The Worst PSA Failure Yet? (Another Recolored PSA 6 PWCC/Moser 1948 Leaf Jackie)

[auburn35]

Nice catch. Would be helpful if PSA and PWCC (not worthy of the buyback program?) were as observant.
Doubt this is a self-healing, Wolverine edition Jackie Robinson.

[corndog]

Originally Posted by pip

This grading example by PSA "experts" is indefensible.

Embarrassingly Inept or corrupt are the only two possibilities.

[pip]

Originally Posted by corndog

This grading example by PSA "experts" is indefensible.

Embarrassingly Inept or corrupt are the only two possibilities.

It does reveal something very important about the grading process, however. PSA graders must look at every card from a distance of 15 feet or greater because when I look at a picture of the card from 14 feet away, I can still see the spot where they colored in Robinson's cheek with a gray crayon.

[mgugs46]

Originally Posted by corndog

This grading example by PSA "experts" is indefensible.

Embarrassingly Inept or corrupt are the only two possibilities.

It is corrupt - no one could be this bad consistently at missing obvious alterations.

When nearly all of these alterations that get through are from the same big time subbers, it really should not be that hard to see what is going on here.

A shame, because while for some higher end vintage cards you want to grab something slabbed, but at this point, you really cannot trust that it is good just because it is slabbed.

[CaptSpaulding]

Now that this embarrassment been brought back into the marketplace has it been brought to Heritage's attention?

[CaptSpaulding]

I just brought this thread to the attention of someone at Heritage. The card will be addressed.

[MoreToppsPlease]

Originally Posted by mgugs46

It is corrupt - no one could be this bad consistently at missing obvious alterations.

When nearly all of these alterations that get through are from the same big time subbers, it really should not be that hard to see what is going on here.

A shame, because while for some higher end vintage cards you want to grab something slabbed, but at this point, you really cannot trust that it is good just because it is slabbed.

I propose another alternative: grading is what it is, and that people should just recognize and understand what they’re paying for when they submit to any grading company: a flawed service.

What is of paramount importance in all of these threads about TPG negligence, incompetence, corruption and fraud REALLY is: why are people paying the premiums they do for this deeply flawed service over ungraded cards?

Establishing how the MARKET is set for graded cards will be much more scary than establishing how corrupt and inept grading companies are in assigning a number to a label.

[mfw13]

Originally Posted by mgugs46

It is corrupt - no one could be this bad consistently at missing obvious alterations.

When nearly all of these alterations that get through are from the same big time subbers, it really should not be that hard to see what is going on here.

A shame, because while for some higher end vintage cards you want to grab something slabbed, but at this point, you really cannot trust that it is good just because it is slabbed.

Actually, based on what is known about PSA's hiring & training, and the grading process itself (i.e. that graders are given only 30-45 seconds to examine each card), it's not surprising at all.

The grading process is like a conveyor belt....and PSA makes it's money on volume, not accuracy.

If you're some poorly trained, underpaid grader who is expected to look at 500 cards a day, heck yeah you're going to make a lot of mistakes.

[CaptSpaulding]

Originally Posted by mfw13

Actually, based on what is known about PSA's hiring & training, and the grading process itself (i.e. that graders are given only 30-45 seconds to examine each card), it's not surprising at all.

The grading process is like a conveyor belt....and PSA makes it's money on volume, not accuracy.

If you're some poorly trained, underpaid grader who is expected to look at 500 cards a day, heck yeah you're going to make a lot of mistakes.

A card like this gets more than 30 - 45 seconds but yes in general you are correct it is about processing as much as possible as efficiently as possible.

Something like this is not a mistake. Anyone with some grading experience, 1 eye and a halogen light would be able to see instantly there is a problem with recoloring. This one did not even need 10 seconds to be rejected at least based on the scan.

[mfw13]

Originally Posted by CaptSpaulding

A card like this gets more than 30 - 45 seconds but yes in general you are correct it is about processing as much as possible as efficiently as possible.

Something like this is not a mistake. Anyone with some grading experience, 1 eye and a halogen light would be able to see instantly there is a problem with recoloring. This one did not even need 10 seconds to be rejected at least based on the scan.

Agreed.....assuming the grader is knowledgeable about the hobby, has been trained properly and knows what to look for.

All of which are big question marks given how secretive PSA is....

[Pink Pussycat]

Originally Posted by mfw13

Agreed.....assuming the grader is knowledgeable about the hobby, has been trained properly and knows what to look for.

All of which are big question marks given how secretive PSA is....

Agree with PSA being secretive to the point of criminality.

Disagree with the part in bold. Any novice collector (who has never ever graded a card) would be able to see the fake coloring, mismatched surface texture and blatant alteration.

Someone who grades cards for a living would never in a million years miss this. It had to be intentional.

[CaptSpaulding]

Originally Posted by mfw13

Agreed.....assuming the grader is knowledgeable about the hobby, has been trained properly and knows what to look for.

All of which are big question marks given how secretive PSA is....

Given the sheer volume of cards identified here as being altered (with before and after picture comparison) really makes you pause how this is at all possible. Does it come down to a coin flip, who submitted it, a wild guess or just absolute inability?

And for every one identified here I see many more, based on scans, which appear to be altered. It is one thing to not be perfect at your job but this takes it to a whole other level. And PSA is not alone. SGC and Beckett have more than their share of altered cards in their holders.

[MoreToppsPlease]

Originally Posted by CaptSpaulding

Given the sheer volume of cards identified here as being altered (with before and after picture comparison) really makes you pause how this is at all possible. Does it come down to a coin flip, who submitted it, a wild guess or just absolute inability?

And for every one identified here I see many more, based on scans, which appear to be altered. It is one thing to not be perfect at your job but this takes it to a whole other level. And PSA is not alone. SGC and Beckett have more than their share of altered cards in their holders.

The sheer number of cards a single grader sees every hour, day and week would drive normal people nuts. How could anyone keep their focus for a reasonable length of time?!

I’m expecting to see a grader going postal at a grading facility on the news in the near future.

[CaptSpaulding]

Originally Posted by MoreToppsPlease

The sheer number of cards a single grader sees every hour, day and week would drive normal people nuts. How could anyone keep their focus for a reasonable length of time?!

I’m expecting to see a grader going postal at a grading facility on the news in the near future.

And imagine coming in every day knowing what you will ship out each day will be half of what came in as new orders.

[MoreToppsPlease]

Originally Posted by CaptSpaulding

And imagine coming in every day knowing what you will ship out each day will be half of what came in as new orders.

So many altered cards!

[Bruins1993]

"recolored
The art of fraudulently recoloring the surface of a sports card to hide wear or physical damage."
https://www.psacard.com/resources/lingo

'48 Leaf Robinson in EX-MT 6 has a PSA Price Guide value of $35,000...
https://www.psacard.com/smrpriceguid...1948-leaf/1115


"Never get cheated", right Nat?

[pspa123]

It's also disconcerting to know major auction houses give absolutely no scrutiny to cards even those known to be major targets for alteration such as 48 Leaf Jackies. And would it surprise anyone if this card was consigned by someone with a doubtful reputation?

[MoreToppsPlease]

Originally Posted by pspa123

It's also disconcerting to know major auction houses give absolutely no scrutiny to cards even those known to be major targets for alteration such as 48 Leaf Jackies. And would it surprise anyone if this card was consigned by someone with a doubtful reputation?

Their primary job is to get top dollar for whatever they’re selling. They’re selling slabs.

PSA’s job is to make their slabs more expensive.

In either case, cards aren’t of primary importance.

[Vintage Collector]

When and how does.all this thievery end?? Will grading companies ever be held accountable? Even when they collude with former employees? This is nothing short of fraud and grand theft. Not happy with the current system.

[CaptSpaulding]

Originally Posted by pspa123

It's also disconcerting to know major auction houses give absolutely no scrutiny to cards even those known to be major targets for alteration such as 48 Leaf Jackies. And would it surprise anyone if this card was consigned by someone with a doubtful reputation?

It was sold by PWCC in 2016. I suspect it was to an unsuspecting collector but who knows. Not sure if earlier in this thread the ID of the buyer as determined. It is possible the consignor is an innocent which might be why it was not scrutinized.

I still cannot wrap my head around how something this obvious got past grading. Seems absolutely impossible to miss if you even are glancing at the card with the intent to assess it.

[pspa123]

Originally Posted by CaptSpaulding

It was sold by PWCC in 2016. I suspect it was to an unsuspecting collector but who knows. Not sure if earlier in this thread the ID of the buyer as determined. It is possible the consignor is an innocent which might be why it was not scrutinized.

I still cannot wrap my head around how something this obvious got past grading. Seems absolutely impossible to miss if you even are glancing at the card with the intent to assess it.

Perhaps, but I would think whoever consigned it an AH would take at least a glancing look in this toxic environment at a 48L Jackie, the poster child for whacked cards.

[MoreToppsPlease]

Originally Posted by pspa123

Perhaps, but I would think whoever consigned it an AH would take at least a glancing look in this toxic environment at a 48L Jackie, the poster child for whacked cards.

The influx of naive and newb buyers out there makes it almost impossible for these guys to want to conduct due diligence. The real collectors should already know to stay away at this point.

[CaptSpaulding]

Originally Posted by pspa123

Perhaps, but I would think whoever consigned it an AH would take at least a glancing look in this toxic environment at a 48L Jackie, the poster child for whacked cards.

That assumes that we are actually in an environment where there is an incentive to take bad cards off of the market. If the grading companies are not buying back cards how far should the AH go?

If an AH turns away a consignment there are dozens of others who would take that consignment.

If the TPG made the mess they should clean it up. Then let it be their burden to sue the submitter. Their passing the buck is total horse sh!t.

[Bruins1993]

Originally Posted by CaptSpaulding

If the TPG made the mess they should clean it up.

Clearly you haven't been drinking enough PSA Kool-Aid while Steve Sloan shows you his childhood card collection...

[Rlessary]

Originally Posted by pip

Same halftone pattern. Same color. Uncanny. It's almost as if they got ahold of the original printing plates and printing press that Leaf used in 1949. The entire hobby is in grave danger with this type of calculated precision in baseball card alteration:

I am surprised they didn't notice the FUPA he had surgically attached to his face.