Official 76ers thread

[rman112]

Originally Posted by gomiamigo

Giannis shot 20% worse from 3 this year, on 50% more attempts.

I can't wait for Ben to show this kind of improvement in his offensive game!

Nothing about Ben Simmons not shooting has anything to do with Giannis.

If you think Simmons current offensive style is the extent of what he can offer Philly for the rest of his career, then OK. Because using your logic, as long as he's got some guys around him who can shoot, then there's no need whatsoever for Ben to ever develop a shot. He can retire in 15 years with the same skill set he has today and he will have fulfilled his potential, yes?

[BlueXtreme]

Originally Posted by gomiamigo

Giannis shot 20% worse from 3 this year, on 50% more attempts.

I can't wait for Ben to show this kind of improvement in his offensive game!

I am curious how much you have invested in Simmons to ignore the fact he doesn’t actually shoot the ball. People saying he can’t shoot isn’t being a hater; it’s reality. I bet half the guys in here actually wish he would develop a jumper and take his game to the next level.

Who would you say is playing better offense this post-season between Giannis and Simmons? Since you keep bringing him up.

[gomiamigo]

So, the Boston Celtic fan who loves Jaylen Brown and defends Donovan Mitchell against his horrific offense in the post-season is back here to attack the messenger, impugn their motives, and troll the thread rather than address any of the voluminous facts, or questions answered, already posted on the topic. [Cf. the 100s of times 76er fans say they wished he shot well from the outside in this thread alone, why would you say only half, our comments itt are literally unmissable.]

I also notice you, like other Simmons haters, fail to acknowledge that it took Giannis 6 years to shoot more effectively than Ben Simmons has shot the ball this year. Context matters. Simmons has a 114 ORtg in his 2nd year, Giannis was 105 by comparison. I think he'll be the MVP this year, he's been amazing.

But, unlike you I am entirely comfortable with confronting the facts, over 95% of my collection is in KD cards and has been for 10 years. The next 4% is in MJ, Wilt, and Lebrons. The remaining 1% is split btw Embiid, Erving, Iverson, Simmons, and filling out complete sets.

I honestly hope Ben's cards drop all summer so I can finally get a solid collection going. It'll probably be Embiid first though, I think the injury history is keeping them lower than they should be.


Oh wait -- are you still trying to buy Simmons prizm silver PSA 10s?

Or did you get your feelings hurt because you bought at the top?

[tjforce]

Originally Posted by BlueXtreme

I am curious how much you have invested in Simmons to ignore the fact he doesn’t actually shoot the ball. People saying he can’t shoot isn’t being a hater; it’s reality. I bet half the guys in here actually wish he would develop a jumper and take his game to the next level.

Who would you say is playing better offense this post-season between Giannis and Simmons? Since you keep bringing him up.

Simmons fan and collector here.....

I wish he shot the ball more, because I honestly believe it would help the team, and this is part of my frustration with Brown.

Ben shot 56.3% this year, 62.1% in playoffs. Philly as a team shot 47.1%, 45.9% in the playoffs.

Ben could take 6 more mid range/turnaround jumpers a game, and if he only hit 2 of them, still shoot 48.4%, which is higher than the rest of team, and guys like James Harden, Paul George, Joel Embiid, Devin Booker, Damien Lillard, Donovan Mitchell (I get that this isn't the same as eFG%, but hear me out).

But on top of still shooting a solid %, it would finally force teams to at least come out and guard him from that range, giving Embiid more room to work and opening up more passing lanes.

This is where Brown needs to step in. He's the coach. Simmons a 22 year old kid. During some regular season game against some schlep like Memphis, Brown needs to get Simmons to take the wide open three or mid range shot until he hits one.

He can do it. He does it in practice. He tried twice this year, and each time the shot looked good, just rimmed out.

I have to believe that this is the next step of the process. There's no way that this goes unnoticed by the 6ers, so if Ben isn't at least attempting longer range shots next October/November, then I'll start to lose patience with Brown.

[rman112]

Originally Posted by tjforce

Simmons fan and collector here.....

I wish he shot the ball more, because I honestly believe it would help the team, and this is part of my frustration with Brown.

Ben shot 56.3% this year, 62.1% in playoffs. Philly as a team shot 47.1%, 45.9% in the playoffs.

Ben could take 6 more mid range/turnaround jumpers a game, and if he only hit 2 of them, still shoot 48.4%, which is higher than the rest of team, and guys like James Harden, Paul George, Joel Embiid, Devin Booker, Damien Lillard, Donovan Mitchell (I get that this isn't the same as eFG%, but hear me out).

But on top of still shooting a solid %, it would finally force teams to at least come out and guard him from that range, giving Embiid more room to work and opening up more passing lanes.

This is where Brown needs to step in. He's the coach. Simmons a 22 year old kid. During some regular season game against some schlep like Memphis, Brown needs to get Simmons to take the wide open three or mid range shot until he hits one.

He can do it. He does it in practice. He tried twice this year, and each time the shot looked good, just rimmed out.

I have to believe that this is the next step of the process. There's no way that this goes unnoticed by the 6ers, so if Ben isn't at least attempting longer range shots next October/November, then I'll start to lose patience with Brown.

Re: Brown though, how far is he expected to go? From what I can gather, he does tell Ben to shoot the ball more. The more I read, the more it just appears as Ben's fears. There's only so much any coach can do. We saw how big of a disaster Fultz became, and just how mental it was. It would be similar to expecting a coach to tell Fultz to just shoot the goddamn ball normally, and expecting Markelle to just snap out of it.

Simmons was asked about it at his exit interviews, and his comments are not exactly encouraging. He acknowledges his weakness without really acknowledging it.

https://twitter.com/MrUram/status/1128012902135365632

[BlueXtreme]

Originally Posted by gomiamigo

So, the Boston Celtic fan who loves Jaylen Brown and defends Donovan Mitchell against his horrific offense in the post-season is back here to attack the messenger, impugn their motives, and troll the thread rather than address any of the voluminous facts, or questions answered, already posted on the topic. [Cf. the 100s of times 76er fans say they wished he shot well from the outside in this thread alone, why would you say only half, our comments itt are literally unmissable.]

I also notice you, like other Simmons haters, fail to acknowledge that it took Giannis 6 years to shoot more effectively than Ben Simmons has shot the ball this year. Context matters. Simmons has a 114 ORtg in his 2nd year, Giannis was 105 by comparison. I think he'll be the MVP this year, he's been amazing.

But, unlike you I am entirely comfortable with confronting the facts, over 95% of my collection is in KD cards and has been for 10 years. The next 4% is in MJ, Wilt, and Lebrons. The remaining 1% is split btw Embiid, Erving, Iverson, Simmons, and filling out complete sets.

I honestly hope Ben's cards drop all summer so I can finally get a solid collection going. It'll probably be Embiid first though, I think the injury history is keeping them lower than they should be.


Oh wait -- are you still trying to buy Simmons prizm silver PSA 10s?

Or did you get your feelings hurt because you bought at the top?

Is this guided at me? It's amazing the irony in your post. So I make a comment that I respect how a player handled being relegated to the bench, that now makes me a fan of him and the team? Maybe I just respect his maturity? Or maybe I'm just a REALISTIC basketball fan.

Not sure where anything is trolling. If so many fans are admitting he needs a jump shot and I am agreeing with them.. How exactly is that trolling? You seem to be the only one refusing to state he needs a jumper and getting extremely defensive over it.

The problem occurs when people say look at fg% when you know that is all at the basket or dunks. If he can do that without a jumper, just imagine. So instead of getting defensive and all uptight, how about you acknowledge he needs to work on that like tjforce just did.

That's also two playoffs in a row I feel him not having a jumper has hurt him and the team. I'm not sure if you are a Sixers fan or just a Simmons fan. I personally am just disappointed when I see players with that level of talent who don't hone their skills.

This forum is getting a bit tiresome with the off-base accusations. If you say someone could use some work on something.. That does not make you a hater. If you respect the way someone handled something. That does not make you a nuthugger. It makes you a realistic basketball fan.

We have enough crap going on with the altering of cards and stuff. Should probably lighten up, Francis... (if you name that movie, we can be friends)

[gomiamigo]

First steps first, I think. Ben improved from 37% on 5-10' last year to 42.5% this year [and 50% in the playoffs]. Getting a consistent 8-12' hook shot would solve most of the problems, although certainly not all. If Simmons' defender has to come out near the FT line, that opens up passing lanes to Embiid and cutters.

TJ - honest question for you. What if Ben just refuses to shoot from further out? I mean, it can't just be in Memphis blowouts either.

Like you said, we've seen him do it rarely in games and always in practice. If you're Coach Brown, do you bench him? That seems crazy too.

I don't think that ever will be the case, but it's difficult for me to blame Brown if he tells Ben to shoot, honestly.

[M4YH3M1]

As an Aussie, a 76ers supporter and Simmons supporter I'll just say that I am shocked that Simmons appears not to have any type of traditional shot. I'm daunted that he may never reach his full potential.

It is supremely frustrating to see him drive into the paint and then stop pivot and kick out or throw an errant pass on the drive that is 50/50 to be intercepted.
He's 6'10" and in the lane there is no excuse for not being able to finish or in the least attempt to score.

He needs to spend ALL off season shooting face up jump shots.
not clubbing, not holidaying, not hanging with Hollywood kardashian slags

J u m p s h o t s.

if he comes back next season and has one, I (and millions) will stfu.

[bdoody42]

Originally Posted by gomiamigo

I think running the offense they've run all year is optimal, even though I would have liked to seen him get more touches down low.

They tried to get JJ - our best and hottest shooter this game - the ball and Toronto defended perfectly. Embiid drove and then passed to Jimmy who needed to rise up but lost track of the shot clock.

The next time Tobias threw it away up top and Lowry got the easy steal transition bucket. It happens.

They didn't execute on those 3 important possessions, but overweighting them is unhelpful just as overweighting their 16-0 run in the 3rd period when they were down 9. All points are counted equally. All turnovers cost you a shot at a basket.

The 76ers didn't lose because of 1 or 3 bad offensive sets, but because a team with a +10 reb margin per game got crushed on the offensive boards 16-5. On top of losing the turnover battle as usual. And the Raps still needed a miracle of miracle shots and 5 rim bounces to win.

The 76ers scored less then 100 pounds in four games that series. Effective and efficient offense didn’t come easy for the 76ers. Utilizing Embiid inside in some capacity would have got Embiid going and create better looks for his teammates. They played great defense in game seven but their lack of utilizing Embiid was a big mistake.[/LIST]

[tjforce]

Originally Posted by rman112

Re: Brown though, how far is he expected to go? From what I can gather, he does tell Ben to shoot the ball more. The more I read, the more it just appears as Ben's fears. There's only so much any coach can do. We saw how big of a disaster Fultz became, and just how mental it was. It would be similar to expecting a coach to tell Fultz to just shoot the goddamn ball normally, and expecting Markelle to just snap out of it.

Simmons was asked about it at his exit interviews, and his comments are not exactly encouraging. He acknowledges his weakness without really acknowledging it.

https://twitter.com/MrUram/status/1128012902135365632

Well that's what makes a good coach, right? Getting guys to buy in to what you are doing.

I'm sure at this point Ben is pretty annoyed with being asked about his shot, or at least seemed that way in the interview. I'm sure he knows more than anyone it's a hole in his game, and at some point work to change it. At least I hope.

[tjforce]

Originally Posted by gomiamigo

First steps first, I think. Ben improved from 37% on 5-10' last year to 42.5% this year [and 50% in the playoffs]. Getting a consistent 8-12' hook shot would solve most of the problems, although certainly not all. If Simmons' defender has to come out near the FT line, that opens up passing lanes to Embiid and cutters.

TJ - honest question for you. What if Ben just refuses to shoot from further out? I mean, it can't just be in Memphis blowouts either.

Like you said, we've seen him do it rarely in games and always in practice. If you're Coach Brown, do you bench him? That seems crazy too.

I don't think that ever will be the case, but it's difficult for me to blame Brown if he tells Ben to shoot, honestly.

If he refused to shoot from further out?

He'll still be an all star. He'll still be helping his team play winning basketball. He might even still be a top 5-10 player in the league (even when everyone is healthy), but he won't hit his full potential.

IMO, he's got to learn to let go a bit and stop trying to be perfect. It seems to me like he wants to take the perfect shot. Take more jumpers, drive to the hoop more, be less afraid to fail shooting the ball.

In yesterday's game he attempted a shot, really, 9 times. He had 4 makes, 1 miss, 3 fouls that ended in free throws, and 1 bad charging call that should have been called blocking on Lowry. Keep grinding away.

[1stBowman]

Originally Posted by M4YH3M1

As an Aussie, a 76ers supporter and Simmons supporter I'll just say that I am shocked that Simmons appears not to have any type of traditional shot. I'm daunted that he may never reach his full potential.

It is supremely frustrating to see him drive into the paint and then stop pivot and kick out or throw an errant pass on the drive that is 50/50 to be intercepted.
He's 6'10" and in the lane there is no excuse for not being able to finish or in the least attempt to score.

He needs to spend ALL off season shooting face up jump shots.
not clubbing, not holidaying, not hanging with Hollywood kardashian slags

J u m p s h o t s.

if he comes back next season and has one, I (and millions) will stfu.

Hear, hear. Just shoot the f...thing. What are you afraid of? Ridicule? To hell with that.

At some point beating your chest, flexing your arms and hanging from the rim after slamming it down won't mean as much if everyone knows you are too scared to shoot the ball.

He has to at least try.

If he has a genuine crack at it and it doesn't work, so be it. He'll still be an excellent player. However, If he can develop a shot he could become the best of the best. As an Aussie, I would love nothing more.

[indyguy]

http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/2...2019-20-season

Brett Brown confirmed back for next season. Smart of the front office to move quickly, so there aren't any lingering rumors.

[tjforce]

Originally Posted by indyguy

http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/2...2019-20-season

Brett Brown confirmed back for next season. Smart of the front office to move quickly, so there aren't any lingering rumors.

Can't be upset. They mowed through Brooklyn in round 1 after game 1 adjustments. Came within a ball bounce of taking game 7 vs toronto in OT.

Just like Simmons and Embiid, Brown can get better too and improve as a coach next year.

[The Accountant]

Originally Posted by indyguy

http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/2...2019-20-season

Brett Brown confirmed back for next season. Smart of the front office to move quickly, so there aren't any lingering rumors.

good move. he is as much "the process" as embiid is. the team obviously has chemistry with him. hoping this move can motivate those guys to run it back.

[gomiamigo]

Watched most of Brett's interview, it was great, loved most of the answers, really think the players like and trust him. He said Harris told him during the Raps series he wasn't gonna be fired.

Seems like that Lebron-nuthugger of a 'reporter' was wrong again.

[the27guy]

I wasn't a fan of Embiid's antics in the first round.... but absolutely loved the passion he played with in round 2. Loved the tears. Loved the effort. Loved that he didn't throw his team under the bus as they hemorrhaged nearly a point a minute in the +/- column without him. By the end of the series I was questioning whether I'd rather see Toronto or Philly in the ECF.


He just tweeted this -

Joel Embiid
‏
Verified account

@JoelEmbiid
4m4 minutes ago
Hell of a season. Proud of my guys and I appreciate all the support you guys gave us all season long. Extremely disappointed and fell short of our goal but this is the motivation I needed and best believe I’ll be BACK EVEN BETTER AND STRONGER #TheProcess

[tjforce]

Ok... I finally have a bit of time to put my thoughts together:

Overall, progress was made this season. What Toronto is doing to the Bucks shows just how close the 76ers are to being at the top of East. It doesn't mean they got there, but they aren't far. When you look back and compare to a year ago, losing to Boston in 6, they improved by taking a better team in Toronto to the wire and losing by the bounce of the ball on the rim.

As far as individual players go:

Embiid: Established that he can be one of the most dominating players in the game, both sides of the ball. I say 'can be' and not 'is' because the Toronto series showed that there may be a select few players that can stymie him on offense. Also, injuries can slow him down. They key with him moving forward needs to be to figure out a way that they can use him on offense when he's against defenders that he can't bully in the post and don't make him be a decision maker with the ball from the 3 point line. And if he's against a team that doesn't have strong interior presence, feed him all day.

Simmons: His game did improve in his second year. He added .18 points to his shooting % by becoming a better finisher near the rim. He also got to the free throw line by ~25% more on slightly less shots. At the line he improved his free throw shooting by .40 points to a still low 60%. He, along with JJ, were the only consistent starters on a time ripe with turnover. He became the youngest All-star in the league. What he didn't do was improve his range at all this year. Until he gets to the point where it's a least a threat you have to contend with (think Russell Westbrook or Giannis), he'll be short of taking that next step to superstar. I do, however, like what I saw of him in the playoffs. He showed flashes of dominance when he needed to vs Brooklyn, and drew the duty of stepping up to go toe to toe with Kawhi. Hopefully, that sort of trial by fire that no other 22 year old is getting will help him grow.

Butler and Harris: Kind of a mixed bag with these guys. Butler stepped up vs. Toronto as the team leader, just as he was brought in to do. He brought the veteran presence they were looking for and almost got them to where they wanted to go. But he showed once again, that as good as he is, he isn't a top 5 or so guy who has been able to will his team to the finals.

Harris is a proven commodity that I feel didn't totally click this year. Not that he was bad, but he went from shooting 43% from 3 with the Clippers to 33% with the 6ers.

I don't think either of these guys are really worth $190 Mil, but the issue is that if you don't resign them you may not be able to get anyone else as good. So as who to resign, I don't know.


Moving forward into next year, I think there are two options: Resign everybody or build a roster with shooters around Simmons + Embiid. The logic of resigning everyone is that the team was so close to beating Toronto as it was this year, the team could get over the hump after having a full year together. The logic behind letting them go and adding shooters in that it builds the team closer to what we saw in 17-18 when they were able to win 15 games in a row, but with a more developed Simmons and Embiid.

Those are by thoughts, right, wrong or indifferent. Either way, I'm curious to see what the offseason holds for this team.

[gomiamigo]

One of the issues with not running it back is that if you don't re-sign Jimmy and Tobias, you're not saving the $35m of salary and able to use it on someone else, but only like $19m due to the soft cap and other issues.

So, people seem to like Brogdon, he's fine, but he'll get like $19-20m a year so if you don't max out Jimmy or Tobias, your ceiling is Brogdon as a replacement.

We can certainly have a conversation about Tobias vs Brogdon for less money but Brogdon's got an injury history with his knees and can't create his own shot like Tobias can. That hurts in the playoffs as we've seen this series with MIL losing 3 straight.

Or, you can get one new max player by letting those two go and its not like we're gonna get Klay or Durant or Kawhi. Any of them sign here we win it all.

I think it was a hugely positive sign that unlike losing to the Celts in 5 [not 6! ] the last 6 games vs Toronto we went 2-1 at home and crushed them 2x with one close loss and essentially went 1-1-1 on the road.

Roster: Ben, Joel, Jimmy, Tobias, JJ back at same price, Scott, Simmons at $1m, Zhaire, Shake, Bolden, 1st round pick, maybe Ennis, MLE for a backup Center [3yr $5.7m annual], Min Salary exception, 2nd round picks.

If you put any improvement on Ben and Joel as young stars, plus any improvement on having played more than 10 games together by the playoffs, plus any improvement from Shake, Zhaire [for sure], Bolden and whatever guys we draft -- it looks pretty good.
Adding a real backup C - would address our biggest need.

Zhaire/Shake would get the backup PG minutes unless we sign/draft a better one. I don't have to squint hard to see Zhaire and Bolden becoming significant role players and even maybe Shake in limited minutes. Personally, I am high on Zhaire's skill-set, athleticism, and tenacious defense.

It all starts with Ben and JoJo as everyone knows. They have to get at least 10% better every year. I think 76ers learned their lesson with burning out Joel in November and back-to-backs. That's the main reason I think we need Tobias back - we're gonna need his scoring and rebounding and interior D and vet leadership when Embiid sits.

[tjforce]

Watching Toronto close out the Bucks has me convinced that Philly should dish out the cash and resign Butler and Harris.

I still think Leonard is going to leave. Even if he doesn't, I like Philly's returning team's odds of improving over Toronto's with aging players like Gasol, Lowry and Ibaka.

New York could get Durant and Kyrie, I still don't think it makes them unbeatable. Durant never won anything before Golden State and Kyrie is probably a step down from Westbrook. They very well could be the best team in the East but it's not a sure thing.

Milwaukee might have to make a decision to keep either Middleton or Brogdon. Both are going to get paid, and the Bucks only have $23M in cap space thanks to the big contracts of guys like George Hill, Eric Bledsoe, and Tony Snell. Even if they do sign them both, that might not leave much money left for Brook Lopez, who I imagine will get paid this offseason.

I'd be surprised if Boston makes a trade for AD, but if they do and Kyrie still leaves, I can't see them being all that great.

[gomiamigo]

Yeah, MIL and BOS will be weaker, TOR obvs if Kawhi leaves, so it could just be us running it back vs NYK with Durant and Kemba, Kyrie just as likely to go Nets.

Whatever BOS would trade for AD - say Tatum and Brown and picks doesn't make them better as you said.

Also, if you don't sign Tobias - who are we putting out there? It's not like we even have Wilson Chandler anymore. Starting a Scott/Bolden combo? Eeesh. With having to rest Embiid and probably an avg backup C you'd need Ben and Jimmy and JJ to put up 20+ a game.

If you let Tobi/Jimmy walk and then a non-Embiid starter gets hurt like Ben or JJ then you're really in trouble because Joel will still have to rest anyways.

[gomiamigo]

The ironic but amazing thing is that the player who would have fixed all our playoff issues this year but backup C: outside shooter who can stretch the floor, athletic wing defender, PG who can penetrate and run the PnR, gets all of Ben and JJ's minutes when they rest, makes the bench stronger -- was Markelle Fultz before his 'injury.'

If he was just the guy he was supposed to be, by year 2, Sixers could very easily have been the favorites in the Finals and an easy winner over a Durant-less GSW. A guy who puts up, say, 14-4-5 while able to help defend Curry or Klay along with Butler and Ben?

Wow.

Matching smallball with GSW with Markelle, JJ, Jimmy, Ben, Tobias for 5-8 minutes while Embiid rests - you have 4 shooters surrounding Ben. Now flip Ben for JoJo and the court is wide open for him to dominate the low post 1 on 1.

[gomiamigo]

So, I like the 76ers moves.

Sixers could have lost 3 of their starters and best sub for nothing, instead return Tobias on less than a max, Scott on a friendly deal, get Josh Richardson, Al Horford at $24/yr, and add $8m in cap space [and still have $9m MLE and $2.5m trade exception for a good shooter and add'tl depth].

That seems like a pretty great outcome to me! It's not like Kawhi or Klay were gonna sign here.

Add in Zhaire and Thybulle and we should be the East favorites depending on Kawhi.

[gomiamigo]

So, evidently we only get the $5.7m MLE since we used cap space to sign Horford. I can't believe none of the Philly writers have done a cap space article yet. $7.7m and a $2.5m trade exemption for sure we can use with a lesser MLE. We'd have to sign someone to take us over the cap to use the MLE, I'm not at all sure how that works - I think they'd have to resign someone on the roster to get the $7.7m cap space under the $5.7m so maybe give Shake>Ennis a new contract and/or I guess just sign 2 guys at the vet minimum.

It's so ridic confusing, the NBA needs to make this easier on fans.

[tjforce]

Originally Posted by gomiamigo

So, evidently we only get the $5.7m MLE since we used cap space to sign Horford. I can't believe none of the Philly writers have done a cap space article yet. $7.7m and a $2.5m trade exemption for sure we can use with a lesser MLE. We'd have to sign someone to take us over the cap to use the MLE, I'm not at all sure how that works - I think they'd have to resign someone on the roster to get the $7.7m cap space under the $5.7m so maybe give Shake>Ennis a new contract and/or I guess just sign 2 guys at the vet minimum.

It's so ridic confusing, the NBA needs to make this easier on fans.

Ben Simmons will be getting a huge extension very soon, so there you go.