Blowout's AL/NL Challenge
 

I've had this idea for a cool league in my head for quite awhile, and it's finally a good time to see if anybody is interested in making it happen. I have some details worked out already, there's some I'm not quite sure about yet, and there's others that I'd like to have owners help me decide, so I'll share the basic idea of what I'm envisioning and we can hammer out specifics where needed once the league fills up.

By joining this league, you are committing to [B]two separate[/B] fantasy baseball leagues. One will be an AL-only league, one will be an NL-only league. Each league is completely independent from the other, but each owner manages a team in each league. You are trying to place high in both leagues in order to be declared the overall champion for the year. By joining, you're committing to managing one AL-only team and one NL-only team. You can't join one or the other, or drop one team later on.

[U]Member list[/U]
1. [B]Chittychitty844[/B] -
2. [B]Chris Lyle[/B] - paid
3. [B]Cornerstore[/B] - paid
4. [B]Crossdog[/B] -
5. [B]Dbacksbaseball[/B] -
6. [B]Eckstein197[/B] -
7. [B]Hollywood42[/B] - paid
8. [B]Jstasyk1121[/B] -
9. [B]Ray27Ray52[/B] -
10. [B]Todderfield[/B] -

[URL="https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1FefCWtafTyKTjtnx4k5ZZSXDDvkGA1m2FNF4v4HPgZ0/edit?usp=sharing"]Drafts and keepers spreadsheet[/URL]

[B]2026 key dates[/B]
Payments and keepers due: Feb 28
Draft begins: March 1
Opening day: March 25

[B][U][COLOR="Red"][SIZE="5"]League details[/SIZE][/COLOR][/U][/B]

[SIZE="5"][B]Rosters[/B][/SIZE]

Each team in each league gets 19 total slots (plus 2 DL), broken down as follows-

C
1B
2B
3B
SS
OF x3
Flex

SP x4
RP x2

Bench x4
DL x2

[B]You must at all times have a full roster- full means you have at least the minimum number of players for each starter slot- 1 each for C, 1B, 2B, 3B, and SS, 3 OF, 4 SP, and 2 RP.[/B] You don't have to have them in your starting lineup, but you do have to have them on your team. [B]Having a player in an IL slot does not count towards the minimum[/B]- if, for example your only catcher gets hurt, you may either move them to IL and pick up a new catcher, or keep them off your IL. You can not move them to your IL and go without an active catcher. [B]Having a catcher on IL in the real world DOES count for your full roster, but only if you do not have them in an IL slot on your fantasy roster.[/B]

It is up to you to police your opponent during your matchup, same as the SP max starts loophole. [B]You have a 1 week time frame to point out instances of this rule being broken.[/B] If you notice the team you're playing against didn't have a 2nd RP for Wednesday of your matchup, you have until next Wednesday to notify us by posting in this thread. If it's been longer than a week, you forfeit your right to call out the illegal roster.

[B]If a team finishes the draft without the minimum number of players at each position, they will be sent to the bottom of the waiver order.[/B] If multiple teams do not have a full roster after the draft, the first team to finish drafting will be sent to the end of the order, then the next, and so on. They also must fix their roster by the time the first matchup starts to avoid further penalties. For all full/valid roster concerns, the position a player has listed in ESPN will be our source of truth. A player that will get 1B eligibility eventually does not count towards your 1B count until ESPN has added 1B eligibility for them. What ESPN has listed will be used to resolve all issues related to this.

If a team does not have a full roster during the season, their roster will be deemed illegal and they will earn no points for each day their roster is not full. ESPN will still count the points, but I will go in and adjust the scoring to negate points earned with an illegal roster if your opponent points it out. Personally this seems like an overly harsh penalty to me, but I don't see any other way to do it. [B]Because of this, you must be extremely careful with trades and your 2 acquisitions per week to avoid situations where you accidentally use all your FA adds and are stuck for several days without a legal roster.[/B] You have been warned.

[SIZE="5"][B]Scoring[/B][/SIZE]

[U]Hitters[/U]
Total bases: +1 (1 point per base)
Runs: +1
SB: +1
CS: -1
BB: +1
RBI: +1
SO: -1
Cycle: +5

[U]Pitchers[/U]
IP: +3
L: -5
QS: +4
H: -1
Shutout: +5
ER: -2
K: +1
BB: -1
Complete game: +3
No hitter: +20
Perfect game: +40
Save: +5
Blown save: -3
Hold: +2

Each team will be matched up against 1 other team in matchups lasting 1 week long. Whichever team scores the most points in the week gets a win. If the teams end with the same number of points, each team received a tie.

[SIZE="5"][B]Trades and Waivers[/B][/SIZE]

The AL and NL league are 2 separate entities, and therefore no cross-league trades will be allowed (you cannot trade someone on your AL roster for someone in the NL, or vice versa). This logic applies to draft picks as well. This is to prevent someone from scrapping their team in one league and creating a powerhouse in the other.

In the event a player owned in one league is traded to the other league, the owner in the prior league gets priority to add the player in the new league if they so choose. Using this priority to add the player in the new league would use a waiver claim in the appropriate league - if the owner elects to add the player in their new league, they would be sent to the bottom of the waiver order. Using this priority claim will not use a weekly acquisition. An owner has 48 hours from the time of the trade being made official (meaning announced by the involved MLB teams in the real world) to decide if they would like to add the player in the new league or not.

No matter the owner's decision, they must drop the player in the league that they no longer play in. ESPN does allow stats to be accumulated by players no longer in the appropriate league - should this happen, any points earned by a player after they were traded out of the league will be negated using league commissioner powers.

In the event that an owner elects not to use their priority to add the player in the new league, or if the player was not owned in the prior league, these players will be placed on waivers in the new league. This waiver process will be handled offline from ESPN entirely in our thread - this is to prevent glitches like in 2022 where ESPN sent cross-league traded players directly to free agency rather than them first being placed on waivers. All teams will have 48 hours to make claims in the thread or via PM, again from the time the trade is made official (announced by the MLB teams), at which point the team with the highest waiver position will get the player and be moved to last in the waiver order. As it is a given that multiple players may end up on waivers at the same time, owners will need to communicate their waiver order preferences - someone with the #1 slot in the waiver order only gets to add one player at a time before being moved to last in the waiver order. Same rules as waivers typically follow as in ESPN normally.

Here is an example use case to demonstrate: Say Mike Trout is traded from the AL to the NL. Trout's owner in the AL league must drop him from their roster in the AL. If any stats accumulate before that drop happens, they will be negated by adjusting the matchup scores. That same owner gets priority to add Trout to their NL team. They get 48 hours from when the trade is made official to make this decision. If they elect to pick up their "team option", they add Trout to their NL team and are moved to last in the NL waiver order. If they elect not to use their team option, Trout is placed on temporary waivers and claims will be made in the thread to determine who gets to add Trout in the NL. This same "team option declined" logic is followed for a player who, for example, is not owned in the AL league but then is traded to the NL

Players traded into a league during the season are also are eligible to be kept in their new league (provided they don't get traded back or sign to the other league in the offseason). Keeper cost will be based upon their original price in the original league's draft. Standard keeper rules apply, meaning no players drafted in the 1st round may be kept, and someone not originally drafted would start off with round 10 cost to keep. For example, in our Trout scenario, if he was originally drafted in the 5th round of the AL draft, and then traded to the NL, whoever picks him up in the NL would be able to keep him at round 4 cost the next year.

Players traded into into a league during the offseason are not eligible to be kept in either league. In the Trout example above, if that trade took place in December, he is no longer in the AL and must be dropped from team who owned him in the AL. In the NL he is not eligible to be added since there are no waivers/FA adds during the offseason. So, he would be eligible to be drafted in the next NL draft, but no team would be able to acquire him on their NL roster before then.

Trades will have a voting period of 1 day. 6 votes are required to veto a trade. This is only expected in cases of collusion.

[B][SIZE="5"]Transaction and Start Limits[/SIZE][/B]

Each team will receive 2 FA/waiver acquisitions per week.

Team team will have a max 7 SP starts to use each week.

Lineups can be set daily, locking individually at the start of a player's game.

[SIZE="5"][B]Playoffs[/B][/SIZE]

The top 5 teams in each league will make the playoffs. The format is such that the 4 and 5 seeds will start the playoffs with a play-in game. Playoff matchups will be 1 week long each.

For the 5 teams that miss the playoffs in each league, their season is immediately over after the regular season. ESPN puts together a consolation bracket, but this will NOT be factored into our final standings. The non-playoff teams final finish in each league is their final finish after the regular season. I.e, if you finish the regular season in 10th place in the AL, your final overall standing in the AL is 10th, and you get 10 points towards your overall combined final standings. You do not have the opportunity to finish higher than 10th in the consolation bracket. ESPN does not provide an option to disable the consolation bracket, but we are imagining as if the consolation bracket does not exist.

Consolation bracket games also do not count towards teams overall points scored totals on the season, which are used as tiebreakers in final combined overall standings as needed. Playoff bracket games DO count towards this tiebreaker, but consolation bracket games do not.

[SIZE="5"][B]Draft[/B][/SIZE]

The draft will be held online each year in a snake order. The draft order will be determined by a 2-step process. Picks 1-5 will be determined by a consolation bracket in the format shown below. Note that ESPN does not support custom schedules, so we will manually track the consolation bracket matchups each year in the draft spreadsheet. The winner of the consolation bracket gets the #1 overall pick, the runner-up gets the #2 overall pick, and so on.

[img]https://i.imgur.com/fzIJMWsl.png[/img]

Picks 6-10 will be determined by reverse final standings [I]including[/I] playoffs. So whoever wins the league will get the 10th pick, second place gets the 9th pick, and so on.

Following the draft, the initial waiver order will be set as the reverse draft order.

Please note the full roster rule- all teams must have at a minimum the following number of players eligible per position- 1 each C, 1B, 2B, 3B, SS, 3 OF, 4 SP, 2 RP. [B]If a team finishes the draft without the minimum number of players at each position, they will be sent to the bottom of the waiver order.[/B] If multiple teams do not have a full roster after the draft, the first team to finish drafting will be sent to the end of the order, then the next, and so on. They also must fix their roster by the time the first matchup starts to avoid further penalties.

[SIZE="5"][B]Keepers[/B][/SIZE]

Each team in each league will get 3 keepers per season. A keeper will cost a draft pick in one round higher than that player was taken in the previous year's draft. For example, if I draft Mike Trout in the 6th round in 2019, he would cost be a 5th round pick to keep him in 2020. This means that players drafted in the first round cannot be kept. The draft pick costs stays with a player for the full year. If they were drafted, that determines their cost to keep no matter if they were traded, added and dropped throughout the season, and so on.

If you would like to keep someone that was not drafted in the previous year, they will start off costing a 10th round pick. Players do not need to have MLB experience in order to be kept.

If, through trades or other transactions, you end up with 2 players you would like to keep that cost a draft pick in the same round, the player that scored more points in the previous season will cost a draft pick one additional round higher. For example, if I end up with Bryce Harper and Manny Machado, who were both taken in the 7th round, whoever scored more points between them would cost a 5th round pick to keep, and the other would cost a 6th round pick. In the small chance that they score the exact same number of points, whichever player's last name comes first alphabetically will cost the additional pick. So if Harper and Machado both scored 500 points, Harper would cost me my 5th round pick and Machado would cost me my 6th round pick. An alternative solution to all that would be for me to trade for an additional pick in the 6th round and spend both of them to keep both players in the 6th.

See the Trades and Waivers section for rules regarding players traded across leagues in real life. In short, they are eligible to be kept, and their keeper cost from one league follows them to the other.

[B][SIZE="5"]League Dues and Payouts[/SIZE][/B]

There is a $50 buy in for each owner each year. This $50 covers both the AL and NL leagues. Payouts are determined by the final overall standings, plus a bonus for the regular season champion in each league-

1st - $200
2nd - $150
3rd - $100
AL regular season best record - $25
NL regular season best record - $25

Final combined overall standings between both leagues will be determined by each team's final standings including playoffs in each league. 1st place in each league receives 1 point, 2nd place receives 2 points, and so on, with last place receiving 10 points. To determine the overall final standings, you will add up the points you got in each league based on your final standing. Whoever has the fewest combined points is crowned champion for that year (golf scoring, low score wins).

In the event of a tie in the regular season final standings, the teams tied for 1st place in the given league will split the regular season bonus evenly. For example, if 2 teams in the AL league finish with the same 20-2 record which leads the league, they would both receive $12.50.

In the event of a tie in the overall final standings (i.e. 2 teams end tied for first with 4 points), the tiebreaker is most points scored over the entire season in both leagues combined (playoffs included). If a second tiebreaker is needed, the two teams will split the money for the slots evenly.

For example, consider the following situation-

Team A- 5 points
Team B- 7 points
Team C- 7 points
Team D- 9 points

Team A gets the first place prize of $200. Whoever scored more points in both leagues combined, including playoffs, gets the 2nd place prize of $150, with the other receiving the 3rd place prize of $100. If both teams happened to have scored the same number of points, it will be considered a tie for second place and the two teams would split the 2nd and 3rd place prize money evenly 150+100 = 250 / 2 = $125 for each team.

[COLOR="Red"][SIZE="5"]Special COVID rules for 2020[/SIZE][/COLOR]

[B]These rules applied for the shortened 2020 season and are listed here for historical purposes. These rules are no longer in effect.[/B]
[LIST][*]$20 entry fee, $30 applies towards next year's payment (the $30 can also be refunded if you so choose)[*]1 team in the MLB must reach 40 full games played for our season to count. If no teach reaches 40 complete games, the full $50 will be applied to next year (or refunded)[LIST][*]I am not 100% sure how the rolling over will work logistically, but we will figure it out. Worst comes to worst I can refund everyone and we can do our usual collections in February[/LIST][*]Scoring format- Head to head but roto style. Everyone is matched up against everyone for the week-long matchup, you get a win for all team you finish with more points than, and a loss for everyone you finish with less points than. Standard rules for SP limits still apply. I will keep track of results in our draft spreadsheet as I don't believe ESPN can handle it outright[*]End of season standings in each league will be determined by W/L record. Tiebreaker is total points scored over the full season, second tiebreaker is a random. After setting the final standings in each league, we will use our normal method to crown the overall leader (1st place = 1 point, 2nd place = 2 points, etc, lowest combined point total wins). Tiebreaker for overall standings is total points scored in both leagues combined[*]The top 3 teams finish in the money ($110/$70/$30). The first place team of each league also gets a $15 bonus. Same tiebreaker rules as above apply here[*]Keeper values will not escalate next season. Costs will be the round they were drafted in this season, NOT +1. Prices will escalate again as usual the following season (2022) assuming next season is back to normal[*]Teams still get 2 keepers per league next season[*]Trade deadline will be August 26, 33 days into the season[*]We will bump up the max acquisitions per week to 3 to account for potential increased IL/COVID transactions[*]All adds, drops, and trades are final. If we get a week into the season and you trade Mike Trout for Gerrit Cole, and the next day the rest of the season is canceled, you still have Cole. This also means that if you drop someone sitting this season out, you do not get them back in the offseason as a keeper option. You must hold them for the full season[*]To account for opt outs and potential positive COVID tests, we will increase the available bench slots on each team by 1 space and add 2 more DL slots[LIST][*]We will do 1 quick additional round of draft picks to fill the extra bench slot for all teams that wish to participate, picking up the draft order where it left off. No trades of these extra picks, please[*]Players drafted in this fill-in round will start off as round 19 cost to keep, should that scenario arise[/LIST][/LIST]

I am interested. You don't really know me so I understand if you don't let me have a spot. I am looking for a better league, though, than my friend set up because I felt I was the only one participating on a daily basis.

For my understanding are you going to average the placement for the NL and AL team to decide the winner each week?

That's one of the things that we'd need to work out, how best to determine an overall champion. I kinda like the idea of awarding points based on where you finish (if 10 teams, 10 points for 1st place, 9 points for 2nd place, etc in each league), and the overall winner for the year is whoever has the most points. But we could also average what place each person gets in each league, and I'm sure there's other options out there as well

[QUOTE=bn2cardz;14273012]I am interested. You don't really know me so I understand if you don't let me have a spot. I am looking for a better league, though, than my friend set up because I felt I was the only one participating on a daily basis.

For my understanding are you going to average the placement for the NL and AL team to decide the winner each week?[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Hollywood42;14273096]That's one of the things that we'd need to work out, how best to determine an overall champion. I kinda like the idea of awarding points based on where you finish (if 10 teams, 10 points for 1st place, 9 points for 2nd place, etc in each league), and the overall winner for the year is whoever has the most points. But we could also average what place each person gets in each league, and I'm sure there's other options out there as well[/QUOTE]

Another thing since I haven't done League specific leagues. How is it handled if a player changes from AL to NL (or vice versa) during the season?

This really seems like it would be fun. I have only ever used Yahoo fantasy sports, but am excited at the idea of doing this if you allow me to join.

You know I’m in friend

I actually haven't done AL/NL specific leagues before either, but from what I hear, generally there's a few options for handling when a player gets traded from one league to another. I.e. let the team keep the player anyways to the end of the year, make them lose that player but they get the rights to add the players that were traded to the NL if they wish, and so on. Not quite sure how I feel about this yet, but given that we'll have both an AL and a NL component, another option would be they lose the player in one league but get them in another. So if I had Trout in the AL league but he was traded to the Phillies, I'd lose him in the AL league but get the rights to him in the NL league. Something that'll have to be clarified for sure, we can get to that when it's full and we have more input from everyone

Based on our conversations here already, I'm getting the vibe that participation wouldn't be an issue from you- I'm cool letting you on!

[QUOTE=bn2cardz;14273147]Another thing since I haven't done League specific leagues. How is it handled if a player changes from AL to NL (or vice versa) during the season?

This really seems like it would be fun. I have only ever used Yahoo fantasy sports, but am excited at the idea of doing this if you allow me to join.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Hollywood42;14273183]I actually haven't done AL/NL specific leagues before either, but from what I hear, generally there's a few options for handling when a player gets traded from one league to another. I.e. let the team keep the player anyways to the end of the year, make them lose that player but they get the rights to add the players that were traded to the NL if they wish, and so on. Not quite sure how I feel about this yet, but given that we'll have both an AL and a NL component, another option would be they lose the player in one league but get them in another. So if I had Trout in the AL league but he was traded to the Phillies, I'd lose him in the AL league but get the rights to him in the NL league. Something that'll have to be clarified for sure, we can get to that when it's full and we have more input from everyone

Based on our conversations here already, I'm getting the vibe that participation wouldn't be an issue from you- I'm cool letting you on![/QUOTE]

I am looking forward to it. I am looking forward to playing against people that may actually play. Having two teams should be an interesting twist as well.

Please put me down, very interested!

I am interested.

This is neat.... Yeah I need another league to take a title in.

Got you down for another league of disappointments :)!

[QUOTE=Cornerstore;14276785]This is neat.... Yeah I need another league to take a title in.[/QUOTE]

Glad to have ya here too

[QUOTE=todderfield;14276541]I am interested.[/QUOTE]

I'm going to add you to the waitlist for now. Like I outlined in the OP, nothing personal, but there's been several times in the past where I've let someone in with a low post count or low activity levels on BO, and they didn't do much of anything for the year. Nothing personal, I'd just like to give preference to people that are a safer bet to be active for the full year, and the only way for me to do that is go by post count. Happy to have you if we need space, but I'd like to kinda see how much interest there is in here first

[QUOTE=Grilledeggplant;14273443]Please put me down, very interested![/QUOTE]

I understand if you dont want to mess with the best ;)... but put me down for 12 if it hits 11 pls

As long as it's for money I am in.

I too would be interested if for money. I've played NFBC for six years and looking to diversify from the same scoring, same set of rules, etc.

Got you down, thanks for understanding!

[QUOTE=Grilledeggplant;14277329]I understand if you dont want to mess with the best ;)... but put me down for 12 if it hits 11 pls[/QUOTE]

Added you two with the paid condition

[QUOTE=Ray27Ray52;14277414]As long as it's for money I am in.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=christhecpa;14279047]I too would be interested if for money. I've played NFBC for six years and looking to diversify from the same scoring, same set of rules, etc.[/QUOTE]

Bump!

I’ll get in. I don’t really get what’s going on with whole AL nl but I can mock all the picks In any league.

I’d like to spend under 50. Anything over I’d not okay. I’ll also do if it’s free

I'd be interested but I also don't think I'd do anything over $50.

Since I didn't mention before, I'd say my cap is $50 entry as well

Hollywood, you forgot to add my name.

[QUOTE=Hollywood42;14272931]I've had this idea for a cool league in my head for quite awhile, and it's finally a good time to see if anybody is interested in making it happen. I have some details worked out already, there's some I'm not quite sure about yet, and there's others that I'd like to have owners help me decide, so I'll share the basic idea of what I'm envisioning and we can hammer out specifics where needed once the league fills up.

Here's how it will work- By joining this league, you are committing to [B]two separate[/B] fantasy baseball leagues. One will be an AL-only league, one will be an NL-only league. Each league is completely independent from the other, but each owner manages a team in each league. You are trying to place high in both leagues in order to be declared the overall champion for the year. By joining, you're committing to managing one AL-only team and one NL-only team. You can't join one or the other, or drop one team later on.

The details that I'm pretty well set in stone on are as follows-[LIST][*]Points league (exact breakdown TBD, I have a few good options to pick from), with head to head weekly matchups[*]ESPN ([I]maybe[/I] Fantrax if ESPN finishes their updates and things are terrible)[*]Some keeper aspect (open to negotiation for the exact total, but I was thinking at least 5-10 keepers per team per league[*]Snake draft (randomized order for year 1)[/LIST]
I'm open to discussion if this should be free or paid, though I'd prefer to keep it under the $50-100 range. Other specifics like roster breakdown, exact scoring, transaction limits, playoff settings, etc, I all have ideas on but will wait and see if this fills up or not so we can discuss as a group.

I'm targeting 10 different owners here, perhaps 12 if there's enough interest. [B]Preference will be given to members that have built up a reputation of being active with solid post counts and/or feedbacks, or members that I know from experience are active in fantasy leagues.[/B] Nothing against newer members, but I've dealt multiple times with members that are new to Blowout and join a league and then don't really participate, and that's just a waste of everyone's time and not fair to everyone else in the league that is being active every day. So while I'll keep track of signups on a first come, first serve basis, there may be an aspect of preference given to members that I know will stay active.

This will ask significant time from everyone as it's 2 leagues rolled into one, so I want to make sure as many owners as possible are going to stay active all year long, and what I described above is the best way for me to try and ensure that. If you do have a good post count but don't see you really wanting to commit to 2 separate leagues here, please consider letting someone else sign up. I really want this to be a cool, fully active league, so I'm going to be a little bit picky with membership in hopes of creating a fully active league

I'll keep track of members that are interested in a list below. If you are interested, leave a comment and I'll add your name to the list. When we have enough people (ideally 10, perhaps 12), we'll start having some discussions about rule specifics and everything- Other than what I outlined above as what I'd really like to be a part of the league, I'd like to get input from everyone so all members have input and are happy with it. I know that leaves a fair amount of details up in the air, but let me know if you have any questions beyond what would be discussed later on.

[U]Interest list[/U]
1. Hollywood42
2. bn2cardz
3. SethMurphy (max $50)
4. Todderfield
5. Cornerstore
6. Ray27Ray52 (if paid league)
7. christhecpa (if paid league)
8. 7jacfire (max $50)
9.
10.
(11.)
(12.)

[U]Waitlist[/U]
1. Grilledeggplant[/QUOTE]

never been in an AL/NL league. Can we trade between leagues?

We're up to 10 including Eggplant. I'll give another day or two for anyone else to note their interest and see if we can get to 12, otherwise we'll roll with 10


We'll discuss that and a whole lot more when we've finalized owners. Want to have some discussion on some things like that with everyone and come to a consensus

[QUOTE=Peties Army;14288787]never been in an AL/NL league. Can we trade between leagues?[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Hollywood42;14289699]We're up to 10 including Eggplant. I'll give another day or two for anyone else to note their interest and see if we can get to 12, otherwise we'll roll with 10


We'll discuss that and a whole lot more when we've finalized owners. Want to have some discussion on some things like that with everyone and come to a consensus[/QUOTE]

Got it.

Like I’ve said I’ve never done an al/nl only and this way is very different so I’m up for anything, unless it is freaky. I don’t get down like that.

interested

one more to go?.... lets go peoples :)

Look I’ll be honest the game itself, whatever it’s fantasy baseball it’s all the same, but I think the set up could be fascinating. Really so many ways this could go.

It’s very interesting

Still looking for one more

I'm in depending on buy in

Right on! What's your range? It's sounding like most people are good up to $50

[QUOTE=atoaz12;14302683]I'm in depending on buy in[/QUOTE]

Will the league be on ESPN?

That's generally where I like to play, but I'd like to wait to make that official as they seem to have taken away quite a bit of the stuff I liked this year. But not everywhere has opened up yet so I'd prefer to ignore that for now and we can hammer out the details of the league and then come back to the platform at the end

[QUOTE=Grilledeggplant;14302789]Will the league be on ESPN?[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Hollywood42;14302837]That's generally where I like to play, but I'd like to wait to make that official as they seem to have taken away quite a bit of the stuff I liked this year. But not everywhere has opened up yet so I'd prefer to ignore that for now and we can hammer out the details of the league and then come back to the platform at the end[/QUOTE]

Taken away? Why would they take away stuff?

Espn is an odd duck company

Have we thought about roster sizes yet? With 12 teams and just a 20 player roster (hypothetical roster size) that's 240 players for each league.

We need to be careful on roster size IMO. Remember that when looking at offense, 15 teams in each league in real life means that in the AL 135 players start every day, but in the NL it’s only 120. So I don’t think you want the starting lineups too deep with CI/MI/5OF/UT type stuff, just as a warning. You want some semblance of a FA market to work with as well as trades

Asking a few buddies I know how their AL only league is set up. I do think part of an AL/NL only league is it inherently being more difficult to put together a quality roster due to the lesser number of players available, but I agree that I don't think it makes sense to bother with CI/MI or more than 3 outfielders. Maybe 1 starter at each position (3 for OF), plus a flex?

Ray, you said you're in an AL/NL only league, right? How is that set up?

I would think a starting lineup that mimics the real life lineup is most accurate.

C, 1B, 2B, 3B, SS, 3 OF, UT. Not sure exactly on SP/RP or just P setup..... maybe like 4 SP, 2 or 3 RP spots, no general P spots?

Depth of the bench will be the big difference maker probably.

For pitchers, I was thinking 5 SP, 2 RP. With SPs, it's going to matter less how many slots there are (since with only half the league, it's going to be pretty rare you have more than 4ish starters going on the same day), and more what the max starts we allow are. In my full MLB leagues, we usually have it set at around 12 which is a pretty fair number, but I'm not sure how much the AL/NL only should effect it. There's going to be drastically less quality starters available, so maybe it doesn't matter as much if we drop that number. That's something I'm really not sure about and would like some feedback from others

As for RP, if we had 1 slot, that pretty much covers all the closers from the AL/NL. I'd say definitely 2 so some non-closers will be in play, but I don't quite think I want to bring it all the way up to 3. There's just not that many RPs in the AL/NL out there that are going to be good enough to make a difference in fantasy. I like 2 so that it's deeper than just the closer from each team, but more than 2 and it starts to feel like we'd just be tossing out random middling guys whose ceiling each day is 5 points and floor is -15. Think that'd just be really frustrating to everyone

As for bench slots, I'd love to have that discussion as well. Maybe 5ish, if we go with 1 at each offensive position, 3 OF, 1 flex, 5 SP/3RP? I'd like to create something where the FA pool isn't worthless, but you aren't having a roster crunch every time you make a move either

[QUOTE=SethMurphy;14304348]I would think a starting lineup that mimics the real life lineup is most accurate.

C, 1B, 2B, 3B, SS, 3 OF, UT. Not sure exactly on SP/RP or just P setup..... maybe like 4 SP, 2 or 3 RP spots, no general P spots?

Depth of the bench will be the big difference maker probably.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Hollywood42;14304308]Asking a few buddies I know how their AL only league is set up. I do think part of an AL/NL only league is it inherently being more difficult to put together a quality roster due to the lesser number of players available, but I agree that I don't think it makes sense to bother with CI/MI or more than 3 outfielders. Maybe 1 starter at each position (3 for OF), plus a flex?

Ray, you said you're in an AL/NL only league, right? How is that set up?[/QUOTE]

My AL only league is a different format for a couple of reasons.

1. There's only 10 teams instead of 12
2. It's a Roto league with no bench instead of a Head to Head

That being said here is our roster setup:

C, 1B, 2B, 3B, SS, MI,, CI, 5 OF, 2 Utility
9 pitchers with any combination of Starters of Relievers however there is a roster minimum of 1000 combined IP by the end of the season. If a team doesn't accumulate 1000 total IP they receive only 1 point for ERA and WHIP no matter where they were in the standings.

So that's 230 players total for a 10 team league. I will say from experience that FA is pretty much a wasteland of scrubs unless you are able to pick up someone while everyone else is sleeping. There are no waivers so it's first come first serve.

Thanks for the info. I'd definitely prefer shallower rosters to make the FA pool a bit more useful

[QUOTE=Ray27Ray52;14304796]My AL only league is a different format for a couple of reasons.

1. There's only 10 teams instead of 12
2. It's a Roto league with no bench instead of a Head to Head

That being said here is our roster setup:

C, 1B, 2B, 3B, SS, MI,, CI, 5 OF, 2 Utility
9 pitchers with any combination of Starters of Relievers however there is a roster minimum of 1000 combined IP by the end of the season. If a team doesn't accumulate 1000 total IP they receive only 1 point for ERA and WHIP no matter where they were in the standings.

So that's 230 players total for a 10 team league. I will say from experience that FA is pretty much a wasteland of scrubs unless you are able to pick up someone while everyone else is sleeping. There are no waivers so it's first come first serve.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Hollywood42;14304907]Thanks for the info. I'd definitely prefer shallower rosters to make the FA pool a bit more useful[/QUOTE]

No problem. I would say probably for a 12 team league you probably would want to cap it at 9 starters on offense, 6 pitchers, and 4 bench spots. That's 228 players. Still a lot but at least there will be some semblance of a free agency pool.

Here's what I'll propose to start-

C
1B
2B
3B
SS
OF x3
Flex

SP x4
RP x2

Bench x4
DL x2

That's 19 active slots per team, making 228 players owned in total. We can re-evaluate if we want to change this after year 1 if we find we don't like this, but it seems like a reasonable starting point

I like that setup

sounds good to me

Looks good Hollywood.

Out watching football all day with some buddies, we'll plan on rolling with rosters as described above unless there's any major complaints. I'll start the next conversation (probs scoring settings or keeper options) tomorrow morning

For scoring, here's what I'm thinking-

Hitters
Total bases: +1 (1 point per base)
Runs: +1
SB: +1
CS: -1
BB: +1
RBI: +1
SO: -1
Cycle: +5

Pitchers
IP: +3
L: -5
QS: +4
H: -1
Shutout: +5
ER: -2
K: +1
BB: -1
Complete game: +3
No hitter: +20
Perfect game: +40
Save: +5
Blown save: -3

This creates a system where the top few pitchers are worth more than the top few hitters, but pitchers drop of much more quickly than hitters so it evens out pretty quick. For those of you in the keeper champions league, this is the same system we're now using there, and it's not too far off from the point systems in the road to glory or redrafter's leagues either

Guessing there won't be many qualms about scoring settings, so let's also talk about keepers. Do we want any in this league? I think in this setting it makes sense to not have it be a deeper keeper league, so no more than 4 or 5 if we're going to do it. But if we do, what sorts of restrictions should there be? Is there a cost to keep? Can you keep anyone you like? Etc etc

I'm pretty open to this, but I do think there should be some sort of cost to keep a player each year. That'll create some turnover with the Trouts, Betts, Arenados, etc etc instead of them staying on one certain team each year. Given that rosters are smaller, maybe it makes sense to allow 2 keepers for each team? We could even make it 1 pitcher, 1 hitter, if we wanted. Interested to hear what others think

Why don't we do something like 3 keepers with no restrictions other than you can only keep a player for 3 years max. In my AL only league after 3 years on your team they become a free agent.

Sor for instance someone drafts Mike Trout this year. This would be his letter designation A year. Next would be B. The year after that C. After that he is no longer eligible to be kept and his letter designation starts over. Letter designations don't restart for trades. So if he is traded in his B year to a different team he is still a B player and can only be kept for one more year.

Hey just to make sure on this - im good with all settings so far but if a player gets traded from a NL to AL team midseason we still keep that players just make the adjustment on our other roster corrrect? In AL/NL teams have had players move mid year go to waivers but never had a league where im invested in both. Just asking because I can see Arenado be moved to a AL team mid season and if we were not keeping I wouldnt touch him with a 10 foot pole if he just gets thrown to waivers if traded out of league

Ah never mind. I'll go with the consensus on players being traded to another league.

[QUOTE=Ray27Ray52;14312549]I don't want to mix leagues. If I have an AL player who gets traded to the NL I should lose him.

The team who loses a player just gets first rights to the player(s) who they were traded for.[/QUOTE]

So if Arenado gets traded for Esteban Florial, Albert Abreu and Miguel Andujar. What if someone owned Florial and another owned Andujar in that case. I dont think that would make sense in multi player deals.

[QUOTE=Cornerstore;14312596]So if Arenado gets traded for Esteban Florial, Albert Abreu and Miguel Andujar. What if someone owned Florial and another owned Andujar in that case. I dont think that would make sense in multi player deals.[/QUOTE]

Yeah, I edited my other post after thinking about it. Hollywood already has enough stuff to juggle between all of his other leagues. We should just keep it simple.

I'd love to have a good conversation about this. There's multiple ways we can go about this. On one hand, we could have the leagues be entirely attached to each other- allow cross-league trades (i.e. I trade Trout from my AL team for Goldschmidt on my NL team), allow someone to pick up a player in the opposite league if they get traded there in real life (i.e. if I have Trout on my AL team and the Angels trade him to the Padres, I can pick him up in my NL league), and so on. Or, the leagues could be entirely separate- No cross-league trades, no rights to traded players as previously described, and so on

I think I'd lean towards wanting the leagues to be separate. This also will play into how we determine an overall winner each year, but I think I'd prefer to keep each league entirely separate so someone can't just sell out for one league entirely and trade all their AL assets, for example, to build an NL juggernaut

That said, I understand people not wanting to risk losing a top player because they're traded from the AL to the NL, or vice versa. But, there's ways around it. I believe most all leagues have the option for teams to let players finish out the year and still accumulate points. So if I had Trout in the AL league and in real life he was traded to the NL, I could still have him on my team in the AL for the rest of the season. But then I can't keep him for next year. That helps mitigate the randomness of IRL trades throughout the year, but still keeps some aspect of unpredictability that generally comes with AL/NL only leagues

I'll toss that out there as a possibility. As for players traded into the player universe, they should be put on waivers. So in the Trout example, he should be put on waivers in the NL league

[QUOTE=Cornerstore;14312546]Hey just to make sure on this - im good with all settings so far but if a player gets traded from a NL to AL team midseason we still keep that players just make the adjustment on our other roster corrrect? In AL/NL teams have had players move mid year go to waivers but never had a league where im invested in both. Just asking because I can see Arenado be moved to a AL team mid season and if we were not keeping I wouldnt touch him with a 10 foot pole if he just gets thrown to waivers if traded out of league[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Ray27Ray52;14312549]Ah never mind. I'll go with the consensus on players being traded to another league.[/QUOTE]

Ok I’ve been out of it but I just thought the whole point is we are running NL/AL league at the same time so to me thst would seem like the draft should be for the whole league. If first pick wants Trout and second pick wants freddie freeman seems like that was kind of the point.

And again since leagues are connected should be cross league trades and if a player is traded from AL to NL you just move him to the other teams

If we keep them separate that’s fine but then all we are playing is and NL and AL league. I’m ok with that but I just thought the point was to make them go together.

I don’t care on scoring keepers or whatever, I’m good with whatever Hollywood/league agrees too.

Is this head to head or roto?

Sorry I’ve been sick all of these things may have been discussed

There are 2 separate leagues, 2 separate drafts. That was the idea, at least. 2 separate leagues with the same owners in each, and final standings from both used to determine an overall winner. We can attach them to each other to an extent, but my core idea was 2 separate leagues entirely, basically

Head to head points, weekly matchups. We're still working on a bunch of the rest of the details

[QUOTE=Peties Army;14313625]Ok I’ve been out of it but I just thought the whole point is we are running NL/AL league at the same time so to me thst would seem like the draft should be for the whole league. If first pick wants Trout and second pick wants freddie freeman seems like that was kind of the point.

And again since leagues are connected should be cross league trades and if a player is traded from AL to NL you just move him to the other teams

If we keep them separate that’s fine but then all we are playing is and NL and AL league. I’m ok with that but I just thought the point was to make them go together.

I don’t care on scoring keepers or whatever, I’m good with whatever Hollywood/league agrees too.

Is this head to head or roto?

Sorry I’ve been sick all of these things may have been discussed[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Hollywood42;14313657]There are 2 separate leagues, 2 separate drafts. That was the idea, at least. 2 separate leagues with the same owners in each, and final standings from both used to determine an overall winner. We can attach them to each other to an extent, but my core idea was 2 separate leagues entirely, basically

Head to head points, weekly matchups. We're still working on a bunch of the rest of the details[/QUOTE]

Ok, well then my question/statment makes no sense! Ha Ha

Again whatever group decides I’m good with but I’ll vote if need be.

So far everything is pretty clear. Thanks guys for setting it up.

That is actually a cool idea for drafting you had! I think I'd want to save that for somewhere else, but it's interesting for sure

[QUOTE=Peties Army;14313717]Ok, well then my question/statment makes no sense! Ha Ha

Again whatever group decides I’m good with but I’ll vote if need be.

So far everything is pretty clear. Thanks guys for setting it up.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Hollywood42;14313944]That is actually a cool idea for drafting you had! I think I'd want to save that for somewhere else, but it's interesting for sure[/QUOTE]

I thought it was what we were doing, ha ha.

Basically it would be like owning a team in al and NL. Or if you could get 30 guys to own a team.

Lots of fun ways to do it.

I’m excited by this game

I'm just excited to get started!

[QUOTE=SethMurphy;14316348]I'm just excited to get started![/QUOTE]

Don’t copy me!

Bringing this back up once more. We'll plan on going with this if there aren't any major complaints or concerns. I do need to double check with ESPN just to make sure they allow players traded out of the universe to accumulate stats for the rest of the year, as their verbiage in league settings isn't super clear, but I'm 90% sure it's possible

[QUOTE=Hollywood42;14313474]I think I'd lean towards wanting the leagues to be separate. This also will play into how we determine an overall winner each year, but I think I'd prefer to keep each league entirely separate so someone can't just sell out for one league entirely and trade all their AL assets, for example, to build an NL juggernaut

That said, I understand people not wanting to risk losing a top player because they're traded from the AL to the NL, or vice versa. But, there's ways around it. I believe most all leagues have the option for teams to let players finish out the year and still accumulate points. So if I had Trout in the AL league and in real life he was traded to the NL, I could still have him on my team in the AL for the rest of the season. But then I can't keep him for next year. That helps mitigate the randomness of IRL trades throughout the year, but still keeps some aspect of unpredictability that generally comes with AL/NL only leagues

I'll toss that out there as a possibility. As for players traded into the player universe, they should be put on waivers. So in the Trout example, he should be put on waivers in the NL league[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Hollywood42;14318653]Bringing this back up once more. We'll plan on going with this if there aren't any major complaints or concerns. I do need to double check with ESPN just to make sure they allow players traded out of the universe to accumulate stats for the rest of the year, as their verbiage in league settings isn't super clear, but I'm 90% sure it's possible[/QUOTE]

Get 110% sure then we will talk!

I just wanted to pop in and say that I am following all of this and still looking forward to this. I think your solution for inter league trades is a good solution.

Oh and one more thing, Hollywood and I became best friends last week but don’t worry there will be no collusion.

Cool, getting the vibe that most people are pretty down with anything reasonable for settings. I'll continue to run things by everyone before finalizing, though, just to check

Let's chat about keepers. What are your thoughts on those? I wouldn't mind having a few, but probably no more than 3. And if we did keepers, I'd want to make sure it's not always just the top guys being kept year in and year out. To prevent that, we'd need to attach costs of some sort. Couple of ideas-

-keeper costs draft pick in round they were taken last year +2, players taken in first 2 rounds can't be kept

-contract system, i.e. player can only be kept for 3 consecutive years before being tossed back into the draft. Releasing to the draft resets the clock. This would work best paired with a draft pick cost

Anyone else have ideas on what would work best? I really like attaching draft pick costs to keepers because it makes it a lot more interesting and lets everyone find some value, and with only a few keepers per team it would still allow for pretty good parity

I like draft pick penalties, whether its round you draft them in or increasing rounds. If you do years you can be kept probably no round penalties in that scenario.


I'd vote for 1 batter, 1 pitcher keeper per league (so 4 total players between your AL/NL).


Would need a defined penalty for FA adds that become keepers as well.

2 Keepers per league, anyone you want. Can only have a player on your team for 3 years. If they are added as a free agent that is their 1st year.

I like the draft pick penalty, you lose the round you drafted a guy.

[QUOTE=Hollywood42;14318781]Cool, getting the vibe that most people are pretty down with anything reasonable for settings. I'll continue to run things by everyone before finalizing, though, just to check

Let's chat about keepers. What are your thoughts on those? I wouldn't mind having a few, but probably no more than 3. And if we did keepers, I'd want to make sure it's not always just the top guys being kept year in and year out. To prevent that, we'd need to attach costs of some sort. Couple of ideas-

-keeper costs draft pick in round they were taken last year +2, players taken in first 2 rounds can't be kept

-contract system, i.e. player can only be kept for 3 consecutive years before being tossed back into the draft. Releasing to the draft resets the clock. This would work best paired with a draft pick cost

Anyone else have ideas on what would work best? I really like attaching draft pick costs to keepers because it makes it a lot more interesting and lets everyone find some value, and with only a few keepers per team it would still allow for pretty good parity[/QUOTE]

2,3,10 I don’t care about total keepers but I like the thoughts above as far as keepers. You have to pay some sort of cost for a player

Oh and I think the value of a fa(it isn’t a penalty, people shouldn’t say that) is the 10 round. I think it’s just a nice clean number and then still gives value to people who get picks in the teens

Lets say-

2 keepers per team per league

Each keeper costs a draft pick one round higher than where they were taken last year (so you can't get lucky and get the next Trout for a 15th round pick forever). I'm even pretty tempted to make it 2 rounds higher

FAs start off at round 10 cost, halfway through the draft



If people like, we can add a stipulation that a player can only be kept for 3 straight years before they have to be tossed back. Might be tricky to keep track of though

[QUOTE=Hollywood42;14320677]Lets say-

2 keepers per team per league

Each keeper costs a draft pick one round higher than where they were taken last year (so you can't get lucky and get the next Trout for a 15th round pick forever). I'm even pretty tempted to make it 2 rounds higher

FAs start off at round 10 cost, halfway through the draft



If people like, we can add a stipulation that a player can only be kept for 3 straight years before they have to be tossed back. Might be tricky to keep track of though[/QUOTE]

I agree with this but no length of time they can be kept. Like you said to much tracking

The draft round penalties will take care of the duration someone will be kept. It's so unlikely to draft someone in say Round 20 that you are going to want to keep for 10 years because they turned into Trout...

Most of the time you are going to look at a player you choose to keep in say Round 8, who in three or four years costs a Round 4 and you have a new cheaper player to replace them with anyways.




Big question, what site are we playing on? ESPN doesn't let you assign Round Penalties to players as keepers. I'm not sure if Fantrax does, I think CBS might but you have to pay to play on CBS in the Commissioner leagues....

Let's plan on 2 keepers per team per league, costing a draft pick one round higher than where they were taken last year. Cost follows them if they were traded, or dropped and later picked up. FAs not taken in the draft cost a 10th rounder to keep. I'll toss out the idea of not allowing guys without MLB experience to be kept as well, to further prevent against someone taking Jo Adell, for example, in the last round and holding him forever. Doubt it'll happen, but adding that stipulation is a little nice

We could add a small prospect roster if we'd like, to make a small pipeline. Say each owner gets 5 prospect slots with no AL/NL attachment that have to be promoted once they debut or reach X at bats. That'd be kinda fun

I'm sure Fantrax lets you attach rounds to keepers, but I will check and report back. I think that might be our best bet. ESPN really hasn't impressed me after their update

Prospect rosters would be glorious.

I'd rather prospect rosters if we have them be league specific, so one player can't just stack five NL prospects.


My prospect vote is a maximum of 2 spots per league, so 4 total prospect spots. Can not put players in a prospect spot until they are affiliated with major league baseball (Draft, International Signing). Example, you can not add Shohei Ohtani to your minors roster the year he is eligible to be posted. Only eligible once he signs with a major league team. Same as draft players, can't add Casey Mize while he is still in college and not drafted yet



I think Fantrax offers specific minor league spots right in your roster as well. I know CBS does.