Topps 582 Montgomery Club

[kcip]

Originally Posted by mossoholic

Here is what really sucks. Most of these 1 box max for MC members will be 3-5 or maybe unlimited for the public sales. MC members will lose money buying on MC because of the shipping fees for way less boxes. On a ton of releases this year you will lose money buying on MC versus ones that are easy to get during the public sale.

The amount of time I save not having to guess when a drop occurs far outweighs the additional $50–$100 I’ll spend on shipping costs throughout the year.

[ThoseBackPages]

Originally Posted by ndwatso

Last year it had 100 rcs or vets and 150 prospects.

but i think last year, the Prospects were numbered on their own

[ndwatso]

As a white sox fan, yay.....but really...
93RA-YM Yermin Mercedes Chicago White Sox® Rookie

here are the other rookie autos:
93RA-AB Alec Bohm Philadelphia Phillies® Rookie
93RA-AV Andrew Vaughn Chicago White Sox® Rookie
93RA-JK Jarred Kelenic Seattle Mariners™ Rookie
93RA-KH Ke’Bryan Hayes Pittsburgh Pirates® Rookie
93RA-RM Ryan Mountcastle Baltimore Orioles® Rookie

[htn315]

Originally Posted by ThoseBackPages

but i think last year, the Prospects were numbered on their own

Looks like the prospects are subset in the base set this year, first 2 years, they were their own insert set. So I would assume Beckett will mark these as RC's as well since they're giving the Bowman's Best ones the same designation.

[auctionjmm]

Originally Posted by ThoseBackPages

i am hearing that the set is numbered #1 - 250 this year

if that is true, we'll have 150 brand new RCs in it

Good. The more they do this, the more you'll get over it and the novelty will wear off. You'll spend the rest of your life chasing down junk rookie cards from junk products that nobody will care about. Best way to correct the BB situation? Repeat it over and over and over again to the point where the definition of rookie will have to change to avoid embarrassment. This is a sure fire way to get even Beckett to reconsider their designations. And likely many long time collectors as well.

[koneil]

It'd be an objectively awful decision for Beckett to mark the prospect subset as RC's but they cornered themselves into doing it right? Either backtrack their criteria they spent the last week flaunting or mark down 150 prospects as having their true RC's in Bowman Heritage. Amazing development

[ThoseBackPages]

Originally Posted by auctionjmm

Good. The more they do this, the more you'll get over it and the novelty will wear off. You'll spend the rest of your life chasing down junk rookie cards from junk products that nobody will care about. Best way to correct the BB situation? Repeat it over and over and over again to the point where the definition of rookie will have to change to avoid embarrassment. This is a sure fire way to get even Beckett to reconsider their designations. And likely many long time collectors as well.

as a 40 year RC collector, not sure what there is to "get over"

i understand your point though, as you use this hobby to make money.

[mossoholic]

Originally Posted by kcip

The amount of time I save not having to guess when a drop occurs far outweighs the additional $50–$100 I’ll spend on shipping costs throughout the year.

We aren't talking about product that sells out in less than an hour. Was it worth that time you saved on All Star Cup? Anyone that says yes is lying or an idiot.

[Bob Ross]

Originally Posted by jusdukky

Get back to painting and working on your fro Bob. We know how you feel about the club!!

[ndwatso]

Originally Posted by auctionjmm

Good. The more they do this, the more you'll get over it and the novelty will wear off. You'll spend the rest of your life chasing down junk rookie cards from junk products that nobody will care about. Best way to correct the BB situation? Repeat it over and over and over again to the point where the definition of rookie will have to change to avoid embarrassment. This is a sure fire way to get even Beckett to reconsider their designations. And likely many long time collectors as well.

Agreed...

It all boils down to what we as collectors value as that persons rookie card. Heck, if we wanted to as a community we could say only cards that have their entire first full season stats would count, and if we value the cards that way, then that is what it is.

I'd love to see the community value "retirement" cards. A players last season that has all of their stats on the back with maybe the exception of the last year.

[htn315]

Originally Posted by koneil

It'd be an objectively awful decision for Beckett to mark the prospect subset as RC's but they cornered themselves into doing it right? Either backtrack their criteria they spent the last week flaunting or mark down 150 prospects as having their true RC's in Bowman Heritage. Amazing development

These might be XRC since they're an online exclusive and not available in the traditional distribution channels. Either way collect what you like, I'm an 80's kid so I'm going to grab a few.

[auctionjmm]

Originally Posted by ThoseBackPages

as a 40 year RC collector, not sure what there is to "get over"

i understand your point though, as you use this hobby to make money.

Get over the idea that there is only ONE definition of a rookie and that it cannot change, as if it were handed down from God himself.

Honest question, as a true collector of rookies, would it even bring you joy to only have Bowman's Best or Bowman Heritage as options for rookies? Say Topps/Fanatics does this next year too. Would you even enjoy the hobby?

Money has nothing to do with it. I would bet you any amount of it that this product or Bowman's Best wouldn't move the needle a smidge on future years of flagship.

This is about common sense. You do not have common sense if you are willing to accept 150 prospect cards as "rookies" because of a number on the back. Beckett would not have common sense if they designated them as such.

[Shankweather]

Originally Posted by htn315

These might be XRC since they're an online exclusive and not available in the traditional distribution channels. Either way collect what you like, I'm an 80's kid so I'm going to grab a few.

It had official RCs in the 2020 set.

[ThoseBackPages]

Originally Posted by auctionjmm

Get over the idea that there is only ONE definition of a rookie and that it cannot change, as if it were handed down from God himself.

Honest question, as a true collector of rookies, would it even bring you joy to only have Bowman's Best or Bowman Heritage as options for rookies? Say Topps/Fanatics does this next year too. Would you even enjoy the hobby?

Money has nothing to do with it. I would bet you any amount of it that this product or Bowman's Best wouldn't move the needle a smidge on future years of flagship.

This is about common sense. You do not have common sense if you are willing to accept 150 prospect cards as "rookies" because of a number on the back. Beckett would not have common sense if they designated them as such.

that is your opinion, and you are entitled to it for sure!

this is classic though! "Money has nothing to do with it. I would bet you any amount of it"

[htn315]

Originally Posted by Shankweather

It had official RCs in the 2020 set.

They're just breaking their own rules but it doesn't matter either way. Will be fun to look back in 10 years to see if these 2021 "rookies" carry a premium.

[Archangel1775]

All Fanatics would have to do is say that they are all Uncorrected Errors (UER) and should have been numbered differently. Everything goes back to normal.

[Shankweather]

Originally Posted by auctionjmm

Get over the idea that there is only ONE definition of a rookie and that it cannot change, as if it were handed down from God himself.

Honest question, as a true collector of rookies, would it even bring you joy to only have Bowman's Best or Bowman Heritage as options for rookies? Say Topps/Fanatics does this next year too. Would you even enjoy the hobby?

Money has nothing to do with it. I would bet you any amount of it that this product or Bowman's Best wouldn't move the needle a smidge on future years of flagship.

This is about common sense. You do not have common sense if you are willing to accept 150 prospect cards as "rookies" because of a number on the back. Beckett would not have common sense if they designated them as such.

Even if you subscribe to the traditional RC definition, there's no reason to ignore 2022 now. If you want to collect Wander, of course you're going to pick up every 2022 "RC" you can get your hands on. They're still going to sell for a premium. I think the outcome of this is 2021 Bowman's Best will be worth a lot more, with little effect on 2022 or future years.

As far as the PSA registry goes, I think they will create registries for the "RC" years of these players even though they're not true RCs. So for that corner of the hobby, the chase is still on.

It wasn't that long ago that sets full of prospects, years away from reaching MLB, had official RCs in them. From 1991 to 2005 that was the norm. I don't know if it was common sense or not.

[jszczech]

Well my last 5 rookie cup boxes showed up today. 3 redemption out five boxes but that wasn't a bad thing this time.

Autos were
Andres Gimenez base
Lewin Diaz Gold/50

Redemption were:
Jazz Chisholm
Eloy Jimenez Orange/25
and
Mike Trout Orange/25

Also hit an Andrew Vaughn Orange parallel/25 and Juan Soto Black parallel/10.

All will be available

[pskell02]

Just opened my 2 boxes. For the original price these are decent, but not the best results.

Box 1
Orlando Cepeda 46/50
Tanner Houck Auto
Cristian Javier Auto

Box 2
CC Sabathia 3/99
Evan White Auto

Also got a Trout and Vlad Jr. AS RC in box 2 as well as the worst possible variation in Gary Tempelton...

[auctionjmm]

Originally Posted by Shankweather

Even if you subscribe to the traditional RC definition, there's no reason to ignore 2022 now. If you want to collect Wander, of course you're going to pick up every 2022 "RC" you can get your hands on. They're still going to sell for a premium. I think the outcome of this is 2021 Bowman's Best will be worth a lot more, with little effect on 2022 or future years.

As far as the PSA registry goes, I think they will create registries for the "RC" years of these players even though they're not true RCs. So for that corner of the hobby, the chase is still on.

It wasn't that long ago that sets full of prospects, years away from reaching MLB, had official RCs in them. From 1991 to 2005 that was the norm. I don't know if it was common sense or not.

You are absolutely right about the value, the chase, etc. of 2022 and beyond. I'm just imagining, if I am lucky enough to live another 40 years, reading some article about the 100 most iconic rookie cards of all time and 27 of them are from a 2021 online release that were meant to be prospects but were defined by grading companies as rookies and featured a throwback 1993 design. YUCK! It just doesn't seem like that would be any fun.

Also, there were only 794 cases of Bowman Heritage produced last year. So 150 rookies limited to 794 cases. Ehh...some will say that's amazing because the one and only rookie of [Insert Name Here] was in a product that nobody could get more than one box of. Or does common sense prevail and the hobby decides we aren't going to blow years and years of rookie cards over a card number? I don't know really.

I guess we'll find out if Bowman Heritage was actually numbered this way or not, and then the community will decide is this a $1,000 box of cards loaded with decades of rookies, or just another asterisk in the history books.

[Archimedes]

Originally Posted by auctionjmm

I guess we'll find out if Bowman Heritage was actually numbered this way or not, and then the community will decide is this a $1,000 box of cards loaded with decades of rookies, or just another asterisk in the history books.

This is the bottom line. The market will tell us what the rookie card is, and I think commonsense will prevail. There are some who will disagree with the market's assessment, but that doesn't matter. Some folks have strict definitions of what a rookie card is, and that's totally fine. They might be frustrated, and I get that. The rest of us are just along for the ride.

[Timsterino]

What’s interesting to me is how these discussions are a mirror of modern life. Many people believe that traditions are something to follow while many others believe that you can do whatever you feel if it suits your purpose. It’s definitely a very modern discussion.

[ctcardexchange]

Originally Posted by ThoseBackPages

i am hearing that the set is numbered #1 - 250 this year

if that is true, we'll have 150 brand new RCs in it

Prospects are 101-250. Vets and rookies are 1-100. Checklist is up
https://www.topps.com/media/pdf/2021...echecklist.pdf

[ThoseBackPages]

Originally Posted by ctcardexchange

Prospects are 101-250. Vets and rookies are 1-100. Checklist is up
https://www.topps.com/media/pdf/2021...echecklist.pdf

waiting to see the card backs, but its looking like 150 more RCs for sure

[ctcardexchange]

Originally Posted by ThoseBackPages

waiting to see the card backs, but its looking like 150 more RCs for sure

53 RCs

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