Can someone explain to me why the Disney Topps chrome cards are selling for a crazy A

[fabiani12333]

Originally Posted by jdandns

It wasn't for Skybox not trying with DC, as they made quite a few sets with them, they just weren't nearly as popular as the Marvel issues.
Superman and Batman focused series did OK, and were surely the equivalent of Spidey as a great subject for dedicated sets, but DC didn't really have a "hot" team to base multiple sets on like Marvel had with X-Men, and also couldn't get an annual "flagship" set going like Marvel did, even during the non-sports boom, with DC Cosmic Cards petering out after only 2 sets.

The 90's standouts for me were:

1."Kingdom Come" widevision with Alex Ross art
2. DC Villains
3. The Sandman
4. Batman Master Series
5. DC Legends Powerchrome

With the exception of Kingdom Come and Sandman, they were all available for discounted prices not long after release, with the Batman Master Series in particular being an especially poor seller at release.

I think the 1991 DC Impel set was the DC's version of the 1990 Marvel Universe set. The 1991 GI Joe Impel set was also similar -- I remember it being popular as a kid.

[fabiani12333]

Originally Posted by DynaEtch

I pretty much agree. If that 90s situation was reversed, and all those sets featured DC and not Marvel, I think it's very possible this forum would be filled with DC-set threads. The impact Skybox/Fleer made on the hobby was enormous and basically established the hobby. DC doesnt really have that*...nor does Disney, again besides the sporadic cheapo sets.

*: ok it has some, like Batman Forever Metal, but nothing to the level of several sets per year like what marvel was doing. I was a kid in the 90s, and DC was barely on my radar at all.

I think what really distinguished Marvel cards from DC cards and made Marvel cards popular long term were the 1992 X-Men Jim Lee set and the 1992 Marvel Masterpieces set.

The 1992 X-Men set fed off the popularity of both Jim Lee's X-Men run and the hugely popular X-Men Animated Series that debuted the same year. The cards were also sold with the X-Men toys from Toybiz. The X-Men were huge with kids in the early 90s.

Marvel Masterpieces brought comic book characters to life and depicted them like they never had before. It started the painted art phenomenon with Marvel cards, with 1994 Fleer Ultra X-Men also being a hit with kids.

[jdandns]

Originally Posted by fabiani12333

I think the 1991 DC Impel set was the DC's version of the 1990 Marvel Universe set. The 1991 GI Joe Impel set was also similar -- I remember it being popular as a kid.

Yes, that was "Cosmic Cards" (grey border) which did well, but it was followed by "Cosmic Teams" (blue border) which did not, essentially ending that line.

The answer to the highly successful Marvel Masterpieces line was DC Master Series, and it had some nice paintings, but from various artists (much like the least popular MM set, the '93 edition), so that line never got going either and those DC Master Series boxes were on clearance almost immediately.

A Superman set featuring all-new painted Joe Jusko art, basically "Superman Masterpieces" was announced for Summer 1996, but by then, the hard crash in the card market (and especially non-sports) was well underway and the set never came to fruition.

[DynaEtch]

Originally Posted by jdandns

It wasn't for Skybox not trying with DC, as they made quite a few sets with them, they just weren't nearly as popular as the Marvel issues.
Superman and Batman focused series did OK, and were surely the equivalent of Spidey as a great subject for dedicated sets, but DC didn't really have a "hot" team to base multiple sets on like Marvel had with X-Men, and also couldn't get an annual "flagship" set going like Marvel did, even during the non-sports boom, with DC Cosmic Cards petering out after only 2 sets.

The 90's standouts for me were:

1."Kingdom Come" widevision with Alex Ross art
2. DC Villains
3. The Sandman
4. Batman Master Series
5. DC Legends Powerchrome

With the exception of Kingdom Come and Sandman, they were all available for discounted prices not long after release, with the Batman Master Series in particular being an especially poor seller at release.

This shows how little I was aware of DC cards at the time- Im not even familiar with these. Pretty much all I remember was the Impel DC cosmic set. For me back then it was that one blip for DC, in an ocean of Marvel cards. I think you're right about DC not being as conducive to cards as much as Marvel though. There also was the factor that Marvel seemed much more popular in general in the 90s (besides the news-making Death of Superman event, Im pretty sure Marvel dominated everything, particularly X-men and Spiderman with the Jim Lee and McFarlane era, and the X-men animated show).

But back to being conducive to trading cards...is Disney? Idk. Something like marvel works great- you have battles, teams, painted artworks. The Disney cards are more just superimposing a character still onto a design background. Just seems more in vacuum. Now I could picture a truer 'non-sporty' Disney set....one with various artist takes on characters, drawing or painting them in a scenes. Perhaps with sketches too..maybe it could work as a lower to mid-range fun set. But probably wouldnt go over with the flippers nearly as much as a set like this Disney Chrome. A set with clean-looking stills- depicted as everyone knows them as- that is parallel dominant, is more along that line (sort of like marvel PMGs).

[jdandns]

Yes, DC's best-selling moment where cards are concerned, had to be the Death of Superman comic event and the Skybox trading cards that sprang from that. Those sold like hot cakes, but that was the only "can't find it" DC wax I can recall during the 90's boom. They did sell a ton of Michael Keaton "Batman" movie cards in 1989 right at end of the pasteboard era.

Even the "Batman Begins" set, some 25 years later, which had autographs from Liam Neeson, Gary Oldman, Michael Caine, and Cillian Murphy, didn't sell through. I remember buying boxes of those at discount for at least a year or two after release. That was even more the case with cards from the Clooney Batman movie, which also had a great signer's list.

[dd316]

Originally Posted by jdandns

Even the "Batman Begins" set, some 25 years later, which had autographs from Liam Neeson, Gary Oldman, Michael Caine, and Cillian Murphy, didn't sell through. I remember buying boxes of those at discount for at least a year or two after release. That was even more the case with cards from the Clooney Batman movie, which also had a great signer's list.

What's crazy is I don't ever recall seeing those boxes available when they were released. Where the heck were they all?

[fabiani12333]

1992 Stadium Club Batman Returns got a big release.

Basically, most non-sports cards sold in the early 90s through national toy store chains like Toys R Us and KB Toys were popular with kids because parents would buy them as presents.

[fabiani12333]

Originally Posted by DynaEtch

But back to being conducive to trading cards...is Disney? Idk. Something like marvel works great- you have battles, teams, painted artworks. The Disney cards are more just superimposing a character still onto a design background. Just seems more in vacuum.

I think this is a really good point -- these Disney cards were seemingly designed with parallels in mind.

Non-sport artwork cards used to be based around the artwork. The designs were meant to facilitate and enhance the artwork. Now they're a means to facilitate the parallels.

[jdandns]

Originally Posted by dd316

What's crazy is I don't ever recall seeing those boxes available when they were released. Where the heck were they all?

I bought some at regular price at my LCS and then slightly discounted at a popular local warehouse show, but after a year or two, a lot of the online retailers of the day had quantity at deep discounts.

So many memories...

"Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2007 09:43:32 -0400
From:
To:
Subject: Re: ORDER from Dave and Adam's Card World Weekly Entertainment Specials

How are you doing? Have created an invoice for you, invoice #2131912, invoice total is $164.00. Please let me know how you would like to wrap up payment.

Qty DESCRIPTION Price TOTAL
2 Batman Begins Hobby Box (Topps) 22.00 44.00
2 King Kong The 8th Wonder of the World Hobby Box (2005 Topps) 12.00 24.00
4 Scooby Doo Mysteries & Monsters Hobby Box (Inkworks) Plus Promo 14.00 56.00
1 Elvis IS Hobby Box (2007 Press Pass) 40.00 40.00"

Haha, probably should've bought a couple more Batmans instead of the $40 Elvis box, but my I wanted to give my mom a base set since she's a Presley fan. I bought at least 10 more boxes at or near that discounted price, though.

Got Michael Caine and two Cillian Murphy's for autos, and a full set of 3 memorabilia cards, with the chest plate being the rare one. I sold that memorabilia set for around $150 ten years ago and both Murphy's over time for around $100 for the pair (talk about an Oops-en-heimer!). I also, sometime ago, bought a Neeson and Oldman for a good price, sold the Neeson for more than I paid for the pair, and was going to sell the Oldman until the buyer and I discovered the card had once been in a BGS holder and graded "Authentic but Altered", likely for a bottom edge that had apparently been trimmed. Either the person who sold it to me took it out of that holder, or else someone he acquired it from did, and he either knew or he didn't. It's possible Topps themselves had trimmed it before packing it out, but there's no way to prove who did what. Maybe they got some of them back a little beat up from Gary and wanted to salvage them. Anyway, I'm glad to still have it. Oldman's a favorite, and of course, I kept the Michael Caine. That was an instant permanent addition to my PC, so awesome to have pulled that from a pack! I do wonder if even Christian Bale autographs would have made it sell out. Hard to say, but I certainly would have bought more for a chance at that. Right around the same time, their was a set for the Superman Returns movie with a similar list of big signers which sold so poorly, a planned update set for the end of the same year was summarily scrapped.

Originally Posted by fabiani12333

1992 Stadium Club Batman Returns got a big release.

Basically, most non-sports cards sold in the early 90s through national toy store chains like Toys R Us and KB Toys were popular with kids because parents would buy them as presents.

Batman Stadium was a nice set, but they sold for $10 a box on clearance for years. Kaybee was indeed a great place for non-sports cards in the 90's and they often discounted stuff, too. They were everywhere for awhile. I even remember getting Inkworks James Bond cards at Blockbuster Video, Rittenhouse Star Trek cards at K-Mart, Upper Deck Disney Treasures at Target, and Inkworks Simpsons Mania cards at Suncoast.

[kingofsnake]

Originally Posted by jdandns

Got Michael Caine and two Cillian Murphy's for autos, and a full set of 3 memorabilia cards, with the chest plate being the rare one. I sold that memorabilia set for around $150 ten years ago and both Murphy's over time for around $100 for the pair (talk about an Oops-en-heimer!). I also, sometime ago, bought a Neeson and Oldman for a good price, sold the Neeson for more than I paid for the pair, and was going to sell the Oldman until the buyer and I discovered the card had once been in a BGS holder and graded "Authentic but Altered", likely for a bottom edge that had apparently been trimmed. Either the person who sold it to me took it out of that holder, or else someone he acquired it from did, and he either knew or he didn't. It's possible Topps themselves had trimmed it before packing it out, but there's no way to prove who did what. Maybe they got some of them back a little beat up from Gary and wanted to salvage them. Anyway, I'm glad to still have it. Oldman's a favorite, and of course, I kept the Michael Caine. That was an instant permanent addition to my PC, so awesome to have pulled that from a pack! I do wonder if even Christian Bale autographs would have made it sell out. Hard to say, but I certainly would have bought more for a chance at that. Right around the same time, their was a set for the Superman Returns movie with a similar list of big signers which sold so poorly, a planned update set for the end of the same year was summarily scrapped.

Interesting stories about your experiences with the Batman product. I also have a Caine from this set (and a Katie Holmes). I'm been looking for an Oldman for quite some time. Will probably pass on the Neeson as it seems like he only signed in ball-point pen. Also will skip the Murphy autos as I don't like the Scarecrow mask. Anyways, personal choices.

[jdandns]

True, I've only ever seen ball-point from Neeson, including the one I had. At least he pressed hard.
Here's my Caine & Oldman.
As you can see, Gary is a little short on the bottom side.

[kingofsnake]

Originally Posted by jdandns

True, I've only ever seen ball-point from Neeson, including the one I had. At least he pressed hard.
Here's my Caine & Oldman.
As you can see, Gary is a little short on the bottom side.

Ah that's too bad about the Oldman - that's a great card and he's a terrific actor. Is it noticeably shorter when you put it next to a card from the same set?

[jdandns]

Yes, it's pretty easy to see in this picture.




There is clearly more border at the bottom of Caine/Murphy compared Oldman.

[Rictor]

The first Marvel Universe set sold out thanks to a smaller print run and hologram chasing. From there, print runs increased and the second Marvel Universe set got clearanced out. I remember having trouble finding that first set at retail as dealers marked it up. The second set I bought for around $10/box.

The DC set was overproduced to the point where boxes were available for $5 years after release. The ugly gray border probably didn't help. The holograms were popular, they just printed too many of them.

Another problem many of these sets had was that the packs were easily searchable for holograms, as the packs with inserts had a different, wider seal on them.

I'm still waiting for holograms to make their comeback to nonsports. I know they're expensive but so are nonsports cards. Those 90s holograms were what got me excited about buying packs in the nineties. I even bought Upper Deck hockey because of the holograms, LOL.

If individuals on Etsy can make 3D holograms cheap enough to sell for around $30, I'm sure a big company could make them for around $5 each, putting them around the cost of a sketch card to produce.

[jdandns]

Upper Deck actually did bring back holograms for the three Marvel Beginnings sets of the early 2010's and the value of those are through the roof.

[HiltonL]

Originally Posted by jdandns

Upper Deck actually did bring back holograms for the three Marvel Beginnings sets of the early 2010's and the value of those are through the roof.

That's a function of a) the hologram subset being large - people who chase this kind of thing are very dedicated; and b) the boxes dried up ages ago, and now thanks to the pandemic high, are hovering at outrageous prices - a long winded way of saying even singles have dried up

But you're a veteran here, you knew that.
Over the years one thing (Stan Lee autos) or another (holograms) or another (micro motion cards) have revived interest in these three sets over and over.

[PurplesaurusRex]

UD has added holograms to the new Avengers vs. X-men set. I haven't seen any in person but they look like the older ones.

[jdandns]

I always wished Marvel would've put out a couple of all-hologram series like DC did with Batman and Superman in the mid 90's, but the weak sales of those sets probably precluded that. Still, the Batman Holoseries came out pretty well. The Holocel chasers from those two sets remain among the coolest insert cards of the era. For those unfamiliar, they appeared to be a card-sized piece of clear plastic, but viewed at the proper angle, a full hologram emerged. I suspect collectors may have complained the Superman one was totally blank, so they added a small foil bat logo and the word Holocel to the Batman version.

[fabiani12333]

Originally Posted by Rictor

The first Marvel Universe set sold out thanks to a smaller print run and hologram chasing. From there, print runs increased and the second Marvel Universe set got clearanced out. I remember having trouble finding that first set at retail as dealers marked it up. The second set I bought for around $10/box.

The DC set was overproduced to the point where boxes were available for $5 years after release. The ugly gray border probably didn't help. The holograms were popular, they just printed too many of them.

Another problem many of these sets had was that the packs were easily searchable for holograms, as the packs with inserts had a different, wider seal on them.

I'm still waiting for holograms to make their comeback to nonsports. I know they're expensive but so are nonsports cards. Those 90s holograms were what got me excited about buying packs in the nineties. I even bought Upper Deck hockey because of the holograms, LOL.

If individuals on Etsy can make 3D holograms cheap enough to sell for around $30, I'm sure a big company could make them for around $5 each, putting them around the cost of a sketch card to produce.

Great info -- thanks.

[sketchopolix]

Cases at BO = 9k

[DynaEtch]

Sounds like...er...quite the bargain. Honest question since I am not following this set: are the prices of these singles even in the same stratosphere of justifying the high price of this wax? No sketches, real autos, or relics.

[sketchopolix]

Boxes on the Bay at 1k

[The Accountant]

Knew should’ve bought the case for 6500 when I had a chance.

There’s been some breakers in China really driving up the price. There’s a few sellers that were seemingly breaking cases a day and auctioning it all. Some funny business on the auctions though. Prices were exorbitant

[Tim]

Originally Posted by The Accountant

Knew should’ve bought the case for 6500 when I had a chance.

There’s been some breakers in China really driving up the price. There’s a few sellers that were seemingly breaking cases a day and auctioning it all. Some funny business on the auctions though. Prices were exorbitant

The auction prices i kept seeing and still see from China were and are very low other than the autos at the beginning.

I believed in this product from day 1 and also should have bought more. Gorgeous cards.

[sketchopolix]

Confirmed $12,600 sealed case sale.

Tim -1, naysayers -0