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BASEBALL Post your Baseball Cards Hobby Talk |
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#6176 |
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Join Date: Jun 2017
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#6177 |
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Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: So Cal
Posts: 1,447
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#6178 |
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Join Date: Jun 2017
Posts: 3,727
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#6179 |
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Join Date: Aug 2014
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#6180 |
BODA
Join Date: Jun 2016
Posts: 9,388
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Stumbled across this one. Just have before and after links, but this I how I assume the story goes:
-Collector subs cards to PSA and it gets rejected. -They sell it via PWCC. -One of PWCC's finest buys it to try their "luck" on submitting it. -PSA happily slabs it. -PWCC sells it as a PSA 8. -Rinse and repeat. https://www.pwccmarketplace.com/items/1868277 https://www.pwccmarketplace.com/items/1690336 ![]()
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3124508@protonmail.com The Short Guide to the PWCC Card Trimming & Alteration Fraud |
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#6181 |
Member
Join Date: Jul 2019
Location: French underground
Posts: 4,009
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That one is on PSA. Size really doesn't matter for some submitters because that Stottlemyre is really short by at least 1/16"
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#6182 | |
Member
Join Date: May 2019
Posts: 36
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#6183 |
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Join Date: May 2011
Location: Spaceball 1
Posts: 4,794
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On a side note to our readers, if you ever get a Min Size Req on one of your subs, don't give up on the card. Just put it in with your next sub. Sooner or later it will get into a slab, just a matter of how many times it is worth it to you to keep trying.
Arthur |
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#6184 |
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Join Date: Jun 2017
Posts: 3,727
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#6185 |
BODA
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: From a table in McDonalds, with lovely fake flowers on it.
Posts: 17,858
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This card was purchased and altered by an unknown buyer from Memory Lane, Inc.. Even though the card received a .5 grade bump by PSA, the card did not sell for much more than the purchase price. As noted below, the spots in the black may have been filled in or it could be spots from scanning.
The card has been trimmed though with the best view being from the back. PSA Cert #26217216 PSA Set Registry: private 1965 Topps Joe Namath #122 Value gain of $4,224.00 This card was purchased by an unknown bidder from Memory Lane, Inc. as a PSA 8 for $60,576.00 on August 20, 2016. VCP link: https://vintagecardprices.com/card/f...22/97394/PSA/8 ![]() Same card was sold by Memory Lane, Inc. as a PSA 8.5 for $64,800.00 on May 19, 2018. VCP link: https://vintagecardprices.com/card/f.../97394/PSA/8.5 ![]() Yellow circles are print, fiber, or chipping identifiers. Red box identifies trimmed bottom edge and possible color addition in the black. ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
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#6186 |
Member
Join Date: Jul 2019
Location: French underground
Posts: 4,009
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There's no way debris like that could have been left in the image on a card like that. I think there has been some coloring on the 8.5
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#6187 | |
BODA
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: From a table in McDonalds, with lovely fake flowers on it.
Posts: 17,858
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I just can't confirm it.
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#6188 |
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Join Date: Jun 2017
Posts: 3,727
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What about the little stain? in the top border on the 8?
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#6189 |
BODA
Join Date: Mar 2015
Posts: 4,272
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PSA Cert #:40814458
1957 Topps #302 Sandy Koufax PSA 7 to PSA 8 Alteration types: Corners sharpened Set Registry status: In a user's private Registry Sold on 3/14/2017 as a PSA 7 by PWCC to whitman111 (Gary Moser's eBay ID) for $559.00 Consigned to PWCC and sold on 8/13/2018 as a PSA 8 for $1,381.00 Final price: $1,381.00 Value gain: $822.00 This card was purchased from PWCC by Gary Moser's whitman111 eBay ID as a PSA 7 and was later sold again as an altered PSA 8 by PWCC. The bottom two corners were sharpened by the card doctor, as you can see in the images below. This alteration is especially apparent when looking at the lower right reverse corner, of which I included a detailed image. I believe that a combination of soaking, pressing, and then filing the corners to a sharper point was used to turn this PSA 7 into a PSA 8. This same method was likely used in the alteration of a 1957 Topps Mantle/Berra card, which was also purchased by Moser's whitman111 ID prior to doctoring (see Post #6068 here). Regardless of the method, it is 100% altered. Green circles show print spots and/or paper fibers confirming the two sets of images are of the same card. Pink boxes highlight the altered corners. PSA 7: https://www.pwccmarketplace.com/items/1446976 PSA 8: https://www.pwccmarketplace.com/items/1721409 ![]()
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Cardboard Detective Emeritus superdan49@protonmail.com — Anonymous Tip-line Last edited by superdan49; 12-26-2019 at 09:42 PM. |
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#6190 |
Member
Join Date: Jul 2019
Location: French underground
Posts: 4,009
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I think the top two corners on the Koufax were also improved through a process of microtrimming and using some type of filler. Chances are good that the card would fail a basic UV test.
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#6191 | |
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Join Date: Jun 2019
Posts: 416
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It's too bad there can't be live in-person auctions for some of these big ticket doctored items. I'd love to see some spirited bidding like in the clip below from one of my favorite movies.
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YEv7cVW8hBA Quote:
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#6192 |
BODA
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: From a table in McDonalds, with lovely fake flowers on it.
Posts: 17,858
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Putting this and future Kevin Burge trimmed cards into this thread.
With internal help we were able to identify the masked Ebay and VCP ID of another one of Kevin Burge's buying accounts - cardcontractor. The masked Ebay ID is t***a (private FB) and the VCP ID is c***a. Out of the first five cards confirmed trimmed, two were given PWCC stickers and included descriptions reminiscent of Gary Moser cards. With the name Kevin Burge already well established as a fraud, I can assume that Brent Huigens knew who he was working with. In the PSA subs that I have researched, most contain modern cards so vintage doesn't seem to be Burge's primary source of material to destroy. The modern cards were all resold through the probstein123 laundry service. ![]() PSA Cert #40881235 PSA Set Registry: none 1969 Topps Nolan Ryan #533 Value gain of $1,627.00 This card was purchased by masked VCP ID c***a (cardcontractor - Kevin Burge) from Ebay seller PWCC as a PSA 8 for $493.00 on April 16, 2018. PWCC link: https://www.pwccmarketplace.com/items/1641629 Same card was sold by PWCC as a PSA 9 for $2,120.00 on December 06, 2018. PWCC link: https://www.pwccmarketplace.com/items/1868286 Yellow circles are print, fiber, or chipping identifiers. Red box identifies trimmed top edge. ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
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#6193 |
BODA
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: From a table in McDonalds, with lovely fake flowers on it.
Posts: 17,858
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PSA Cert #40881242
PSA Set Registry: scottatha111 Hank Aaron "Beautifully centered with untouched corners and razor sharp edges." 1966 Topps Hank Aaron #500 Value gain of $1,521.00 This card was purchased by masked VCP ID c***a (cardcontractor - Kevin Burge) from Ebay seller PWCC as a PSA 8 for $504.00 on April 16, 2018. PWCC link: https://www.pwccmarketplace.com/items/1641284 Same card was sold by PWCC as a PSA 9 for $2,025.00 on January 16, 2019. PWCC link: https://www.pwccmarketplace.com/items/1889486 Yellow circles are print, fiber, or chipping identifiers. Red box identifies trimmed left edge. ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
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He has no rival, He has no equal. ![]() Last edited by corndog; 12-29-2019 at 06:35 PM. |
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#6194 |
Member
Join Date: Aug 2017
Posts: 41,193
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Look how badly diamond cut that Aaron is.
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I love PSA! |
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#6195 |
BODA
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: From a table in McDonalds, with lovely fake flowers on it.
Posts: 17,858
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PSA Cert #42972716
PSA Set Registry: none "This recently assessed beauty boasts virtually GEM MINT corners and card stock. All four edges are completely pristine..." 1965 Topps Cards 1965 Rookie Stars #477 Value gain of $1,655.11 and was given a PWCC sticker This card was purchased by masked VCP ID c***a (cardcontractor - Kevin Burge) from Ebay seller PWCC as a PSA 8 for $481.00 on July 11, 2018. PWCC link: https://www.pwccmarketplace.com/items/1689808 Same card was sold by PWCC as a PSA 9 for $2,136.11 on March 31, 2019. PWCC link: https://www.pwccmarketplace.com/items/1926043 Yellow circles are print, fiber, or chipping identifiers. Red boxes identify trimmed left and right edges. ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
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#6196 | |
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Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 4,348
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Curious of the reason to split between PWCC and Probstein123. Attempting to cover his tracks, Probstein123 provided better modern sales.....?
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Ashley Lelie Rookie Collector, always looking for more. |
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#6197 |
BODA
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: From a table in McDonalds, with lovely fake flowers on it.
Posts: 17,858
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PSA Cert #40927096
1909 T206 Bill Dahlen, Brooklyn #118 (Sovereign) - Population 1 of 1 - none higher PSA Set Registry: none Value gain of $2,240.10 This card was purchased by an unknown bidder (although 3 certs later is a confirmed Moser purchase) from Robert Edwards Auction (REA) as a PSA-5.5 on October 29, 2017 for $1,560.00. VCP link: https://vintagecardprices.com/card/b...212347/PSA/5.5 Same card was sold by PWCC as a PSA-7 for $3,810.10 on July 08, 2018. VCP link: https://vintagecardprices.com/card/b...n/212347/PSA/7 Yellow circles are print or fiber identifiers. Red squares identify rebuilt bottom corners and staining minimized. ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
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#6198 | |
Member
Join Date: Jul 2019
Posts: 595
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![]() And PSA's inability/unwillingness to label it for what it is, is simply disgusting. Partners in crime, PSA and PWCC need to go away. Is there anything these scumbags won't do for money? |
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#6199 |
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Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 4,346
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Thanks corndog, you have confirmed my suspicion that VCP knows the ID of card doctor accounts (because they have different masks than ebay). It's a shame Bobby Binder isn't more forth-coming with that info, but obviously being a large benefactor of PWCC ad buys, once again money helps cover up the truth.
Vintage Card Prices seems to be missed as someone who doesn't do enough to help uncover the identity of these fraudsters.
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Creator of ListingAlarm - get instantly notified when a card you're looking for is listed on eBay! https://www.listingalarm.com Collecting Riley Pint - www.RileyPint.com Total owned: 77%, 1/1s: 71 Last edited by mattglet; 12-31-2019 at 03:35 PM. |
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#6200 | |
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Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 4,136
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