Observations on the current state of the hobby from a show this weekend

[Stifle]

Originally Posted by zakcollects

This has been the biggest struggle for me here in Canada with the hobby. It's one thing to buy a $5 USD card, it's another to pay $15 USD in shipping to make it a $20 card. Even seeing an Auction at an absolute steal because the card is going for $20 let's say instead of the $50 I'd expect still means I'm paying nearly that $50 to get it.

And then things like the Black November sale. 2022 Heritage High Number at that price? I'd consider it. $60 USD shipping for a couple boxes? But the LCS markup is about the same around here.

I can remember taking a trip to Texas from Michigan where at the airport I was asked about cards and how much I purchased them for during my return flight ? Not sure if the TSA agent didn’t realize that Michigan is a State? I could be wrong but I understand that traveling to Indiana which borders Michigan to purchase tobacco products to be brought back over the border is “illegal ? or shunned ? I don’t smoke” but to buy gas and groceries is welcomed.

I’ve done multiple purchases from Canadian shops that had to have the additional charges tacked on. I understand why the transaction will have the additional charge, hence I tend to only buy in a selected bulk lot once in a great while. Wish there could be a trade avenue through customs that allows those in the States to trade cards that would sell easier in Canada for cards that I collect that are stationary in football boxes from Canadian LCS or dealers/collectors. Just seems that by trading it would allow more revenue to be attained for each side?

[solt0131]

One thing I will report here is there much less dealer to dealer transactions now than I ever remember before. Friday from 10-1 used to be crazy. That portion is way down.

[ScooterD]

Originally Posted by solt0131

One thing I will report here is there much less dealer to dealer transactions now than I ever remember before. Friday from 10-1 used to be crazy. That portion is way down.

Likely because half of the dealers are old school and the other half jumped in at high prices during the COVID boom. Those two groups aren’t going to meet on many price agreements

[ThoseBackPages]

any images?

[itsbaytime]

If Elon Musk can't sell Teslas he will stop making them,
If McDonald's can't sell cheeseburgers they will stop selling them.
If UPS loses money on every delivery they will stop delivering items.
What kind of nonsense is this?

PS Fanatics is in it for the money. Think they will lose money next year?

Originally Posted by hermanotarjeta

Yeah, most hobbyists wouldn't be doing this if there was no money to be made.

The only reason any card show dealers would buy something from you is if they can make money off of it.

If they can't make money off the cards you bring them, they will not buy them.

If flippers can't sell their cards, they will buy less cards.

If collectors refuse to pay high prices for cards, prices will go down.

And the cycle continues.

The CEO of JP Morgan bank forsees a recession coming next year.

If you are in this hobby for the money, it won't be very fun next year, either.

Hobbyist numbers will continue to decline. That means less fools to buy your hot potato.

[Triple B]

Originally Posted by pezzicle

ya ive started to notice this as well which makes shows more of a frustration then anything. The most frustrating part is I am in Canada and a lot of the cards I want are certainly available on eBay in the US, but it costs me $20 to ship, 13% tax at checkout and then an additional 20% on duty. a $500 card quickly becomes a $700 purchase :/

Originally Posted by zakcollects

This has been the biggest struggle for me here in Canada with the hobby. It's one thing to buy a $5 USD card, it's another to pay $15 USD in shipping to make it a $20 card. Even seeing an Auction at an absolute steal because the card is going for $20 let's say instead of the $50 I'd expect still means I'm paying nearly that $50 to get it.

And then things like the Black November sale. 2022 Heritage High Number at that price? I'd consider it. $60 USD shipping for a couple boxes? But the LCS markup is about the same around here.

I'm in Toronto and Get It Shipped International has been a Godsend. I buy what I want and accumulate it in an account in Vermont and they ship it all to me when I'm ready. There's a shared Google drive that they scan your items into so you can see what's there. No more $15 an item shipping. They FedEx it to you for like $60US.

[hermanotarjeta]

Originally Posted by itsbaytime

If Elon Musk can't sell Teslas he will stop making them,
If McDonald's can't sell cheeseburgers they will stop selling them.
If UPS loses money on every delivery they will stop delivering items.
What kind of nonsense is this?

PS Fanatics is in it for the money. Think they will lose money next year?

Are you in the hobby for the money?

Good luck!

[mfw13]

The canary in the coal mine will be Leaf....as long as people are buying their unlicensed crap, you'll know the hobby is still reasonably healthy.

Likewise with Upper Deck being able to stay in business selling mostly hockey cards.

They're the two weakest manufacturers financially.

[solt0131]

Geoff Wilson here set up at the buying HQ station.

[JohnnyAppleseed]

Originally Posted by mfw13

The canary in the coal mine will be Leaf....as long as people are buying their unlicensed crap, you'll know the hobby is still reasonably healthy.

Likewise with Upper Deck being able to stay in business selling mostly hockey cards.

They're the two weakest manufacturers financially.

Upper Deck will have no issues this year on account of one Connor Bedard.

[solt0131]

Friday update - sales have been slow for me and all the other dealers that I talked too. Seems like attendance for a Friday here is way down. The vibe that I’m getting is people just aren’t spending money. Looks like total of 300 booths and about that many individual dealers. Guys I’ve talked to said Friday sales are down. No real buzz like there used to be.

[cstan]

Their saving it all for Strongsville on Sunday

Originally Posted by solt0131

Friday update - sales have been slow for me and all the other dealers that I talked too. Seems like attendance for a Friday here is way down. The vibe that I’m getting is people just aren’t spending money. Looks like total of 300 booths and about that many individual dealers. Guys I’ve talked to said Friday sales are down. No real buzz like there used to be.

[cholodolo]

Originally Posted by MiamiMarlinsFan

What made you think the post was about hermano? Me and hermano are cool.

Your post would have been in the "someone else" category..unless I misunderstood, but it seemed like you and others were diminishing the opinions and experiences of those you may disagree with. If I'm wrong, please let me know what your intentions were with that post.

Originally Posted by hammerva

I really don't want to play in this game this childish game that has been on the last 2 or 3 pages but not sure how my comment can done without being even a little passive aggressive. Unless the purpose of this thread is to make people actually not want to collect cards anymore and make you feel stupid for it. Sorry I have seen this type of stuff for over 3 decades and frankly it has never really worked

Just cover your eyes and ears if you don't like what the adults are discussing. Nobody is discouraging collecting in this thread; quite the opposite if you are paying attention.

[MiamiMarlinsFan]

Originally Posted by cholodolo

Your post would have been in the "someone else" category..unless I misunderstood, but it seemed like you and others were diminishing the opinions and experiences of those you may disagree with. If I'm wrong, please let me know what your intentions were with that post.

Some people give post-show reports like they were an omnipresent being floating above the expo floor. It’s funny. I’ll continue to call people out for it.

I love the report solt0132 just gave us. It was what he saw and experienced and he didn’t make any sweeping “state of the market” proclamations from it. I come to this thread for those kind of posts. Keep it up, solt!

As far hermano specifically, not only do I not have any beef with him, I think he contributes more to making this an interesting place than a lot of people here. He likes to state opinions as facts sometimes, and we’ll disagree on things, but we also find common ground occasionally. He never name-calls or loses his temper. He’s been in this game a long time and knows way more than me. So I learn things from him from time to time! He’s good with me. He’s a grown man who doesn’t need other people “coming to his defense” over perceived slights.

[cholodolo]

Originally Posted by MiamiMarlinsFan

Some people give post-show reports like they were an omnipresent being floating above the expo floor. It’s funny. I’ll continue to call people out for it.

I love the report solt0132 just gave us. It was what he saw and experienced and he didn’t make any sweeping “state of the market” proclamations from it. I come to this thread for those kind of posts. Keep it up, solt!

As far hermano specifically, not only do I not have any beef with him, I think he contributes more to making this an interesting place than a lot of people here. He likes to state opinions as facts sometimes, and we’ll disagree on things, but we also find common ground occasionally. He never name-calls or loses his temper. He’s good with me. He’s a grown man who doesn’t need other people “coming to his defense” over perceived slights.

I mean, and is your right -- doesn't mean those posts were not passive aggressive.

I wasn't coming to hermano's defense, specifically; moreso defending dissenting viewpoints in the thread from the rainbows and butterflies crowd (hermano just happened to have kicked the beehive with his report). I have no basis to claim he was lying; but others thought they did. It's not "negative" to discuss the expected downturn in interest and pricing.

Solt's review would be considered negative by many who frequent this thread, and it was anything but that. I'm sure you can see that perspective.

[MiamiMarlinsFan]

Originally Posted by cholodolo

I mean, and is your right -- doesn't mean those posts were not passive aggressive.

I wasn't coming to hermano's defense, specifically; moreso defending dissenting viewpoints in the thread from the rainbows and butterflies crowd (hermano just happened to have kicked the beehive with his report). I have no basis to claim he was lying; but others thought they did. It's not "negative" to discuss the expected downturn in interest and pricing.

Solt's review would be considered negative by many who frequent this thread, and it was anything but that. I'm sure you can see that perspective.

I try to see as many perspectives as possible.

I also like theshowandme’s reports. Especially since he’s more about vintage cards, which is any area I know nothing about, even though I love baseball history. This thread has value to me since I don’t go to any card shows.

[theshowandme]

I bought some cards in Philly on day 1

Curious what tomorrow brings

[cholodolo]

Originally Posted by MiamiMarlinsFan

I try to see as many perspectives as possible.

I also like theshowandme’s reports. Especially since he’s more about vintage cards, which is any area I know nothing about, even though I love baseball history. This thread has value to me since I don’t go to any card shows.

Exactly, my brother in cards. No matter if I disagree, I like to see what people are reporting from all corners of the hobby.

[MiamiMarlinsFan]

Originally Posted by theshowandme

I bought some cards in Philly on day 1

Curious what tomorrow brings

That Campy!

[notfast]

Typical Friday crowd IMO. Maybe a bit light. Modern dealer I talked too said show was starting off well. Vintage guys a bit slower.

Vintage guys really need to adjust their prices. With so many auctions running all the time, you really need something unique to ask what some of these guys are asking.

[ThoseBackPages]

CAMPY!!!!!!

[PuddleMonkey]

Can only speak for myself but I'm starting to find things a bit easier and for less than before. More of my mediocre offers are being accepted.

[theshowandme]

“As soon as they say ‘the last one sold for’ I try to kill the transaction”

-Dealer

[ddearing]

Originally Posted by ThoseBackPages

CAMPY!!!!!!

I held that Campy in my hands today and loved it, but apparently, TSAM was more pleased with the Walsh. A cool lime Green background version. I defer to his expertise and am a great fan of his taste.

I was surprised some, but very happy with the show today from a dealer perspective. With the market and holidays, I came to the show with the expectation of lots of buying from customers and minimal sales. The opposite was true today. Solid sales throughout the day and, buying was not as good as I had hoped. I did pick up a couple "high end" cards (in the 1-3K range) that I am happy to have, but not the bulk of cards I can usually buy. I was constantly busy enough that I never got a chance to price the wax I brought and get it out on the table, so that is tonights job in the hotel.

While not anywhere close to the most expensive card I bought today, my favorite was an old school Rookies and Stars Bob Cousy on fabric auto.

My favorite sale of the day was a 1/1 Edgar Martinez Topps Museum Metal Frame auto to a guy who PC's Edgar and specifically hunts down any and every 1/xx card and has a huge collection. I sold it to him under comps because it is refreshing to have a card like that end up in its rightful home. My PC is also specific serial number cards and I know that it is almost impossible to find them in person.

Lots of fun today. Looking forward to tomorrow.

[majestik101]

Originally Posted by theshowandme

“As soon as they say ‘the last one sold for’ I try to kill the transaction”

-Dealer

The author of my auto signature!