Is FANATICS in over their head?

[mfw13]

So....given that:

- Fanatics seems to be unable to get products out on time or without QC problems

- Fanatics seems to be unable to prioritize or focus, as evidenced my the mind-boggling number of unnecessary and ancillary products they are nevertheless trying to release

- They likely significantly overpaid for the MLB license and may be under financial pressure

- Their senior management has no experience in the sports card industry

You have to start wondering if this is all going to blow up rather spectacularly in the next couple of years, especially given that Fanatics will also be taking over the basketball and football licenses, thus tripling overnight the number of products they will need to release.

Because so far, it doesn't seem like management is up to the task.....

[MiamiMarlinsFan]

What does “blowing up” mean for you? Not making cards anymore?

They’re barely a year into this and are still ramping up. They’ll figure it out. Maybe not to everyone’s liking, but they’re not going away any time soon. That being said, I do think seeing a lot of products arrive late is here to stay for the foreseeable future.

[KhalDrogo]

It appears so. I’d say maybe Topps was a mess when they acquired them, but given how badly they botched zero cool, I don’t think Rubin has the right management in place to succeed the way he wants to.

[MoreToppsPlease]

They’ve more than enough capital to make things right.

Takes time to properly position a new ship.

Plus, we’re only talking about sports cards…

[ClevelandIC]

Maybe I'm in the minority but I see a lot of improvement in the last 3 to 4 months. I think Fanatics is making things better overall and I can see actual change

[ThoseBackPages]

i would like to see more product available everywhere.

[notoriousrmb]

This is equivalent to when people are calling products loaded or garbage after seeing one guy open 3 boxes the day before release.

WAY too soon to tell anything, give it a year and come back to this.

[hermanotarjeta]

Fanatics has nothing to worry about regarding product delays - the easiest excuse is “supply chain constraints”.

And as long as casinos are still making profits, fanatics’ target customer base will continue to purchase, regardless of poor quality control, redemptions, horrendous odds and rehashed designs.

[JeremyNick]

I think there are some much tougher times ahead. Fanatics put themselves at a disadvantage to start by buying at peak during the Pandemic. The high price, market drop and supply chains issue have already made it an uphill battle.

I think their mantra of “10 x” everything, ever is also putting the cart before the horse. We’ve already seen crazy growth in the past 24 months. They are trying to exponentially grow when they really should be looking at maintaining what has grown and stabilize. Pushing products out every 3 weeks, with QC issues and fatiguing everyone to death isn’t a viable long term solution. But, they have put themself in the position of needing to do that and I don’t think they see the danger in it.

What that means long term, I’m not sure. I don’t think they are in a good position to be the exclusive license banner carrier.

[ClevelandIC]

Originally Posted by ClevelandIC

Maybe I'm in the minority but I see a lot of improvement in the last 3 to 4 months. I think Fanatics is making things better overall and I can see actual change

I'm sure someone is going to ask what they are making better:

Topps Website:
- I think the website has been significantly faster and less captcha requirements.
- People are complaining that their second accounts are no longer able to purchase (Weren't people begging to make sure that a handful of buyers weren't buying all of the boxes?)
- They have raised the box limits per order. Instead of buying one or two boxes per order I can buy 8-10-12 of even popular products.
- Free shipping on orders over $100 - This had to be the complaint I saw the most. For example the Archives Snapshots (8 Box Order) would've been $24 in shipping before. This year it was free. That is a huge help!

Quality Control - The QC had no where to go but up but let's talk about the improvements
- The base cards from 2023 Topps were significantly better than most releases. Honestly, the best I can remember for base topps.
- Again speaking on 2023 Topps Series 1 - All of the card backs were facing the same direction. This isn't something we should have to talk about but it is better than before
- Communication is better. Getting responses to emails within days vs. within weeks

Redemption Process - while still improvable - We can now see the card scan before we actually have in hand. It also appears Topps is going to start using COMC for redemption fulfillments. This could lead to longer or zero expiration dates. Still a lot to see there.


The gluten of products being released is still a product of not being able to properly produce cards in early 2022. Of course we all wanted things to come out sooner but the reality is that they didn't have the materials to produce the cards. What other solutions are people offering? As soon as the calendar hits 2023 just cease all production? That seems kind of lame. I would miss out on 2022 SCC - one of my favorite products.

These are just off the top of my head. What has fanatics done that you don't like?

[hermanotarjeta]

Fanatics really should develop a loan/credit program - that would help to sustain their business and profits.

Breaker customers using a fanatics credit card for points and free bonuses - all at a 21% APR.

They would make a killing.

[ThoseBackPages]

Originally Posted by hermanotarjeta

Fanatics really should develop a loan/credit program - that would help to sustain their business and profits.

Breaker customers using a fanatics credit card for points and free bonuses - all at a 21% APR.

They would make a killing.

man, this is a great idea!

i could totally see this happening. tie in "early access" to The Breaker's Room when paying with your Fanatics Credit Card.

[mfw13]

Originally Posted by MiamiMarlinsFan

What does “blowing up” mean for you? Not making cards anymore?

They’re barely a year into this and are still ramping up. They’ll figure it out. Maybe not to everyone’s liking, but they’re not going away any time soon. That being said, I do think seeing a lot of products arrive late is here to stay for the foreseeable future.

What I meant by "blowing up" is that in a couple of years it become exceedingly obvious that they cannot fulfill all their contractual obligations to MLB/NBA/NFL thus necessitating a renegotiation of said licenses.

Neither collectors, nor MLB, are going to put up with products being released months late forever....

[notoriousrmb]

Originally Posted by ClevelandIC

What has fanatics done that you don't like?

- Rise in overall prices
- Long term plans to monopolize the hobby

As I said before, way too early to judge. However, I do not like the outlook that Fanatics wants to buy up all the licenses and be the one-stop shop for sealed boxes, singles, grading, breaking, reselling, etc. This just leads to corruption and takes any profitability out of a hobby that many choose to be involved in solely for the sake of making a buck.

I'm no fan of 'flipper bois' and bots and the race to the bottom club - but these are a big part of the reason card values jumped during the pandemic years. If Fanatics thinks that growth is going to be around when they are running all aspects of the hobby, they are kidding themselves.

Good for Fanatics on bringing more cards to the general public, but if they want growth and long-term buy in by a greater number of people, they can't keep it all in house.

[whitmm]

Originally Posted by mfw13

So....given that:

- Fanatics seems to be unable to get products out on time or without QC problems

- Fanatics seems to be unable to prioritize or focus, as evidenced my the mind-boggling number of unnecessary and ancillary products they are nevertheless trying to release

- They likely significantly overpaid for the MLB license and may be under financial pressure

- Their senior management has no experience in the sports card industry

You have to start wondering if this is all going to blow up rather spectacularly in the next couple of years, especially given that Fanatics will also be taking over the basketball and football licenses, thus tripling overnight the number of products they will need to release.

Because so far, it doesn't seem like management is up to the task.....

Fanatics kept all of the former Topps management and employees and is running as a subsidiary to Fanatics. The senior management has plenty of experience in the sports card industry

[MiamiMarlinsFan]

Originally Posted by mfw13

What I meant by "blowing up" is that in a couple of years it become exceedingly obvious that they cannot fulfill all their contractual obligations to MLB/NBA/NFL thus necessitating a renegotiation of said licenses.

Neither collectors, nor MLB, are going to put up with products being released months late forever....

I don’t see it getting to that point, but there’s going to be growing pains along the way.

[hermanotarjeta]

Originally Posted by ThoseBackPages

man, this is a great idea!

i could totally see this happening. tie in "early access" to The Breaker's Room when paying with your Fanatics Credit Card.

The model is already set up for them.

Have different tiers with higher discounts at higher levels of breaking.

Blue tier - 5% off all breaks/purchases of SRP, for all who sign up for the card.
Red tier - 10% off, $50k spent per year
Green tier - 15% off, $100k spent per year
Black tier - for the super high rollers - 25% off breaks/srp, $500k spent per year.

Put it on your credit card, pay off your debts through a card repurchase program where you have them grade it for you, then auction it off for you.

They can incorporate special promotions like a breaker tournament and prizes/more breaker credit for the top 8 break value winners.

The possibilities are endless.

They could even arrange for Uber to deliver free drinks and meals to your home, anywhere in the country for black card members.

Anything to keep their target audience engaged and happy, all at the convenience in their own basements.

And please, don’t make me go on with my ideas of a Fanatics casin, er “collector” resort…..

[Triple B]

Growing pains are real. I think there will be many more issues followed by solutions.

That being said, production runs will be through the roof, no matter.

[mfw13]

Originally Posted by ClevelandIC

What other solutions are people offering? As soon as the calendar hits 2023 just cease all production?

1) Cut back on 90% of the D-to-C products like Ben Baller & 1952 Naturel....keep Topps Living & Topps Now....get rid of everything else.

2) Get rid of all the "clone products" that utilize identical designs in different formats....Chrome products and Sapphire are the most obvious, but so is stuff like Opening Day. There's no need for a product like Stadium Club Chrome when you also have chrome inserts in regular Stadium Club.

3) Get rid of 90% of the high-end "auto-only, no base cards" products designed solely for breakers/gamblers

Basically, focus on releasing 20-30 really good products instead of 100 crappy ones.....

And simplify the manufacturing process by:

- getting rid of all relics....nobody wants them or cares about them anymore

- simplify auto checklists....no players on the auto checklist who aren't worth at least 50% of the box price...I'd rather have an auto checklist of 25 good players that are harder to hit than 100 mediocre ones that are easier to hit....nothing is more demoralizing than beating the odds and hitting a statistically rare card of a player who turns out to be worthless.

- simplify parallels.....have a black parallel in every product #/99, and other colors #25, #10, and 1/1. You don't need to have 10-15 color parallels in every product, most of which collectors consider to be worthless unless it's of a hot player.

Make the manufacturing process simpler, and you'll be able to get more products out the door faster.....

[whitmm]

Originally Posted by mfw13

Basically, focus on releasing 20-30 really good products instead of 100 crappy ones.....

Good luck getting the player's associations to agree to that, especially with them having a share in the company.

[ClevelandIC]

Originally Posted by mfw13

1) Cut back on 90% of the D-to-C products like Ben Baller & 1952 Naturel....keep Topps Living & Topps Now....get rid of everything else.

2) Get rid of all the "clone products" that utilize identical designs in different formats....Chrome products and Sapphire are the most obvious, but so is stuff like Opening Day. There's no need for a product like Stadium Club Chrome when you also have chrome inserts in regular Stadium Club.

3) Get rid of 90% of the high-end "auto-only, no base cards" products designed solely for breakers/gamblers

Basically, focus on releasing 20-30 really good products instead of 100 crappy ones.....

And simplify the manufacturing process by:

- getting rid of all relics....nobody wants them or cares about them anymore

- simplify auto checklists....no players on the auto checklist who aren't worth at least 50% of the box price...I'd rather have an auto checklist of 25 good players that are harder to hit than 100 mediocre ones that are easier to hit....nothing is more demoralizing than beating the odds and hitting a statistically rare card of a player who turns out to be worthless.

- simplify parallels.....have a black parallel in every product #/99, and other colors #25, #10, and 1/1. You don't need to have 10-15 color parallels in every product, most of which collectors consider to be worthless unless it's of a hot player.

Make the manufacturing process simpler, and you'll be able to get more products out the door faster.....

The problem with dropping products is the remaining products will become significantly more desirable and cause an even larger influx of price increases.

We can all agree that 2022 Topps Chrome might be the worst product ever. I am all in on the idea of instead of creating logofractor, sonic and cosmic chrome that you make your chrome flagship release significantly better. I think this is exactly what Fanatics plans to do. As people have said it is too early to really judge what Fanatics has done. We don't know what products or when anyone from Fanatics started having input or what level of input they had.

It makes sense that they would really start to implement change with 2023 products which I think I highlighted, appears they have.

The Art card boom was definitely something Topps was smart to create and continue to ride. Do we need any of the products that are still babies from that? The 1952 Naturel and Baller as you mentioned? Of course not, but we don't know what type of contracts were in place before. They may have signed Naturel to his own product 18+ months ago. Who even knows.

We don't "need" SCC but I like it 10x more than regular Stadium Club. I know I'm not the only one. Ginter Chrome? Zero interest and could do without but I'm not the only person who buys baseball cards.

I am on board with dropping all of the gambler type small one card products, zero interest. But, again, I know buyers that are only interested in those types of products. It is not because they are gambling addicts its because they have no desire for base cards of any kind. They want Auto's #'d to 10 or less of past and present superstars.

Every type of buyer exists. Opening day exists for low low end set builders. Transcendent exists because there are people with expendable income of numbers I personally can't fathom.

There is so much room for improvement from Topps as a whole that it is disgusting. But so far, I see steps forward.

[ClevelandIC]

Originally Posted by mfw13

1)
- simplify parallels.....have a black parallel in every product #/99, and other colors #25, #10, and 1/1. You don't need to have 10-15 color parallels in every product, most of which collectors consider to be worthless unless it's of a hot player.

YES - Please do this one! The changing of color rarity is mind boggling.

[Merkle14]

Originally Posted by notoriousrmb

This is equivalent to when people are calling products loaded or garbage after seeing one guy open 3 boxes the day before release.

WAY too soon to tell anything, give it a year and come back to this.

Best analysis... they seem to be making baby steps in areas topps really lacked that were obvious. Overall, impossible to judge fanatics takeover at this point. We will really see what they are like when they drop some big products based on price point and print runs. That is how the will be judged ultimately.

[TooManyCards76]

Look at the parent company of Bally Sports Network, they overpaid for several baseball markets and their competitors were scratching their heads wondering how are they paying this and going to be profitable?!?! Turns out they couldn’t, but it took 2-3 years for them to be on the edge of bankruptcy… I have no doubt Fanatics has deep enough pockets to outlast 2-3 years, especially with the savings they are getting from QC being non-existent (and thus not paying anyone), ramped up print runs, and more products than ever. But this will lead to less sales, lost repeat customers, the hobby shrinking and depending on the top 5-10% of hobbyists buying 80-90% of the product. Fanatics probably already knows they are on shaky ground. However, the retail sector is huge, if they can keep putting $5-$25 hangers/jumbos/blasters on the shelf maybe it’ll keep them afloat. Now I’ve talked myself into maybe they know what they are doing, if they lose us manbabies and we don’t buy the crap product but they can sell 1M of each flagship via retail they can streamline operations and shipping.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[rms13]

Originally Posted by mfw13

So....given that:

- Fanatics seems to be unable to get products out on time or without QC problems

- Fanatics seems to be unable to prioritize or focus, as evidenced my the mind-boggling number of unnecessary and ancillary products they are nevertheless trying to release

- They likely significantly overpaid for the MLB license and may be under financial pressure

- Their senior management has no experience in the sports card industry

You have to start wondering if this is all going to blow up rather spectacularly in the next couple of years, especially given that Fanatics will also be taking over the basketball and football licenses, thus tripling overnight the number of products they will need to release.

Because so far, it doesn't seem like management is up to the task.....

Topps wasn't getting things out on time before the acquisition and either was Panini. The president of Fanatics collectables has been with Topps since 2009 so they have senior management with experience. I don't think they start making NBA or NFL until 2025 or 2026 but definitely not overnight. . They claim that they solved QC and hired a lot of people for QC and customer service recently so we'll see how things change going forward. The main complaint I've heard here is about lack of release schedule but I think it's better to not announce a bunch of stuff then to announce stuff and have it come out a year late