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Old 12-23-2019, 10:52 PM   #6176
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Originally Posted by superdan49 View Post
.....
That card lost some serious real estate.
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Old 12-23-2019, 11:08 PM   #6177
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That card lost some serious real estate.
Sure but doesn't it look much better centered?
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Old 12-23-2019, 11:12 PM   #6178
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Sure but doesn't it look much better centered?
45 45.
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Old 12-23-2019, 11:13 PM   #6179
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45 45.


I laughed more than I should have at this


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Old 12-23-2019, 11:44 PM   #6180
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Stumbled across this one. Just have before and after links, but this I how I assume the story goes:

-Collector subs cards to PSA and it gets rejected.
-They sell it via PWCC.
-One of PWCC's finest buys it to try their "luck" on submitting it.
-PSA happily slabs it.
-PWCC sells it as a PSA 8.
-Rinse and repeat.

https://www.pwccmarketplace.com/items/1868277
https://www.pwccmarketplace.com/items/1690336

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Old 12-23-2019, 11:49 PM   #6181
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That one is on PSA. Size really doesn't matter for some submitters because that Stottlemyre is really short by at least 1/16"
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Old 12-24-2019, 02:31 AM   #6182
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 3124508 on COMC View Post
Stumbled across this one. Just have before and after links, but this I how I assume the story goes:

-Collector subs cards to PSA and it gets rejected.
-They sell it via PWCC.
-One of PWCC's finest buys it to try their "luck" on submitting it.
-PSA happily slabs it.
-PWCC sells it as a PSA 8.
-Rinse and repeat.
That’s an interesting sub that included that minsize Mel. Several cards next to cert #40752873 came back no cert. I’m not sure of the exact cards in the sub but checking periodically through a few hundred cards before 40752873 and 30 or so after and lots of the cards ended up selling through pwcc. Was that a PWCC sub or one of their big customers?
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Old 12-24-2019, 09:17 AM   #6183
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On a side note to our readers, if you ever get a Min Size Req on one of your subs, don't give up on the card. Just put it in with your next sub. Sooner or later it will get into a slab, just a matter of how many times it is worth it to you to keep trying.

Arthur
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Old 12-24-2019, 09:30 AM   #6184
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Originally Posted by pip View Post
That one is on PSA. Size really doesn't matter for some submitters because that Stottlemyre is really short by at least 1/16"
As I am fond of saying, with credit to Orwell, All submitters are equal. Some are more equal than others.
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Old 12-25-2019, 04:08 PM   #6185
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This card was purchased and altered by an unknown buyer from Memory Lane, Inc.. Even though the card received a .5 grade bump by PSA, the card did not sell for much more than the purchase price. As noted below, the spots in the black may have been filled in or it could be spots from scanning.
The card has been trimmed though with the best view being from the back.


PSA Cert #26217216

PSA Set Registry: private

1965 Topps Joe Namath #122

Value gain of $4,224.00

This card was purchased by an unknown bidder from Memory Lane, Inc. as a PSA 8 for $60,576.00 on August 20, 2016.
VCP link: https://vintagecardprices.com/card/f...22/97394/PSA/8



Same card was sold by Memory Lane, Inc. as a PSA 8.5 for $64,800.00 on May 19, 2018.
VCP link: https://vintagecardprices.com/card/f.../97394/PSA/8.5



Yellow circles are print, fiber, or chipping identifiers.
Red box identifies trimmed bottom edge and possible color addition in the black.








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Old 12-25-2019, 04:19 PM   #6186
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There's no way debris like that could have been left in the image on a card like that. I think there has been some coloring on the 8.5
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Old 12-25-2019, 04:44 PM   #6187
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pip View Post
There's no way debris like that could have been left in the image on a card like that. I think there has been some coloring on the 8.5
I would agree since the black frame has no white specks in either image.
I just can't confirm it.
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Old 12-25-2019, 04:50 PM   #6188
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What about the little stain? in the top border on the 8?
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Old 12-26-2019, 09:38 PM   #6189
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PSA Cert #:40814458

1957 Topps #302 Sandy Koufax PSA 7 to PSA 8
Alteration types: Corners sharpened
Set Registry status: In a user's private Registry

Sold on 3/14/2017 as a PSA 7 by PWCC to whitman111 (Gary Moser's eBay ID) for $559.00
Consigned to PWCC and sold on 8/13/2018 as a PSA 8 for $1,381.00
Final price: $1,381.00
Value gain: $822.00


This card was purchased from PWCC by Gary Moser's whitman111 eBay ID as a PSA 7 and was later sold again as an altered PSA 8 by PWCC. The bottom two corners were sharpened by the card doctor, as you can see in the images below. This alteration is especially apparent when looking at the lower right reverse corner, of which I included a detailed image. I believe that a combination of soaking, pressing, and then filing the corners to a sharper point was used to turn this PSA 7 into a PSA 8. This same method was likely used in the alteration of a 1957 Topps Mantle/Berra card, which was also purchased by Moser's whitman111 ID prior to doctoring (see Post #6068 here). Regardless of the method, it is 100% altered. Green circles show print spots and/or paper fibers confirming the two sets of images are of the same card. Pink boxes highlight the altered corners.


PSA 7: https://www.pwccmarketplace.com/items/1446976
PSA 8: https://www.pwccmarketplace.com/items/1721409
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Last edited by superdan49; 12-26-2019 at 09:42 PM.
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Old 12-26-2019, 10:33 PM   #6190
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I think the top two corners on the Koufax were also improved through a process of microtrimming and using some type of filler. Chances are good that the card would fail a basic UV test.
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Old 12-26-2019, 11:53 PM   #6191
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It's too bad there can't be live in-person auctions for some of these big ticket doctored items. I'd love to see some spirited bidding like in the clip below from one of my favorite movies. North by Northwest

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YEv7cVW8hBA



Quote:
Originally Posted by corndog View Post
This card was purchased and altered by an unknown buyer from Memory Lane, Inc.. Even though the card received a .5 grade bump by PSA, the card did not sell for much more than the purchase price. As noted below, the spots in the black may have been filled in or it could be spots from scanning.
The card has been trimmed though with the best view being from the back.


PSA Cert #26217216

PSA Set Registry: private

1965 Topps Joe Namath #122

Value gain of $4,224.00

This card was purchased by an unknown bidder from Memory Lane, Inc. as a PSA 8 for $60,576.00 on August 20, 2016.
VCP link: https://vintagecardprices.com/card/f...22/97394/PSA/8



Same card was sold by Memory Lane, Inc. as a PSA 8.5 for $64,800.00 on May 19, 2018.
VCP link: https://vintagecardprices.com/card/f.../97394/PSA/8.5



Yellow circles are print, fiber, or chipping identifiers.
Red box identifies trimmed bottom edge and possible color addition in the black.








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Old 12-29-2019, 04:25 PM   #6192
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Putting this and future Kevin Burge trimmed cards into this thread.

With internal help we were able to identify the masked Ebay and VCP ID of another one of Kevin Burge's buying accounts - cardcontractor.
The masked Ebay ID is t***a (private FB) and the VCP ID is c***a.
Out of the first five cards confirmed trimmed, two were given PWCC stickers and included descriptions reminiscent of Gary Moser cards.
With the name Kevin Burge already well established as a fraud, I can assume that Brent Huigens knew who he was working with.
In the PSA subs that I have researched, most contain modern cards so vintage doesn't seem to be Burge's primary source of material to destroy.
The modern cards were all resold through the probstein123 laundry service.





PSA Cert #40881235

PSA Set Registry: none

1969 Topps Nolan Ryan #533

Value gain of $1,627.00

This card was purchased by masked VCP ID c***a (cardcontractor - Kevin Burge) from Ebay seller PWCC as a PSA 8 for $493.00 on April 16, 2018.
PWCC link: https://www.pwccmarketplace.com/items/1641629

Same card was sold by PWCC as a PSA 9 for $2,120.00 on December 06, 2018.
PWCC link: https://www.pwccmarketplace.com/items/1868286

Yellow circles are print, fiber, or chipping identifiers.
Red box identifies trimmed top edge.




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Old 12-29-2019, 06:17 PM   #6193
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PSA Cert #40881242

PSA Set Registry: scottatha111 Hank Aaron

"Beautifully centered with untouched corners and razor sharp edges."


1966 Topps Hank Aaron #500

Value gain of $1,521.00

This card was purchased by masked VCP ID c***a (cardcontractor - Kevin Burge) from Ebay seller PWCC as a PSA 8 for $504.00 on April 16, 2018.
PWCC link: https://www.pwccmarketplace.com/items/1641284

Same card was sold by PWCC as a PSA 9 for $2,025.00 on January 16, 2019.
PWCC link: https://www.pwccmarketplace.com/items/1889486

Yellow circles are print, fiber, or chipping identifiers.
Red box identifies trimmed left edge.




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Last edited by corndog; 12-29-2019 at 06:35 PM.
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Old 12-29-2019, 06:33 PM   #6194
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Look how badly diamond cut that Aaron is.
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Old 12-29-2019, 06:46 PM   #6195
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PSA Cert #42972716

PSA Set Registry: none

"This recently assessed beauty boasts virtually GEM MINT corners and card stock. All four edges are completely pristine..."


1965 Topps Cards 1965 Rookie Stars #477

Value gain of $1,655.11 and was given a PWCC sticker

This card was purchased by masked VCP ID c***a (cardcontractor - Kevin Burge) from Ebay seller PWCC as a PSA 8 for $481.00 on July 11, 2018.
PWCC link: https://www.pwccmarketplace.com/items/1689808

Same card was sold by PWCC as a PSA 9 for $2,136.11 on March 31, 2019.
PWCC link: https://www.pwccmarketplace.com/items/1926043

Yellow circles are print, fiber, or chipping identifiers.
Red boxes identify trimmed left and right edges.




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Old 12-29-2019, 10:37 PM   #6196
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Quote:
Originally Posted by corndog View Post
Putting this and future Kevin Burge trimmed cards into this thread.

With internal help we were able to identify the masked Ebay and VCP ID of another one of Kevin Burge's buying accounts - cardcontractor.
The masked Ebay ID is t***a (private FB) and the VCP ID is c***a.
Out of the first five cards confirmed trimmed, two were given PWCC stickers and included descriptions reminiscent of Gary Moser cards.
With the name Kevin Burge already well established as a fraud, I can assume that Brent Huigens knew who he was working with.
In the PSA subs that I have researched, most contain modern cards so vintage doesn't seem to be Burge's primary source of material to destroy.
The modern cards were all resold through the probstein123 laundry service.

Those descriptions never get old, almost like PWCC knew what was altered on the cards.
Curious of the reason to split between PWCC and Probstein123. Attempting to cover his tracks, Probstein123 provided better modern sales.....?
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Old 12-31-2019, 02:10 PM   #6197
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PSA Cert #40927096

1909 T206 Bill Dahlen, Brooklyn #118 (Sovereign) - Population 1 of 1 - none higher

PSA Set Registry: none

Value gain of $2,240.10

This card was purchased by an unknown bidder (although 3 certs later is a confirmed Moser purchase) from Robert Edwards Auction (REA) as a PSA-5.5 on October 29, 2017 for $1,560.00.
VCP link: https://vintagecardprices.com/card/b...212347/PSA/5.5

Same card was sold by PWCC as a PSA-7 for $3,810.10 on July 08, 2018.
VCP link: https://vintagecardprices.com/card/b...n/212347/PSA/7

Yellow circles are print or fiber identifiers.
Red squares identify rebuilt bottom corners and staining minimized.







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Old 12-31-2019, 02:57 PM   #6198
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Quote:
Originally Posted by corndog View Post
PSA Cert #40927096

1909 T206 Bill Dahlen, Brooklyn #118 (Sovereign) - Population 1 of 1 - none higher

PSA Set Registry: none

Value gain of $2,240.10

This card was purchased by an unknown bidder (although 3 certs later is a confirmed Moser purchase) from Robert Edwards Auction (REA) as a PSA-5.5 on October 29, 2017 for $1,560.00.
VCP link: https://vintagecardprices.com/card/b...212347/PSA/5.5

Same card was sold by PWCC as a PSA-7 for $3,810.10 on July 08, 2018.
VCP link: https://vintagecardprices.com/card/b...n/212347/PSA/7

Yellow circles are print or fiber identifiers.
Red squares identify rebuilt bottom corners and staining minimized.







What a shame on the Dahlen card. When they bleached it, the card lost all of its vibrant color and depth. Just a dull green background now, along with a drab image and bland flesh tones. Beautiful piece of history... ruined.

And PSA's inability/unwillingness to label it for what it is, is simply disgusting. Partners in crime, PSA and PWCC need to go away.

Is there anything these scumbags won't do for money?
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Old 12-31-2019, 03:27 PM   #6199
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Thanks corndog, you have confirmed my suspicion that VCP knows the ID of card doctor accounts (because they have different masks than ebay). It's a shame Bobby Binder isn't more forth-coming with that info, but obviously being a large benefactor of PWCC ad buys, once again money helps cover up the truth.

Vintage Card Prices seems to be missed as someone who doesn't do enough to help uncover the identity of these fraudsters.
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Last edited by mattglet; 12-31-2019 at 03:35 PM.
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Old 12-31-2019, 05:27 PM   #6200
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Thanks corndog, you have confirmed my suspicion that VCP knows the ID of card doctor accounts (because they have different masks than ebay). It's a shame Bobby Binder isn't more forth-coming with that info, but obviously being a large benefactor of PWCC ad buys, once again money helps cover up the truth.

Vintage Card Prices seems to be missed as someone who doesn't do enough to help uncover the identity of these fraudsters.
Who’s Bobby?
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