MUST READ TRIMMING THREAD: COMC- HawkDynasty,cccardfactory,LORDSTANLEY2012|PWCC|ih8ca

[luckyduck]

HawkDynasty has an interesting business model, at least in part--he'll frequently have between five and fifteen copies of low end PSA 10s for big rookies for rock bottom prices. I wondered how that worked, who was flipping to him for no money at all. It's a lot more likely they're just purchased raw and trimmed.

[3124508 on COMC]

Originally Posted by palmetto7

I'm beginning to think there is a secretive meeting every year like a G8 for all these clowns....PSA..bgs...Moser...comc...pwcc...etc etc

Sent from my SM-G950U1 using Tapatalk

It’s only for three and four letter acronym businesses.

[ucLAkers]

So as a BO community...what can WE do to start getting this hobby back on course? Should we start an anti grading campaign and make every card moving forward stamped? Whats the end goal?

[pip]

Originally Posted by ih8ca

I have a meeting next Thursday at COMC to discuss a buyback program for cards in question. Hopefully I can home some concrete answers and a plan by the end of the week.

Why not just publish a list of what you know to be trimmed? Is it because of the sheer enormity of it all? What percentage have you trimmed/altered? 75% 80% 90%? All of them?

[dustin42]

Originally Posted by ucLAkers

So as a BO community...what can WE do to start getting this hobby back on course? Should we start an anti grading campaign and make every card moving forward stamped? Whats the end goal?

Just don't be a rat and report rats would do the trick.

[SaveMeTheGum]

Geez... those are some of the big boys on COMC. It's starting to feel like there are more trimmers than there are anti-trimmers...

[T206Collector]

Originally Posted by palmetto7

I'm beginning to think there is a secretive meeting every year like a G8 for all these clowns....PSA..bgs...Moser...comc...pwcc...etc etc

Sent from my SM-G950U1 using Tapatalk

There is a trained craft here — if you accept grading companies are not actually in on the fraud. Someone has discovered or developed a way to micro trim cards in a way that PSA and Beckett will accept as not trimmed. And that information has been shared over and over until finally there is a critical mass of garbage finally being discovered. Eventually the stain trickles down to every corner of the hobby, and reaches all cards — raw or graded, whether trimmed or not.

[3124508 on COMC]

Originally Posted by pip

Why not just publish a list of what you know to be trimmed? Is it because of the sheer enormity of it all? What percentage have you trimmed/altered? 75% 80% 90%? All of them?

It would likely be every card that went through his receiving warehouse....or every card he received.

[IronMonkey415]

That scum is not meeting anyone.

MODERATOR!!! May I call him scum? Remember I only do name calling toward suspicious people.

[3124508 on COMC]

Originally Posted by T206Collector

There is a trained craft here — if you accept grading companies are not actually in on the fraud. Someone has discovered or developed a way to micro trim cards in a way that PSA and Beckett will accept as not trimmed. And that information has been shared over and over until finally there is a critical mass of garbage finally being discovered. Eventually the stain trickles down to every corner of the hobby, and reaches all cards — raw or graded, whether trimmed or not.

None of the cards in this thread are micro trimmed. These are low-quality hack jobs through and through. Tons of stock removed. Kevin Burge is a good trimmer. This is bush league stuff here.

[dustin42]

Originally Posted by luckyduck

HawkDynasty has an interesting business model, at least in part--he'll frequently have between five and fifteen copies of low end PSA 10s for big rookies for rock bottom prices. I wondered how that worked, who was flipping to him for no money at all. It's a lot more likely they're just purchased raw and trimmed.

That is exactly what he did.

[dustin42]

Originally Posted by dustin42

That is exactly what he did.

Or when the cards that have small corner dings are pressed into a TPG holder the ding isn't noticeable.

[3124508 on COMC]

Left edge trimmed. Bottom edge trimmed a bit as well. Reference black mark to show bottom edge trimming.

https://www.comc.com/Cards/Baseball/..._Ryan/10872567
https://www.comc.com/Cards/Baseball/...7/Graded/PSA/9

[T206Collector]

Originally Posted by SaveMeTheGum

It's starting to feel like there are more trimmers than there are anti-trimmers...

To those of you who are still buying graded cards — whatever confidence you may still have, the confidence that a growing number of us have hopelessly lost will only continue to weaken.

As prices soften, understand that this is not a buying opportunity. This is the sound of a bubble bursting. Don’t be the last one standing when the music stops playing.

[T206Collector]

Originally Posted by 3124508 on COMC

None of the cards in this thread are micro trimmed. These are low-quality hack jobs through and through. Tons of stock removed. Kevin Burge is a good trimmer. This is bush league stuff here.

Maybe I was giving the graders the benefit of the doubt. Obviously me being too generous.

If bush league stuff is getting through, then the proliferation of this issue truly is still only being discovered.

[Rooftop]

What’s the odds this guy comes clean and becomes the Canseco of this fraud?

[pip]

Originally Posted by ucLAkers

So as a BO community...what can WE do to start getting this hobby back on course? Should we start an anti grading campaign and make every card moving forward stamped? Whats the end goal?

First the FBI needs to dig in and a grand jury needs to hand out some indictments. We need a thorough housecleaning. Those responsible (dealers, principals of grading companies and auction houses) need to provide restitution and in many cases, go to jail. Then we need a company like CAC to certify the remaining population of cards, rejecting those that are altered and still remain in circulation.

That would be a good start.

[dustin42]

Originally Posted by T206Collector

Maybe I was giving the graders the benefit of the doubt. Obviously me being too generous.

If bush league stuff is getting through, then the proliferation of this issue truly is still only being discovered.

and I was banned and money stolen for talking about this by a grader.

https://www.blowoutforums.com/showthread.php?t=1314900

[dustin42]

Originally Posted by Rooftop

What’s the odds this guy comes clean and becomes the Canseco of this fraud?

Who? If you are saying Hawkdyansty think he is Balco.

[corndog]

PSA Cert #28766400

1966 Topps Larry Brown #16 - Population 1 of 3

Value gain of $346.32

This card was purchased by Ebay ID card-buyer from PWCC (Brent and Betsy Huigens) as a PSA 8 for $8.68 on July 10, 2017.
PWCC Marketplace link: https://www.pwccmarketplace.com/items/1515052

Same card was sold by PWCC (Brent and Betsy Huigens) as a PSA 10 for $355.00 on April 16, 2018.
PWCC Marketplace link: https://www.pwccmarketplace.com/items/1641218

Yellow circles are print, fiber, or chipping identifiers.
Red box identifies trimmed bottom edge.

[tier1dc]

[dustin42]

Originally Posted by dustin42

Who? If you are saying Hawkdyansty think he is Balco.

Just another fraud getting caught who is helping set records. Not homers, card sales.

[allstarcollect]

Originally Posted by corndog

PSA Cert #40758842

1969 Topps Johnny Bench #95

Value gain of $683.00

This card was purchased by Ebay ID card-buyer from PWCC (Brent and Betsy Huigens) as a PSA 8 for $377.00 on May 10, 2017.
***This sale does not appear in the PWCC Marketplace, but can be found in VCP. link: https://vintagecardprices.com/card/b...=&limit=999999



Same card was sold by PWCC (Brent and Betsy Huigens) as a PSA 9 for $1,060.00 on July 11, 2018.
PWCC Marketplace link: https://www.pwccmarketplace.com/items/1690243

Yellow circles are print, fiber, or chipping identifiers.
Red box identifies trimmed bottom edge.

Taking a look at how both cards sit in the PSA holder. It is fairly obvious that the trimmed card doesn't really "fit" in properly as there is definitely some room at the top. Is determining "most" trimmed cards as obvious as this one seems? Or is this just a very obvious example?

[jetscollector10]

Comc be like:

This-is-Fine-300x300 by Jon Glickhouse, on Flickr

[jetscollector10]

Oh, and I spent $3,000 with HawkDynasty's sale in July on COMC. So yeah, not thrilled to hear this news.