20-24: A Nesmith Odyssey

[Nomad]

Unleashing a personal favorite in support of Nesmith's effort tonight.



Actually have ordered the green printing plate of the Flawless "N" double patch /20. Green to blue, see?

[bkcardcollector]

very nice cards, that middle row is slick, top middle has to go tho.

[Nomad]

It's college sure, but an interesting card in that it is actually just the metal printing plate, not mounted.

[bkcardcollector]

i mean i like it but you need the regular version. just doesnt fit in

[Nomad]

Originally Posted by bkcardcollector

i mean i like it but you need the regular version. just doesnt fit in

I see, maybe I should have the Flawless printing plate flanked by the Flawless emerald auto /5 and the Flawless silver auto /25.

Will have to get creative with the pro Flawless/NT grouping, but that's the price of perfection.

[Nomad]

Gonna bow this thread out with a couple works in progress. Though I have picked up some more nice cards* since this storage photo sesh.

First, BLASTER, kind of reminds me of one of those boom boxes that you could configure into a transformer back in the 80s. The fact that the 1/1 and 8/10 Origins booklets come out and complete that is cool.

I had been wondering how many versions of the Absolute 1/1 black RPA there were. Just saw the six-panel of the 1/1 Absolute RPA come out on the Bay, but I really prefer the simplicity and power of the three-panel with central basketball and auxiliary swoosh motif Green is actually a color that works for the /5 and that's not just Celtics' bias.

Note sticker Absolute "band-aid" yellow /10 RPA on top. With the green swirl Mosaic, tied for world's ugliest rare card ever (or is it the red Absolute RPA /10 for any teams other than Hawks and Rockets?)..



Next up, EMPIRE STATE, just kind of reminds of of that iconic building, transplanted to Beantown.



And finally, WORK IN PROGRESS, which is just an impressionistic assemblage of a few.



The Impeccable RPA is 26/50, my only jersey number patch (thanks!). And it's nice to have the cyan "paintbrush" plate of that.

*Recent pickups include the Aaron Nesmith - Zion Williams** Chronicles Illusion error; Absolute "thickie" clover cap patch /20; and Mosaic disco gold /10. Oh yeah and encased '21-22 Instant ECF /10. If they refuse to put out any cards of Nesmith now that he's good, I'll just go back to his breakout "15 minutes of fame" with Boston versus Heat, when Smart went down.

Just realized I don't have an Immaculate RPA and then reassured myself that, like Spectra and Revolution base, it's just a design I don't really care for.

Regarding the 3- vs. 6-Panel Absolute 1/1 debate, not mine, but for comparison:



Actually, the sunburst ball-pump hole is a nice effect. But all not GU, so who cares, trash.

**The Nesmith - Zion connect. Describing how he took stock of his high school nemesis their first time on the court together.

[Nomad]

Interesting thought triggered by the Shai thread.

While the sheer variety of desirable and/or unique cards across the sets kept me low-key burning a hole in my pocket with Nesmith, the dynamic is much different with established stars.

In that case, even if you started early, you are looking at purchasing a few, relatively expensive, pieces that may never come up otherwise. Making a comprehensive collection is either a) impossible or b) extremely cost prohibitive.

Hence the Shai collector's focus on Chronicle 1/1s and with four he is almost halfway there. The Luminance platinum 1/1 is a big card, pre-photogenic.

Originally Posted by Spacemanspif

Update to my Chronicles collection. 4th 1/1!

In that sense, the multiplicity of cards really helps the collecting ecosystem, there is still room for a dedicated Shai collector to establish a domain. Say, the various versions of Contenders' tickets, or an Obsidian rainbow. Or maybe have a tiered system, like a selection of Shai's 10 top rookie cards. For lower end collectors, this template is exponentially broadened, you could have someone working their way up the Prizm rainbow, PSA 9 and above.

Originally Posted by Chris P

Got this in yesterday

If basketball collecting was really firing on all cylinders, you would see these kinds of specialized collections for all kinds of players, the TJ McConnells and the Dillon Brooks.

[Nomad]

Prices are still affordable and interesting one-of-a-kind items still floating out on the Bay. Nice to have a long term play like Nesmith... he's not one of those players you can't suddenly not afford the truly rare or unique of. Got these two for $20 and $45 respectively.

Within the context of the collection, these are bookends. I know that Absolute is kind of whatever, but this is the only card I've seen a piece of the clover on (there is another example, different part of the clover) and the basketball with the player initial "N" is pretty unique. As is the unintentional D White conehead homage in the eBay picture.

Grails? Hardly. But within the context of a collection that already includes prime examples of nearly all standard issues, it feels like the type of thing worth really collecting. Maybe this helps explain how unique examples of something, whether a pack-pulled error, or a sick patch, can sometimes result in outlier sales.





Also, there is the grouping aesthetics angle, the main thing I consider with any purchase. I envision these as nice bookends (right and left top) for this Absolute/Origins 1/1 bling grouping. Leaving basically two more spaces to fill.



Oh wait, forgot I purchased these two /60 and /99 Origins right after the Pacers got eliminated from ECF (for $2 and $5 respectively). These are examples of rainbow placeholders. The aim is to keep the same cards in those slots, but ultimately a lower serial number.

[bradjames12]

You have replied to your own thread 4 times before my post...

Just give it up man good grief

[Nomad]

Speaking of which, who cares about your post? Get used to it, nobody cares unless you have a fake pmg saga.

[bradjames12]

Same... actually more can be said about your incessant drivel about someone who doesn't matter in the NBA let the hobby

[Nomad]

I was kind of hesitant to do this value-sniping mail day, but its been a while and I just want to thank the collecting community out there. A lot of affordable, interestingly stuff has come up that has filled significant gaps in the Double A collection.

I've been thing more and more about what someone said, doing a PSA registry set of this eventually. I guess it would be the highest rated in terms of sheer diversity, though there must be high-end collectors with multiple Flawless, Prizm, and NT grails. In that sense, it's a shared ecosystem. One player collection is not better than another, they are just, how does one say, otros. (edit: on second thoughts, I will hold firm on the raw ethos until I get tired of real cards).

Obsidian dual-patch RPA /25

Reason why I grabbed this $40 all-in is because it was one of the sickest patches on the Bay for under around $200. Not game-used but not static and boring, and it will pair well with the green-light, white-light Obsidian /99 RPA. In hand I find that particular card monotonous, as every single one I have seen has the same green and white napkin combo. This patch is dynamically eccentric and flows well with the Obsidian background angles (like a fish).

This is what I don't get. The signature is basically Aaron's doctor's script that he settled on when he got lazy, signing thousands of stickers. Yet it gets a 10.

The 8.5 is almost a blessing in disguise. Almost as good as one could expect a card this thick to do, but probably why it was overlooked. As the Anthony Edwards thread proved, always buy the card, not the grade. And the dual tone silver-gold Beckett slab actually looks so sick with this design.

Shadow scratching goatee pose a nice touch.



I like the work Panini put into the back of Obsidian as well. Very curious to see if the next companies to competitively create basketball cards will feature a Nesmith jujitsu-hold design in what should be a legacy brand.



20-21 Immaculate patch 25/25.

The one is interesting. I had gone on one of my mad searches for value (dental work is expensive) and honed in on this RPA, also solidly two-color, for $15 all in (probably because the fool loaded his image in sideways). Should will pair well with the also well-patched Impeccable RPA /99. Oh, and there are now no sick Nesmith patches on the bay for under $189, folks. If the Pacers win their first ring in '25, does this jump in value?



22-23 Prizm Mojo /25

This one, I have mixed feelings about. The RGBT (running back granny-toss) attack to the rim that Nesmith pioneered and Nembhard memorably adopted in ECF, I like. But the digital artist literally ran amuck, making his neck look like Godzilla's. I really don't get that and it annoys me to look at the card very long, like I worry about dude's health.

And DubA is like super healthy, following the Al Horford model of same routine every day, no matter how hard he parties with TJ and the crew at interesting restaurants on the road. On the plus side, it is the last major Nesmith card issued and only Prizm in a Pacers uniform. And I guess Mojo /25 is kind of hip right now. So the $15 all-in price point seems justified.



21-22 National Treasures Biography prime /25

This one is special to me. Have a couple green napkin bios /99 and that is (as with Obsidian) the standard and only only option all the way down to the next level, which is prime. So this white-with-subtle-green-spots /25 fills in the row. Amazingly, ended at $2.37 in auction, so $7 all-in.

Incidentally, along with base Hoops and Prizm, this is one of Nesmith's three total 2nd year card issues and, along with Flawless, one of 2 issues over his four-season career to date that features GU jersey material. In that sense alone, it holds interest. For those who place premium on a player's early career, he actually doesn't have much.

[Nomad]

Taking a break about writing on antibiotic prophylactics to highlight the increasingly more quixotic cast of the collection. At some point one begins to test the outer limits of what meaningfully adds to the collection. Would a second tie-die Select patch really do anything?

Yes, every purchase is in a sense an investment, a tying of money into a tangible asset, but even at this stage no investment is guaranteed to carry value. That would take another decent playoff run.

To me this combo is like a kind of three-step pathway to success narrative.

First, you're in college, having challenged Zion, letterman, nice look on campus.



Now you're like a too-small smudge surrounded by a sea of green, getting 4-6 minutes a game.



Finally, you're in the uniform, it's not exactly fancy, but it's game used. You've earned a trade to Hali rebuild Indiana.



Next duo is just an example of a card it took me a while to warm up to. I had a thing against Spectra. But a week ago, when I finally got over my aversion and took a look, realized it was one of the best images of Aaron going for a (still not overhand) dunk, with Maxey actually solid in profile. So I picked up the /25 bricktile, /49 cracked, /99 black.







So finally, the lack of any 23-24 cards got me thinking about finding at least a good example of a card that had Nesmith in the background for this year. Again, nothing. Until I chanced upon this Jalen Brunson Panini Instant /5.



It's a great shot and I like how "franchise" Haliburton is up close, with role players Myles, Obi, and Aaron in distant pursuit. So yeah, it's actually a nice encapsulation of the global media's take on the Pacers 23-24 season, even the "no d" team relative to the Knicks.

[Nomad]

So this is a kind of humble post, as I don't own any of these cards. But it kind of points to the nature of a collecting quest. I haven't yet purchased a gold Prizm #282, but that is partly because I have a kind of aim of trading for one eventually.

I have enough kind of excess Nesmith rarities that I think I could work that. Also, I feel that I have my personal grail for that issue, the 26/199 true blue. It's nice to have an ongoing grail chase.

Anyway, so this sold on eBay for $154 on May 3. A gold shimmer /10. From hitman no less. who has some of the better takes on basketball. The pairing of gold shimmer and gold cracked ice is interesting (would you take it out of its case?). Definitely not well enough centered to need to be graded IMHO. Here I think I bid it up to a dollar less than what it sold for, there was definitely a buyer above me.



Today, this true gold sold for one dollar more than the $255 I inputted. I thought the storage motif in this photo was hilarious (association). Anyway, could easily have put a higher reserve, but I don't want to test the true limits of this collector...put in like $454 and have to pay (dental work is expensive).


Interestingly, it was not just the cap-unknown reserve bidder who was supporting this sale. There were 33 bids (not bad for the summer doldrums) and overall the bids felt a bit organic in texture.

Although the sold price seems like a great value, considering rarity, it is actually more than 10 times that the Gold Prizm rookie of Robert Woodard II (only recent '20-21 correlate I could find). So much hobby wealth is now concentrated into Bron, Steph, MJ, Kobe, Ant, and Wemby. Keeps the rest of collectors sane (and priced in).

Does have me wondering if the Wemby chase is partly predicated on keeping buyers focused on current new release cycle at all costs. I guarantee you that when the final Prizm card comes off the presses, prices drop by 50 percent.


Robert Woodard collectors, where art thou?

Anyway, I'm putting this Andrew Nembhard 22-23 rookie gold shimmer Prizm /10 on my grail quest. Sold for $245 in late May. I like how the image evokes Nesmith's rookie image, and remember specifically how Nesmith joined the Pacers' SL after his second season, just after getting traded to Indy. As I remember, it was he and incoming draft pick Andrew who established a good rapport and ended up (along with Ben's reckless motor) leading the Pacers to the title game (whoo-dee-do).


One forgets that SL is where a lot of players have to start proving themselves to fans and skeptical organizations.

On a tangent, just purchased a 23/25 jersey number first-Pacers mojo of Nesmith from the same set and I can say, if that had been his rookie issue, I would never have started collecting Nesmith. Antman collectors can rejoice that "Art Deco" 20-21 is one of Panini's finest rookie subset designs.



Rather have one Ant gold shimmer ($18,200) or 120 Nesmith gold shimmers? I know who I am betting on to have a ring first.

[bkcardcollector]

sorry for your losses

[Nomad]

what do you mean? still picking up grails cheap, which should be the title of this thread. Just got this chunky dual to /5 for $65 all-in. One of four cards career-to-date (including Flawless vert and horizontal RPA) with GU material.

An impossible 'Rena 9.5 with prime stitching.


and of course there was this $35 jn bad boy.



Dude priced like he didn't just exceed expectations by x10 is fine by me.

Can't wait till some new cards approach (2+ year wait) and I can throw away some money on Indiana spots.

Interesting theory recently mooted (I think the subject was Wiseman) that 20-21 prospects all got evaluated poorly due to lack of season, combines, and summer league.

[Nomad]

I think the interesting thing with the Arena 9.5 is to make it match the non-napkin (but also non mountain-stitch) /10 flawless dual patch imma hafta break it out of its Arena 9.5 case. Cause like jerseys need to breathe.

Also the whole point of the collection is to give cards life as organic entities within a super collection. So you can basically arrange them in a nice eco-organic card holding system that respects Ph, just as a humidor does.

And presents ever-changing variations in the quality of card sets and design. So its a showcase of a series of years, for example. "Nesmith's early years in the league, before the card gap." In that way the collecting narrative runs very similar to Brunson. Fans and decision makers had written him off to such an extent that he was off the commercial radar and mist a year or two of cards. But he kept learning, getting better.

When you say the industry is profit-driven, I say look at the potential profits the industry lost by not having an entire 18 months of Brunson bling across sets. (They possibly gained them in the long run, because the early Brunson just went ups in value. But you will never have Brunson collectors saying "buy Brunson" as you might with another player with too much stuff out there.

Anyway, if anyone can guess the next purchase I will give them the best card in my collection.

[bkcardcollector]

Yeah, I hear ya, I once popped a TJ Ford Bowman Chrome auto /25 i think it was a 9, very early in my career. But yeah Arena, I never even heard of em, and that is a nice card.

I am always rc focused.

gl breaking it out

ill have to go with some more spectra for the next whammy.

[Nomad]

I think I would have been RC focused if Nesmith had remained on a single team.

But the way that he embraced Pacers and became a fan favorite, one of the few on the roster that no one seriously talks about trading, adds a really interesting wrinkle to the quest. In a way I look at the 22-23 issues as the first to feature the mature emerging leader, within an organization that values him. It's a really positive sports career narrative. And so, after a year lull, it got me excited collecting the player again (that and the sustained upward team arc). Interestingly, the best image in Pacers gear, the early Indiana grail, is neither Hoops (that is actually Celtics with a Pacers logo), Prizm, Mosaic, or Obsidian (the obvious choices, considering what he is in).

Trying to think of a similar case of a player who flourished after a trade as a young bench piece. OG was already there....

I think of Bron's first-year Lakers... did those retain value? Heat first year as well? Being a serious James collector must be super interesting with the three distinct career phases to cover. At the high end you pretty much needed to be in there at the start to afford it, and even then it would be like affording a young Ant.

I know Michael's Wizards stuff is the least valued, but then he was there at the end of his career.

Chris Paul completists probably have the most interesting and varied quest.

I imagine that there are some collectors who focus on Brunson's RC Dallas stuff and others who are pretty much Knicks focused. The gap there is kind of cool, like the transition is more pronounced. Or did they catch up with Brunson by his last days in Dallas? (ok, I researched... while Bruh cards did really taper off by 2021-22, he was in a few sets, most prominently a flawless patch auto. Then 22-23 first Knicks. He never completely disappeared across an entire cycle).

Nembhard... key RCs aside his most valued card will provably not be his Pacers stuff, I think he will be in a larger market. Or is it Mathurin? Indiana unwillingness to embrace the second apron sez one or the other, and a consolidation trade is coming.

[Nomad]

22-23 National Treasures Biography prime /25 revisited

This one is special to me. Have a couple green napkin bios /99 and that is (as with Obsidian RPA) the standard and only option all the way down to the next level, which is prime /25. So this white-with-subtle-green-spots and dot-stitch matrix fills in the row. Amazingly, ended at $2.37 in auction, so $7 all-in.



The card is one of four (3 RC flawless and this) game-used (GU) issues over his four-season career to date. In that sense alone, holds interest. For those who place premium on a player's early career, he actually doesn't have much.


This 20-21 Flawless dual patch /5 probably features the same jersey used in the 22-23 NT Biography prime /25 (above).

Interesting also that the Biography card, despite Celtics colors (and unlike Hoops, with lengthy lead time), is from 22-23, Nesmith's first year with the Pacers. My theory is that Panini used up the remainder of the two GU jerseys it had originally purchased for the Flawless 20-21 rookie run (horizontal and vertical RPA, and dual patch). One trad. home and one trad. away jersey.

Interesting that they chose to put this out in a set not known for GU (I guess the aim of Biography was to remedy this), at start of Nesmith's tenure with Pacers. Is Panini a subtly aware company? A kind of nod to the past... or just being thrifty with jerseys. If the latter is true, a lack of new material explains why even prime patches are only subtly dual colored (unless you believe it was an aesthetic choice to highlight the card itself).


Example of the only other Biography parallel, the /99 green GU napkin. wait, there is super prime

Behold, the GU engineered 1/1 super prime (not mine).



Kind of bored of the robotic ENGINEERED aesthetic but it definitely stands out as a 1/1. I wonder if they actually saved that from a tag that also went into Flawless 20-21. I've seen engineered Engineered (non-GU/GW) in a few issues, think I have one of those among three panels in the Absolute 1/1 myself.

I believe actually that no Pacers GU jerseys have gotten onto the market. Just as all AN autos since 22-23 have been game or community signed.

Kind of illustrates how collections take on nuances that go beyond buying a slab.



Question now is, with the incoming Flawless dual auto /5, how do I manage what is now a four-card assemblage? The original idea was to have Celtics cyan (green) and Pacers blue printing plates framing the /20 dual patch in the middle. But with four good examples, maybe they are outer posts of a layout that would feature the Flawless /15 vertical RPA in the middle, with the Flawless /5 green and /25 red autos, and black printing plate, in a triangle around it. It’s always interesting when the purchase of a single card makes you reexamine how cards in the collection connect and coexist. In many ways, it could be any player. At that point it's about the chase and the printing art.

Slabs detract from that. I guess the thing to do for major collections is to set up a raw-set registry defined by identifiable features such as condition, patch, and numbering. Maybe keep the graded 9.5s and 10s out of the mix, or make that its own assemblage.

[Nomad]

If anyone wants to know the next card I purchased as part of the expanding collection, it was this (the barrelhouse that Nesmith had to face down G3-7).



Didn't realize Panini worked sneaky Brunson/Bernard King duals in there.



I know, my second Jay Bruh purchase in the last two weeks.



I think honestly collector preference for vertical over horizontal is something I didn't see come into play until the grading era. As long as you leave it ungraded, so your eyes aren't trying to perform pattern recognition feats, horizontal is a welcome variation. Viva la difference. Anyway, to me, two Versicolor hz. bookends like this has a unique aesthetic.

I'd like to design a humidor-like biowood system where you could feature like nine raw cards of any thickness and spin them in vertical or horizontal arrangements. SO it would be a raw-like breathable bioplastic encapsulation material that inserts into bioglass. As part of the encapsulation process, you have an invisible ID and grade embedded. So yeah your biosmartphone will be able to read that. Otherwise, enjoy a one-of-a-kind piece.

They said the hustle was dead, they didn't realize life is the hustle.

[bkcardcollector]

knee smiff still hasn't broken out :P

[Nomad]

broken out of what? I think it should be apparent now that he was a pivotal force on the Pacers and is ready to run it back with basically the same team. He has a substantial role carved, without the pressure of being the franchise face.

Who needs to break out when winning is its own form of expression.

Interestingly, Nembhard is likely to re-up with Indy on a four year contract. Pacers would not have already made that offer if there wasn't a high chance. Shai compared duded to MJ or something on Team Canada.

Wonder if Ty is permanently on the Team USA bench. Sure he docent have defense, but they needed him and he was just sitting.

[bkcardcollector]

breakin outta the arena case, nice card, didn't know he had a brother.

[Nomad]

I think Nesmith is like the epitome of a brother. Not in any symbolic way, but in how he approaches relationships on the court. In many ways, he models a constructive way of interacting with teammates and adversaries that I have learned a lot from since the pandemic.

The mic'd up ECF highlights he had against Boston brought this home to me. From the apres-failed running D on Jaytay chest bump with the Garden floor sweeper when he was clearly winded, to his bucking up of Ty when he was clearly winded. And it gets paid forward. In a different game (against Knicks? that crazy G1 against Boston?) Ty was like "five back. 15 to go. we got that." When most players would be eying the bench they were just getting rolling.