 PM	#1116
M4YH3M1 Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Australia Posts: 2,737 m4yh3m1	Awful foul on Love... just ridiculous.

05-25-2018, 07:46 PM	#1117
M4YH3M1 Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Australia Posts: 2,737 m4yh3m1	JR BRICK!

05-25-2018, 07:47 PM	#1118
M4YH3M1 Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Australia Posts: 2,737 m4yh3m1	Terrible shot selection from Cavs.. Bron baseline fade-away.. JR dribble fade away jumper contended... They don't even want it.

05-25-2018, 07:48 PM	#1119
drobfan8 Member Join Date: Apr 2013 Location: Brisbane, Australia Posts: 17,805 drobfan8 drobfan8	Cs should go at Love every time. Get that 2nd foul __________________ Wanted, 03/04 Exquisite Base Gold Tim Duncan and 05/06 Exquisite Base Gold /25 Michael Jordan

05-25-2018, 07:51 PM	#1121
ThoseBackPages Member Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Long Island Posts: 89,193 ThoseBackPages	Love concussion? __________________ Pumpers Paradise #YouCryIBuy Four things that we cannot change each others minds about: Politics, Religion, Third Party Grading, and 2021 Bowman's Best Rookie Cards

05-25-2018, 07:51 PM	#1123
SHowley2003 Member Join Date: Mar 2013 Location: Boston, MA Posts: 6,788 SHowley2003 SHowley2003	Hopefully Love and Tatum are fine. Looks like they each felt that. Tough way to start the game if either of them are out for any significant time tonight. __________________ "My name is Shaquille O'Neal and Paul Pierce is the MFing Truth."

05-25-2018, 07:54 PM	#1125
M4YH3M1 Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Australia Posts: 2,737 m4yh3m1	This is all working to LeBrons favour.. Now the headlines can read; "LeBron gets no Love but makes 50 point Triple Double to Force Game 7"