2019-20 Topps Chrome UEFA Champions League Discussion

[hotcalsun]

Originally Posted by reddragonthe

I don't know if it has a TON to do with it, but it's a SNEAKY tough grade for the release. Haaland must have had a spot on the sheet right under some rollers as the surface issues exist on MANY of the copies (as reported and I've seen a fair number myself). We are seeing that in the pop report now.

Haaland
PSA 10 - 117 - 54%
PSA 9 - 79 - 36%
PSA 8 - 22 - 10%

"that's not bad... not everything is a 10, Red! Grades are tougher now!"

... which is all good, until you look at the Fati numbers from the same release...

Fati
PSA 10 - 365 - 87%
PSA 9 - 50 - 12%
PSA 8 - 3 - 2%
PSA 6 - 1 - 0%

These are INCREDIBLE numbers when you step back. First off, Fati subs have outstripped Haaland 2:1. By itself this is pretty fascinating. Even more so when human tendency given the value of Haaland right now would be to sub those MORE than Fati. So something else is at play. More Fatis produced? No. So must me more Fati that are grade worthy.

And then you look at what DOES get submitted and see the big discrepancy in gem rate. It extends to Refractor (smaller n but more dramatic differences between Haaland and Fati).

One possibility is people are submitting Haaland with min 9 or min 10. If surface issues are present that knock it to an 8 or lower they would not count in the pop report and thus the discrepancy in totals. This would further support your hypothesis that more Fati’s are grade worthy, even if the same amount were being submitted but not fully graded and in the pop report.

[Gin&Juice]

Part of the discrepancy in total number of submissions might be that Fati was outselling Haaland before he got hurt, so the early submissions that have now been graded might have skewed towards Fati. Doesn't explain the discrepancy in grades but may explain total numbers.

[reddragonthe]

Originally Posted by hotcalsun

One possibility is people are submitting Haaland with min 9 or min 10. If surface issues are present that knock it to an 8 or lower they would not count in the pop report and thus the discrepancy in totals. This would further support your hypothesis that more Fati’s are grade worthy, even if the same amount were being submitted but not fully graded and in the pop report.

Originally Posted by Gin&Juice

Part of the discrepancy in total number of submissions might be that Fati was outselling Haaland before he got hurt, so the early submissions that have now been graded might have skewed towards Fati. Doesn't explain the discrepancy in grades but may explain total numbers.

I like a combo of this as reasonable logic for why. The Haaland did lag behind for most of it... forgot about that because Fati has kinda been off the radar for a bit while he recovers from his 2nd, 3rd, 4th, or 8th knee procedure depending on which source you want to believe.

[reddragonthe]

Wait... cases up to 19k on BO? US dollars?

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

[estebahn73]

Originally Posted by estebahn73

I don't know who Court is and not sure what he has to do with the Soccer wax market.

Anyways, it looks like we are digressing here. The fact of the matter is Blowout cases are pretty good barometer for all the wax prices no matter how much they may be off vs. eBay here and there.

So if I have to adjust my previous comment to be more precise, I should say that the UEFA case price may not match that 17K but the spread between those cases should narrow. I would rather own UEFA case than the Bundi Case. If the Soccer market cools off Bundi case may come down to match UEFA but given the current rate I would think the UEFA would rise and Bundi will come down

I was very wrong on this one.... Bundi case is now $44.5K!!!! Wowsa

Well at least UEFA case is matching the Bundi case price as of Dec 2020!! LOL

[KhalDrogo]

Originally Posted by estebahn73

I was very wrong on this one.... Bundi case is now $44.5K!!!! Wowsa

Well at least UEFA case is matching the Bundi case price as of Dec 2020!! LOL

Bundi at $45k makes 2017 UEFA at $36k very, very cheap. There is absolutely no reason IMO why 2014 Prizm wax should outsell 2017 UEFA. Shorter checklist and less print run. Both first releases. And UEFA has Mbappe RCs.

[Gin&Juice]

Originally Posted by KhalDrogo

Bundi at $45k makes 2017 UEFA at $36k very, very cheap. There is absolutely no reason IMO why 2014 Prizm wax should outsell 2017 UEFA. Shorter checklist and less print run. Both first releases. And UEFA has Mbappe RCs.

Not sure it will withstand the test of time, but 2014 wasn't just the first Prizm release, it really was the first mainstream international soccer release and is largely responsible for the success of all the later products. I think its relevance to the hobby will always keep it near the top even if later products have comparable content.

[estebahn73]

Originally Posted by Gin&Juice

Not sure it will withstand the test of time, but 2014 wasn't just the first Prizm release, it really was the first mainstream international soccer release and is largely responsible for the success of all the later products. I think its relevance to the hobby will always keep it near the top even if later products have comparable content.

This^^^^^^^^ and it is a PANINI product. Topps to baseball is like Panini to Soccer

[KhalDrogo]

Originally Posted by Gin&Juice

Not sure it will withstand the test of time, but 2014 wasn't just the first Prizm release, it really was the first mainstream international soccer release and is largely responsible for the success of all the later products. I think its relevance to the hobby will always keep it near the top even if later products have comparable content.

How is it responsible for the success of other products? It was $2400 a case at Blowout last February. Messi Silver PSA 10 was available at $1k last March, and had sat unsold for a long time. Everything rose in parallel.

[Gin&Juice]

Originally Posted by KhalDrogo

How is it responsible for the success of other products? It was $2400 a case at Blowout last February. Messi Silver PSA 10 was available at $1k last March, and had sat unsold for a long time. Everything rose in parallel.

It opened the market. It’s success in 2014 led to Select being released and then more and more products. All of the guys now breaking soccer started with Prizm.

[KhalDrogo]

Originally Posted by Gin&Juice

It opened the market. It’s success in 2014 led to Select being released and then more and more products. All of the guys now breaking soccer started with Prizm.

Sure. But soccer wasn’t what anybody would consider successful until last spring. so it wasn’t 2014 Prizm that was responsible for that success.

[YayNJ]

Soccer cards "rebirth" wasn't anything to do with Soccer really either. Was it even reborn? It was doing alright.

It was the boom with Trae/Luka and the nitro of Ja/Zion, combined with Covid Boredom + the cancellation of Soccer, and then the Bundesliga restarting and the availability of the previously largely ignored Bundi Chrome. People were so starved for product AND sports people bought anything they could get their hands on that lit the touch paper.

Kai Havertz, Timo Werner and Jadon Sancho became the darlings of the hobby (despite being completely ignored in the previously released Donruss) and complete nobodies playing for German teams you've never heard of for silly prices flooded eBay, and here we are..

[Gin&Juice]

Originally Posted by KhalDrogo

Sure. But soccer wasn’t what anybody would consider successful until last spring. so it wasn’t 2014 Prizm that was responsible for that success.

The entire market has gone bat#$^& crazy in the past 18 months. In the pre-hysteria market, soccer was plenty successful. Breaks filled, product lines were expanding with the market supporting low, mid and high-end products, and ROI was better than most (if not all) other sports.

Without the popularity of 2014 Prizm, none of the other products would have been released. I don't mean to sound like a prizm disciple (I haven't opened any Prizm soccer product since 2018), but that 2014 release introduced a lot of folks to soccer collecting and really paved the way for all of the other major Panini/Topps products.

[Aultimate21]

Opened a box today, only one card worth mentioning but I’ll take it lol. Now to decide if I should open another or sell since prices have doubled.





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[dabearsv2]

Does anyone have a Chrome UEFA pack wrapper they could spare?

I need to send Topps a miscut card for (hopeful) replacement! I saved an empty box but had already tossed the wrappers out. I'm happy to compensate, although I have no idea what the usual cost is for such a "favor". Thank you!

[Elemin8]

Originally Posted by dabearsv2

Does anyone have a Chrome UEFA pack wrapper they could spare?

I need to send Topps a miscut card for (hopeful) replacement! I saved an empty box but had already tossed the wrappers out. I'm happy to compensate, although I have no idea what the usual cost is for such a "favor". Thank you!

Yup have some send me your details in PM

[gabe23]

Blowout is absurdly overpricing soccer wax and it is not a good thing! Even if you're sitting on some wax, you will not be able to sell at these prices. Sapphire yes because it is scarce but UCL chrome, no way! 24k/case? I bought 6 boxes on pre order for $275 total. This isn't cool anymore. I love soccer but how can you enjoy a rip or rip at these prices for profit after grading and all. Distributors and ebay follow blowout. This is a huge blow to the soccer market IMO.

[YayNJ]

Originally Posted by gabe23

Blowout is absurdly overpricing soccer wax and it is not a good thing! Even if you're sitting on some wax, you will not be able to sell at these prices. Sapphire yes because it is scarce but UCL chrome, no way! 24k/case? I bought 6 boxes on pre order for $275 total. This isn't cool anymore. I love soccer but how can you enjoy a rip or rip at these prices for profit after grading and all. Distributors and ebay follow blowout. This is a huge blow to the soccer market IMO.

lol, you new here buddy?

[gabe23]

Originally Posted by YayNJ

lol, you new here buddy?

Na. Not new at all just don't like what's going on in the market the past month. I saw this happen with modern basketball, LBJ, Kobe, MJ, baseball HOFers and now soccer. Not fun or cool. This isn't covid or stimulus checks. This is market manipulation by the big players. My distributors are part of the racket too. The big 3, distributors, Breakers!!!, Goldin, Ebay, Shillstein and PWCC all are a part of this. Thanks for contributing to the discussion tho.

[Archangel1775]

I would prefer the major sports open up licensing to meet demand. Increasing competition will benefit the consumer.

[reddragonthe]

Don't worry, looks like 2-3x as much (4k+ cases) of 20-21 UCL and maybe a 2nd SKU. Try to eat up some of that demand with increased supply.

[Qwkser]

Man I'm so glad my LCS didn't check recent comps on their product, got 3 hobby boxes for $640 per, of course the next day they doubled the price lol

[Elemin8]

Not sure if this sale is legit but do know that the condition on these cards are not the greatest so maybe that is starting to drive this up

https://www.ebay.ca/itm/164775189636


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