jahallstar - appears to have made a fake Walking Dead comic redemption now R42

[aggie4ever]

Fyi, the Licensing Expo is currently happening in Vegas, that's probably the convention where most of the Cryptozoic people are currently. Looks like it runs through tomorrow, hopefully after that we will get some answers from them.

[Spider-Fan]

Originally Posted by webjon

Threads like these are made to bring what is obvious to some people to light to others.

You don't seem to value that, even though it's not obvious to you that these are fake.

While it's fantastic that this particular seller has bad feedback and can protect some from bidding, what happens when an unwitting buyer of his fakes turns around and sells them. Their feedback may be perfect, and without threads like this there wouldn't be anything for people to research if they are looking for information.

Jon, I'm not sure what it was that I said that lead you to believe I don't think threads pointing out fraudulent cards for sale have no value. I think quite the opposite - I think they have great value. I think there should be a sticky thread with a list of confirmed sellers that sell fakes. I also think they need to have credible evidence to support the claims that are being made.

There are many posts about fake cards, and this is the first where I have become a central figure in the thread. I never claimed the cards were real. People just didn't take the time to comprehend what I wrote and instead just responded to what they thought I wrote. I wrote "just because a card is blank does not mean it was fake" and the responses to this statement were certainly responses to words that were not written. I did not say jahallstars blank Reedus cards were real, I said you can't tell they are fake from the picture. I didn't refute a previous buyers experience that he bought one and it was clearly fake when he received it, in fact I thought that supported my statement that you needed to have more information than the picture to determine it was fake. In fact, this was my first post and everything that followed was about Cryptozoics responsibility to stop these auctions, not about identifying them and pointing them out. If this statement was interpreted as "stop pointing out fraudulent auctions" then that was a miscommunication on my part. I think the message is clear. (1) Don't buy from people who have negative feedback. (2) Don't blame Cryptozoic if you do. Again, I apologize if that was not clear.

Originally Posted by Spider-Fan

The guy has 6 negs and 3 neutrals all talking about fakes. People want to ignore them and keep buying, they get what they get.

Stop blaming the company. The only way Crypto can know if he is selling fake cards is to purchase them and evaluate them. Is that really what people expect Cryptozoic to do? Stop looking for somebody else to blame and start being accountable for your own money. If you can't afford to lose $500 on a fake auto or redemption, then don't buy from somebody you've never met that has negative feedback for selling counterfeits. Its really that easy.

Here are things I have a problem with (and when I say 'you', I don't mean you Jon... just anybody):

(1) When people don't consider the weight of the words they use. Identical and obvious are very strong words with very specific meanings.

Identical - similar in every detail. Well, it is a fact (not my opinion) that you cannot tell those cards are identical due to the quality of the photograph. You may have enough evidence to draw that conclusion for yourself, but in reality there are many details that cannot be made out due to the low quality of the image. Can you see the streaks of the pen? Can you see any artifacts that would be present due to the use of a stamp/autopen/photocopier/photoshop? No. You cannot. This is fact. No intelligent person would dispute this statement. You can see that the signatures parallel each other. That may be enough for you to determine for yourself that they are fake, but it is not enough to say they are identical. Identical is in the details, and the details are not present in that photograph.

Obvious - easily perceived or understood; clear, self-evident, or apparent. There is no qualifier of 'for some people'. When somebody refers to you as a master of the obvious, they are not paying you a compliment. If it is 'obvious to you' because of your experience/training in an area, then it is in fact NOT obvious. You have a trained eye. You have practice examining such samples. If you tell me that something is obvious, you are in fact insulting me for not realizing it. Who are you to insult me, when you have training and experience that I do not have? That is outrageous and rude. Nicnac produced photoshop images out of spite. Nonetheless, I appreciated those images because it was actual irrefutable evidence of the undeniable similarities between the autographs. It wasn't enough to support the supposition that they were identical, but it was compelling evidence disputing their authenticity.

I am a published author. I have presented my research at international conferences. I have never had the hubris to insult one of my colleagues by stating one of my findings was obvious.

(2) I don't agree with the regular statements made promoting the responsibility of the card companies to chase down these criminals. Yes, I said criminals. Counterfeiting cards, forging celebrity signatures, misrepresenting the authenticity of a collectible item and then selling it is fraud. Fraud is a crime. Crimes are to be investigated by agencies sworn to uphold the law and are to be decided by judges in a court of law. Of course the FBI is not going to investigate a petty thief like jahallstar, but shouldn't they? He is a criminal, right? I do not believe that anybody will argue that he is a criminal, yet nobody states that criminal charges should be brought up against him?

(3) I don't agree when people post something on the message board and act like that is the same as emailing the company/ebay. Even if they have a presence on the board, it is not the same as contacting them directly with a complaint. If you think an eBay listing is fraudulent, don't post it here but not contact eBay/the company and expect the listing to be investigated. Posting it here is great but not everybody who shops on ebay also uses this message board.

I applaud the members that go the extra mile, but this particular thread happens to be an example of a time when that more important step did not take place. No harm done, because Jahallstar is a criminal with a significant amount of negative feedback. What if it was some other seller with this mystery card that is not on the Cryptozoic website? It was in fact Crytpozoics error, yet that seller's name would have been defaced even though the listing would have been completely legitimate. I don't want to speak in hypotheticals, but due diligence is required when making criminal accusations.

(4) I think the expectation of people that the companies should troll these boards and post and react to everything posted is silly, regardless of whether or not there are representatives from these companies that are members of these boards. Personally, I would find a response to many of these things as unprofessional. My expectation is that they take the high road. I think if people want a response from the company, they should contact the company. When George helps to identify a sketch card artist or character, he is doing this as a sketch card collector NOT as a representative from Cryptozoic. What if he were to say something his corporate executives did not agree with? Maybe he gets a slap on the wrist, maybe he gets fired.

(5) I do not like to read speculation about what the companies and eBay are doing or are not doing. If you have credible information, share it. If you don't, keep it to yourself. If you wrote one of these companies or ebay and got a response, post it. If you didn't get a response, state that you didn't get a response. Don't state they did nothing. Just because they didn't respond to you doesn't mean they didn't do anything.

Originally Posted by webjon

Perhaps, if we aren't getting a resolution through Cryptozoic we should alert AMC, they seem to be exceptionally protective of the Walking Dead license. I am certain if someone could get to the right person at AMC they would be very concerned about expensive counterfeit Walking Dead merchandise.

AMC should be alerted. They actually OWN the Walking Dead TV property, correct? No good reason not to make them aware that their property is being counterfeited.

I apologize for my absence the last couple of days. I know you guys were totally bummed I wasn't on the thread, but I had some more pressing stuff to deal with (Man of Steel on Wednesday just a late and exhausting day at work on Thursday).

CollectorMan and anybody else that thinks you should keep emailing these companies. YES! Absolutely! That is my point. Tell the companies. Email, letters, whatever. Get your message to THEM. Posting here is only venting. Its like complaining about your boss to your best friend. Yeah, it makes you feel better but it does not bring about change.

Tex - I don't have an autograph collection to worry about. I don't have the time to learn the tricks and tips to identify a fake. The only autos I have were pulled straight from the box. No good ones I hope that the companies will implement some changes to make fakes more difficult to do well. Then maybe I will buy some. Right now the risk is too big considering the cost of those cards. The thing is, doesn't everybody believe when it does finally happen that Cryptozoic will be leading the pack?

[monkeymcgee]

Spider-Fan: I for one appreciate you typing out your position that way. I didn't misunderstand what you were arguing earlier, but you make it crystal clear.

I think there's some defensiveness about this stuff. When you get taken, you feel like a chump (I know I did when I got a fake John Elway auto) and you want to take on anyone who questions you. And those who are heavily invested in WD cards I'm sure are a little emotionally involved in the apparent increase (perception, maybe not reality) in these fake cards coming to the biggest online marketplace of them all.

Even though I've repeatedly made my point about what I think Cryptozoic should be doing (with no knowledge of what they have or haven't done), I do agree with your point that we shouldn't rely on them to protect buyers from these criminals. You are absolutely right about that. I think they have an interest in getting them taken down, but they are one of several parties who have an interest in it.

I think people like webjon do a great service to the more casual collectors who may not realize how sophisticated these fakes can be now. I am one of those casual collectors. I see those cards and had no idea they were not legit.

[steveskywalker]

Hang on, now in the box break sections, someone has just pulled an R44 so wtf is going on here !

[Spider-Fan]

Originally Posted by steveskywalker

Hang on, now in the box break sections, someone has just pulled an R44 so wtf is going on here !

This should partially answer your question

Originally Posted by aggie4ever

I e-mailed Miranda from Cryptozoic about this before lunch, and got this response from her:

Production just confirmed that R26 through R50 were added to the print run after we received Kirkman's cards at the last minute.

Not exactly ideal, but it looks like tht card is fine.

I would appreciate if you could help communicate this to the community? Most of out team is out of office for a convention, and will be tough to deliver a timely response, but I will try to get on the thread to comment as soon as I can.

So it looks like this card is legit. However, now the question is what are the redemptions good for? Sounds like you might only get either Aldard or Kirkman and not both for each redemption. So I assume R1-R25 is for Aldard and R26-R50 is for Kirkman? Not sure, but hopefully Miranda will get a chance to come in and comment officially and let us know.

[StevieV]

Looks like our friend may be back and giving Amazon a try this time:

Amazon.com At a Glance: Steel cage memorabilia

[THE_BEAST]

Originally Posted by StevieV

Looks like our friend may be back and giving Amazon a try this time:

Amazon.com At a Glance: Steel cage memorabilia

WOW... this guy never quits.

[SerialKilnWalkr]

Originally Posted by StevieV

Looks like our friend may be back and giving Amazon a try this time:

Amazon.com At a Glance: Steel cage memorabilia

Three seller feedback

1/5:
"Do not buy Autograph cards from them.... they are fake!!!"
Jonathan M., February 17, 2014

Seller Response: Buyer bought as gift and returned 2 months later what
a joke Date: February 17, 2014

1/5:
"This guy is FRAUD!! I receive nothing since Nov. 26,2004"
Alec C., December 7, 2004

1/5:
"it has been 20 days since nov 6. i still to recieve the item, only to know
that this dude has no idea i won his auction! payments has been made! im
asking for a refund or feedback on the item. no ans."
pietro d., November 29, 2004

[StevieV]

And now he's either back on eBay or someone is selling the fakes they bought from him:

Artbox Harry Potter Order of The Phoenix Rupert Grint Ron Weasley Autograph Auto | eBay

I would guess it's him because it's the same Grint that he has listed on Amazon and both sellers are from Maryland. Plus why list this with a low starting bid on only a 1 day auction? Trying to cash in before word gets around I suppose...