Introducing PSA's unregulated gambling, er, I mean PSA PowerPacks™

[Oriole Way]

Originally Posted by brev87

Card is comped at $100, PSA is offering $90. Are you walking around with that same card and selling to a vendor for $85?

As a vendor, are you buying that same card at $90? Just to sell it at $100, knowing you're going to get offers for $95 all day? So you make $5?

How is that a bad thing? It establishes a clear floor on many cards, and it makes PSA slabs more liquid. If you don't like it, don't deal with PSA slabs. Or if it's not enough of a margin for you to take a risk on buying a particular card in the hypothetical situation you presented, then pass in favor of another card that you percieve to have more upside.

In the end, the people who are smart and buy quality cards of good players will still make money. Perhaps it makes flipping more challenging than before, but even in that regard, the collectors/dealers who are most resourceful and knowledgeable will win out over ones who aren't as savvy. Which is how it's always been.

[imbluestreak23]

It's getting harder and harder and harder for the average flipper to sustain themselves without having a real job.

In 2025, I would not want to be in this business exclusively as the primary mechanism for bringing in an income. Perhaps apply to PSA or FanTopps. That is where the money is going.

[aggie4ever]

I think people are way overestimating how much the offers will be from PSA. I assume they will be using an engine similar to Gamestop's, have any of you actually seen what kind of offers they give?

I just entered a card I got back recently from grading at Gamestop:
Cash offer: $253.58
Store credit: $281.75

I listed the card on ebay, and sold it the first week I listed it at auction for $750 recently. From the limited offers I looked at on Gamestop, I only saw 80% store credit offers on extremely popular and liquid cards (mostly Pokemon cards), and only 70-75% for cash. Most baseball cards were 50% or less, and I'm talking Ohtani RC's. I only checked a couple of cards, because I quickly realized there was zero chance I would be selling them any of my cards. And many high dollar cards, they wouldn't even give me an offer.

For those interested, the card was: 2018 TOPPS COMPLETE SET CHROME ROOKIE RELIC WSE4 SHOHEI OHTANI PSA 9. So an extremely popular player, and should be extremely liquid right now. So I'm not sure why they only offered 1/3 of current value for it. Maybe because PSA's auction results are like a year old? So 80% of the year old value might equal that? That's the only reason I could come up with, although that still seems too low.

[inaka]

Originally Posted by aggie4ever

I think people are way overestimating how much the offers will be from PSA. I assume they will be using an engine similar to Gamestop's, have any of you actually seen what kind of offers they give

PSA isn't offering 1/3 of the value of cards. Far from it. PSA Vault offers vary based on the card, but often are stronger than selling on eBay (due to eBay fees.)

I just watched this guy's video last night, and the start of the video has 4 cards he sold direct from the PSA Vault from PSA offers.


1989 Pro set #490 Troy Aikman PSA 10
Past few eBay sales: $80-110
PSA offer: $86 no fees

1984 Topps #111 Howie Long PSA 8
Past few eBay sales: $15-24
PSA offer: $27 no fees

1989 Score #339S Sterling Sharpe PSA 8
Past few eBay sales: $7-24
PSA offer: $28 no fees

1989 Score #339S Sterling Sharpe PSA 9
Past few eBay sales: $29-35
PSA offer: $32 no fees

There's always the possibility for lowball offers, but I think you're mixing up Gamestop graded card offers and PSA Vault offers. They aren't the same.

[aggie4ever]

Originally Posted by inaka

There's always the possibility for lowball offers, but I think you're mixing up Gamestop graded card offers and PSA Vault offers. They aren't the same.

I'm not mixing them up, I know they are different things. But, what I actually wrote, was don't you think they are using a similar offer engine? It's based on PSA's auction archives or price guide, at least I would assume so.

It's good to hear they are doing a lot better offers than Gamestop. But I have a hard time believing they are actually buying for more than what the cards are selling for on ebay. Yes, I can believe good offers of 90% on very liquid cards. The four examples listed though, I'm amazed at. Low value cards, that they are paying above ebay for? I don't see how they can do that for long. Or, if that is the quality of cards in their blind packs, I can't see why people would buy many of them.

[Delta5]

Originally Posted by brev87

Card is comped at $100, PSA is offering $90. Are you walking around with that same card and selling to a vendor for $85?

As a vendor, are you buying that same card at $90? Just to sell it at $100, knowing you're going to get offers for $95 all day? So you make $5?

Yes, you'll need to wait 1-2 weeks before getting your money if you sell to psa, shipping cost, insurance, price fluctuation. I'll sell it right there and then. No brainer

[inaka]

Originally Posted by aggie4ever

I'm not mixing them up, I know they are different things. But, what I actually wrote, was don't you think they are using a similar offer engine? It's based on PSA's auction archives or price guide, at least I would assume so.

Yes, and you also said "I assume they will be using an engine similar to Gamestop's". No. They are not the same because of the end model. PSA offers are based on what PSA's undisclosed "partners" are willing to pay for inventory (i.e. repackers, mystery packs, etc.) PSA lists these "Partners" as:

Local card shops and verified dealers in the PSA Partner Network are always looking for supply. Through PSA Offers, cards are allocated to fill their specific inventory requests and find new collections to call home.

Heck one of the "partners" could be rich guys like the owner of the Arizona Diamondbacks who needs a specific PSA 10 of a common player to fill a set and will overpay like a mo-fo to get it.

That isn't the basis of the Gamestop offers at all. The PSA PowerPacks specifically need high end chase cards. Thus, PowerPacks and others creating similar mystery packs will likely overpay or pay at comps for high end chase cards, since they aren't making their money on selling the actual card, they're making their money on selling the gambling/illusion of getting the card in a mystery pack. Rinse and repeat, over and over, even with the same chase card that where the winner took the cash payout instead of the actual card.

Gamestop on the other hand states this as their pricing model for offers:

We use a pricing model that compares pricing and provides an instant trade quote for each specific item you’re trading.

This pricing model is run when your card is scanned in for a trade, and therefore can provide real-time pricing for an item, rather than using a static price point like most of our products in store.

Your cash or in-store credit will be provided immediately for a convenient and hassle-free experience. Pricing data and estimates are derived in part by data provided by Card Ladder.

It's a different model. At least right now it is, which explains why PSA offers can even possibly be so high, at or near exact comps from eBay sales, etc. Gamestop is selling the actual cards. So they need to buy them low, and sell them higher and take a cut. Again, different model completely.

[The_Reverend]

I have been saying this. Vendors are indeed going to have to change their percentages to get inventory. A few I watched have already increased their cash offers to 80-90%. The eco-system has changed. Like it or not slabs are a commodity and not just a card for a game, speaking TCG.

[f2tornado]

Originally Posted by The_Reverend

I have been saying this. Vendors are indeed going to have to change their percentages to get inventory. A few I watched have already increased their cash offers to 80-90%. The eco-system has changed. Like it or not slabs are a commodity and not just a card for a game, speaking TCG.

This has been going on for a couple years now. Now you have people setting up at shows with no cards and a wad of cash in a display case. That didn't exist on any scale several years ago. The marketplace is extremely competitive and liquid. This should be an overall positive. I certainly am not seeing any signs that the digital marketplace is hurting the card show experience.